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Beosound Balance - a few questions

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Stan
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Stan Posted: Tue, Jan 18 2022 10:56 PM

Lately, I've been thinking of replacing a gen1 BS2 (not the mp3 player) in my office with a stereo pair of Balances.  I guess I think I've been missing stereo imaging.  I have a couple questions about this:

1)  I believe that I've read on the forum that only the non-GVA version can distribute line-in.  I have a turntable connected to my BS2, and would like to continue with this connection, and I do distribute the audio to other devices from time to time.  This means I would need the non-GVA version of the Balance, correct?

2)  Stereo pairing requires the same type of device, right?  One can only stereo pair 2 GVA or 2 non-GVA devices, not a set of mixed GVA/non-GVA devices, correct?

3)  Is the non-Google stereo pairing reliable?  I've not had a lot of success with Chromecast in my house, but NL has generally worked fine.  I don't want anything fiddly.  Is there balance control for a stereo pair of Balances?  My main seating position is slightly off-center between the two speakers so a slight balance tweak would be ideal.

4)  The Balance doesn't support TuneIn, only BeoRadio.  Can BeoRadio be distributed to non-Mozart devices?  For example, if I'm playing a BeoRadio source on the Balance and I try to join a BS1 GVA, is this possible, or will I get "source not supported" on the BS1.  Any speculation about BeoRadio coming to non-Mozart devices or vice-versa?  I noticed that the app now shows BeoRadio stations even though I don't currently have any Mozart devices.

5)  Is it easy (and reliable) to switch from stereo to side mode?  That is, I know it's just a setting the app, but has anyone had issues with the setting "not taking" or having to reboot the Balance to get it back to from one mode to another?  I have a comfy chair to the side of where I plan to place one of the Balances, I'd like to switch to "side mode" when I sit there vs. hearing only the right channel, and then back to stereo when I'm back to my desk.  This is one of the things I like about the BS2's "omni sound".  It sounds nice no matter where I sit in the room.  Seems like the Balance has a solution, but how reliable is it?

Thanks in advance,

Stan

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I don't have the answers to most of your questions, but I can definitely answer #2.

You can pair a GVA with a non GVA. I have one of each. Now, I hate the GVA, and I'm probably going to sell it and get another non-GVA one, but the pairing works.  

Beolab 17, A9 MK IV (soon to be sold), Stage x2, H95, E8 Sport, A1 V2

Frederik
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Frederik replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 8:14 AM

1) If you connect the turntable to the Balance you cannot join on other devices, but you could still connect to the Beosound 2 and join on the Balance.

2) Yes, B&O explicitly states that both should be the same for native stereo pairing. I am hence surprised by the previous comment saying that it can actually be done... personally I haven't been able to test this myself.

3) From what hear it works very well for most people. I read some reports of people with issues, but I think this is mainly related to the network setup. It is known for example that B&O devices don't work well with mesh networks. In general, if multiroom works well in your current setup, setting up a stereo pair should work smoothly too.

4) Yes you can play B&O radio and join on the BS1 and also the other way around. B&O Radio will soon be supported on the older speakers in addition to TuneIn.

5) I'm not sure if I fully understand the question and I cannot test either because I don't have two balances. At least, switching form single mode to stereo pair in the app is easy and reliable. Personally, I would wish we would have an option to choose either Balance or the pair in Airplay or Chromecast without messing in the app, but this is currently not possible.

I could test a stereo pair of Balances last week and I was very impressed!

Csaba
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Csaba replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 10:44 AM

Frederik:

1) If you connect the turntable to the Balance you cannot join on other devices, but you could still connect to the Beosound 2 and join on the Balance.

Frederik, not sure if you have a different experience (it would be interesting to know!) but I can confirm from my own experience that this is not the case. You CAN connect the turntable to the Balance and then add for example - in my case - a Beosound 1 (which has no line-in) to the same experience. In the early beta of Beolink multiroom, which I was testing for exactly my turntable scenario, I could indeed only start with an old Beolink product and then extend it to a Mozart speaker. But after the beta testing, once Beolink had officially released for Mozart products, it did not matter any more which speaker I started with. I am thrilled with this since I have currently no old Beolink speaker with a line-in, so I do depend on the Balance fo be a "midwife" :).

