ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
When I first purchased my BeoLab 17 speakers I felt like the price was a little high. They introduced at US $3990 but are now around $4720. I no longer feel that way.
I was bored this weekend and I was wondering what else is out there that would be similar to the BeoLab 17 and the Essence Mk II. There is not a lot of hi-fi stores anymore so the only option near me is Gramophone. I certainly wasn't worried that I would find something better, but I was wondering what are the options the "other" people have to choose from (at least from the brands Gramophone has to offer).
Speakers
In their normal room i couldn't find any bookshelf speaker over US $999. I had to go into their serious room! There were three options:
Bowers & Wikins 805 for $6000
Totem Element Fire for $6400
Meridian DSP 3200 for $6000
I brought a CD with me so I was a little limited in the setup, so I only heard the B&W and Totem passive speakers.
The B&W didn't sound all that great to me (on the one song I played) It sounded like the low end was breaking up. It's really hard to explain it. The Totem I thought sounded better overall, but there were some characteristics of the B&W that I liked better. Not overly impressed with either.
I didn't get a chance to hear the Meridian active speakers, maybe later.
I would have to buy an integrated amp for the B&W or Totem, which seemed to add at least another $4000 to the system. (The McIntosh is $12,000!). I told them I wanted this for a bedroom system so large components were not that desirable.
Streaming Source
This is where the problems really seem to come out for me. I told them that I have all my music in AIF format in iTunes. There doesn't seem to be anything they can do for me here. No Airplay and no DLNA. They were directing me toward the Meridian Sooloos which can only handle MP3, FLAC, and WAV. I was told I would need to re-rip my over 700 CD's into the Sooloos system.
iTunes Ripping Is Bad
This would be desirable because I was told that iTunes does not rip CD's very well. There are errors that get read and the audio files are riddled with incorrect information. Sooloos was much better to acurately rip CDs. I was told that one of the guys there could hear the difference. I have a hard time believing this. I can see if you are ripping a scratched CD, that one ripper could handle it better, but the differrence is notable in audio drop outs and possibly noise. Not two seemingly ok rips sound differently??? I think this is just to push their system...
Sooloos doesn't handle video
I use my library to my two systems (three if you count my sisters A6). My BeoSystem 4 handles DLNA audio and video, as well as my Apple TV. It would be a huge inconvenience for me to separate these out, and besides I don't want to have to re-rip my 700+ CD's in FLAC, unless someone can prove to me of iTunes deficiencies. So far I haven't been disappointed, so I feel like it's better to leave well enough alone.
Bang & Olufsen *is* unique in the market
Granted this is only one stores offerings, but there are not any other store near me. The world seems to be moving toward internet streaming, so that is probably why there is not a lot of effort anymore in home libraries. But why no Airplay, DLNA, or even bluetooth streaming? I am very happy that the Essence was a perfect fit for me and it appears to be unique. Bang & Olufsen seems to have carved out it's own important niche in the market as I didn't see anything close or desirable. I just wonder how a store like Gramophone would handle a brand like B&O?
It didn't turn out to be as much fun as I thought! My appreciation for my systems have increased though!
Loved reading this Mark :-)
I think you can not judge the whole hifi market based on the experience of one hifi shop! Bang & Olufsen WAS unique and maybe they try to be it again - and I hope they will reach that goal.Here for example is a little choice of available networks players / streamers that handle Apple specific formats like AIFF, too. Not all of them. But I guess that's the problem of the proprietary Apple format. 1024x768
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https://www.cambridgeaudio.com/products/cx/cxn http://www.marantz.co.uk/uk/products/pages/productdetails.aspx?catid=hifi&subcatid=networkaudioplayer&productid=na6005
http://www.uk.onkyo.com/en/products/t-4070-58629.html?tab=Details
http://de.yamaha.com/de/products/audio-visual/hifi-components/network-players/np-s2000__w_color_variation/?mode=model
http://www.pioneer-audiovisual.eu/uk/node/199
http://www.denon.de/de/product/hificomponents/networkaudioplayers/dnp730ae
http://www.linn.co.uk/hifi-separates/network-music-players
There are more than enough speakers to choose from, too.
itunes is not the best for ripping, yes, I've experienced that too. Especially the sorting/grouping of music is not very good as it can mix up your library.Using AIFF does NOT mean that you have to re-rip all 700CDs again: There are converters and tools for those tasks available. Maybe the shop was not aware of that...!?
Always inform yourself sufficiently before judging...
TWG: Always inform yourself sufficiently before judging...
I think you may have read into my post more than what was intended! I was just interested to see what was available locally, and wasn't conducting a world-wide search! It was merely a diversion for some fun.
I appreciate the list of digital music players, and I can add Bryston to the mix as I was looking at that one back in the day before I had the BeoSystem 4 and had more of a traditional system, with my BeoLab 14's. My mindset changed when I purchased the BeoSystem 4 and I lost my desire for stacks of equipment.
My first point was I no longer thought that the BeoLab 17's were over priced. In fact I think they are a bargain now!
My second point I probably didn't make very well was at least locally, hi-fi shops don't cater much to people having their own library since the big trend is streaming content from the internet. I really perplexed the salesman in how to help me with my needs. The Sooloos is the closest thing that the Gramophone had that could come close to satisfy my needs. But at a severe cost it seemed to me. Since AIFF is not a supported format, the salesman recommended that I re-rip all of my CD's. He gave two reasons: If I tried to convert to another format, the meta data would most likely become corrupt. The second was iTunes was not that good in maintaining the integrity of the data stored on the CD. I don't know if there is any real proof of this, but if there is I would like to know.
I will be the first to acknowledge some of iTunes deficiencies in cataloging the music. I hate it when it uses the "Compilation" tag and it places the files in a different place, and when the database shows two or more artists on a given song, and what that does to the organization. I put in a lot of time making corrections, and translating my non-English titles into something I can read, like Kanji to Romaji, or Chinese to whatever google translate gives me! This is a great investment in time (and cover art scanning) I have in iTunes, something I really don't want to do over again. I have never used a utility to convert from one format to another, but what if some of the meta data gets messed up? Is it worth it for me to leave iTunes?
I really appreciate the fact that Bang & Olufsen chose to support iTunes Libraries with AirPlay, and almost everything else with DLNA. The Essence was certainly very easy to integrate into my home system.
Bang and Olufsen may not be totally unique in their products, but I think they are unique in their implementation. Just from my brief exploration, Meridian is similar in that they have active speakers, and Sooloos which is somewhat similar to the Essence I suppose. But the approach is certainly different. In my case B&O is more friendly to my music library. I'm sure I could probably get one of the players listed above to work in place of the Essence, but then I would loose multi-room... and the ability to use the Essence table remote in complete darkness! That may be desirable to some people, but I don't see any benefits outweighing the hassles. Again, my mindset towards equipment changed when I purchased the BeoSystem 4 and I haven't regretted it!
There are many high-end brands, and many of them require a purchase from authorized dealers. This usually limits the choices of what are available to people. It did require me to drive a great distance to another state when I purchased my Bryston DAC a while ago, so I am known to do that. Now that Bang & Olufsen stores are closing near me, it was wondered on other threads if having pro-partner relationships could work. I wondered that by looking at what Gramophone has to offer, and I think I see a uniqueness that Bang & Olufsen could fill, but that would require the salespeople to see that also. That might be harder.
Bottom line for me, I wouldn't give up my BeoLab 17 and Essence combo for anything that was offered at Gramophone.