Frederik:

2) Yes, B&O explicitly states that both should be the same for native stereo pairing. I am hence surprised by the previous comment saying that it can actually be done... personally I haven't been able to test this myself.

I have also understood it so that you could only pair two non-GVA or two GVA Balances in stereo, for example John from B&O Manchester has said this on his YouTube channel. I have got two non-GVA Balances and therefore I cannot confirm otherwise. I would assume that they have made the software work for either two non-GVA or two GVA speakers but while it may work with a mixed setup, it may not be supported by B&O.

Frederik:

3) From what hear it works very well for most people. I read some reports of people with issues, but I think this is mainly related to the network setup. It is known for example that B&O devices don't work well with mesh networks. In general, if multiroom works well in your current setup, setting up a stereo pair should work smoothly too.

Indeed, I have had my own thread here on the forum (search for the title "Beosound Balance - Issue with stereo pairing") regarding sound drop-outs in stereo mode on the right-hand speaker, while at the same time I have never had issues with multiroom on the same network. So I wanted to be a little bit more nuanced about a functioning Beolink multiroom potentially ensuring that you also have a functioning stereo mode.

In my thread you can read about all the troubleshooting. My scenario is two non-GVA Balances and a mesh wireless network consisting of 3 access points. After introducing the APs - and I only found out recently - my network names for 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz had been merged under the same name and therefore my Balances kept connecting to the 5 GHz. I was told by my ISP that 5 GHz has more performance if you are close to the AP but the 2.4 has more reach. I think it was a developer from B&O that actually conversed with me here on the forum, claiming the Balance should work fine both on 2.4 and 5 GHz but still recommended 2.4. I could later confirm that they both worked after my final troubleshooting steps.

So what was the problem for 5 GHz? Probably that I should have unplugged my entire network and left it to rest for a few minutes, before connecting to it again. I have also split up the network name so that my Balance could find the 2.4 GHz. Previously I had tested many different scenarios, and ultimately I had to make sure I had one network name for 2.4 and one for 5 GHz, and unplug and turn off network for a while. Since then my stereo has been working well.

Other than that I have not noticed any particular stereo-balance setting. I hope I have not overlooked something here. I should probably take a closer look though because I have a recollection that when adjusting volume, I could only adjust volume for the entire stereo pair, but when the Balances are in a multiroom setup via BeoLink, then I could adjust the volume separately. If this is missing for stereo and B&O thinks people need it, then it might be introduced later in a software upgrade.

Frederik:

5) I'm not sure if I fully understand the question and I cannot test either because I don't have two balances. At least, switching form single mode to stereo pair in the app is easy and reliable. Personally, I would wish we would have an option to choose either Balance or the pair in Airplay or Chromecast without messing in the app, but this is currently not possible.

Well, if the question is about pairing and unpairing, then it is something I have had to do a few times when trying to get my stereo pairing to work without sound drop-outs. The setup requires that you first have two Balances turned on, connected to the same network, configured as individual speakers in the app. Then you choose the menu (in Balance settings) for pairing from within the B&O app. Then you choose a speaker as your left channel, and then a speaker as your right channel. You can also play a test sound at this point. Then the app will "harmonize" the speakers, and then it is set up within a few seconds. Then the same menu will have a different label and I am not sure about the English version because I use it in Norwegian but you should see something like "disconnect the pair". This is what has had more varying result for me. I am not sure if it has to do with how "ready" the speakers are at the time of unpairing (like when I have to click twice on the Balance in the main list of products because of a delay or a first tap not reacting) or if it is a software issue, but sometimes I would experience an error stating that it was unable to unpair. Then I keep trying and the pair would still not unpair. What I then do is that I close the B&O app and try again. After a few attempts it would usually unpair. So a back-and-forth pair-and-unpair-repair scenario is not something I would do every few seconds. After all it runs on the network. I am also slightly hesitant to mess with this for the sake of knowing how well it would work and do more comparison between wireless vs. Ethernet-cabled. I guess the intention is that you would probably be more likely to leave your Balances one way or another, not keep altering. Otherwise I am not sure if there are software or rather network limitations in this regard.

What I also find a little bit annoying is that when you create a stereo pair, you basically rename the speaker from for example Speaker 1 to Speaker Set, while your Speaker 2 will merge into Speaker Set. Then when you unpair, Speaker 1 will stay Speaker Set but Speaker 2 will this time be called its standard factory name like Beosound Balance 12345678 (serial number). Then I would have to rename Speaker Set back to Speaker 1 and then Beosound Balance xxx serial number back to Speaker 2. I wish the original custom names would roll back.

One more thing I wanted to add was that in an earlier stage of my troubleshooting I could see that I could alter between sound direction modes even in stereo mode, so I could choose the speakers to play either in Omni-directional mode or forwards & towards me, but this was not working temporarily. After stereo mode was established, my speakers would be automatically set to Forward direction. But lately I could test this too and I could again switch between Forward and Omni. I don't use the modes for playing either Left or Right but I am guessing that as long as the app allows you to choose direction in stereo mode, then it doesn't matter which direction you choose. Currently it is working for me :).

I think the app sometimes does weird things. Not sure if this is because developers might change something in the background between version 1, then 2 and 3, but sometimes I would also see that charging case of my EQ would sometimes show the battery status of the case and sometimes not. At that point only the battery status of the earbuds would show. Maybe they change something in the code which negatively affects something that used to work, so that they then fix it and it is brought back again. Maybe not being able to change sound direction temporarily for the Balance was also something like that.

Very last thing I've just thought of: you can also swap around the speakers when already in stereo mode. Here I have not noticed any issues and as far as I recall it was quite simple and fast, but I have not done it too many times.

Frederik
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Frederik replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 10:53 AM

Csaba:

Frederik, not sure if you have a different experience (it would be interesting to know!) but I can confirm from my own experience that this is not the case. You CAN connect the turntable to the Balance and then add for example - in my case - a Beosound 1 (which has no line-in) to the same experience. In the early beta of Beolink multiroom, which I was testing for exactly my turntable scenario, I could indeed only start with an old Beolink product and then extend it to a Mozart speaker. But after the beta testing, once Beolink had officially released for Mozart products, it did not matter any more which speaker I started with. I am thrilled with this since I have currently no old Beolink speaker with a line-in, so I do depend on the Balance fo be a "midwife" :).

This comment was specifically for the GVA version, I think you have a non-GVA for which you can use multiroom with line-in indeed.

Csaba
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Csaba replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 11:02 AM

Frederik:

Csaba:

Frederik, not sure if you have a different experience (it would be interesting to know!) but I can confirm from my own experience that this is not the case. You CAN connect the turntable to the Balance and then add for example - in my case - a Beosound 1 (which has no line-in) to the same experience. In the early beta of Beolink multiroom, which I was testing for exactly my turntable scenario, I could indeed only start with an old Beolink product and then extend it to a Mozart speaker. But after the beta testing, once Beolink had officially released for Mozart products, it did not matter any more which speaker I started with. I am thrilled with this since I have currently no old Beolink speaker with a line-in, so I do depend on the Balance fo be a "midwife" :).

This comment was specifically for the GVA version, I think you have a non-GVA for which you can use multiroom with line-in indeed.

I indeed have two non-GVA Balances. Good point! I am not sure how multiroom works between a turntable, a GVA-enabled Balance and a Beolink-join from there.

I haven't tried stereo mode with my turntable either. That is a next step :). But I am guessing it would require a different cabling than what I have currently. Frankly my dreams have been fulfilled with my turntable connected to one of my Balances, from which I can join from other Beolink-enabled speakers. Anything else like stereo without turntable is a bonus. But most of the time I would use AirPlay to stream from my iOS-native "Music" app (not Apple Music) to one of the Balances and from there I would join the other Balance to BeoLink multiroom using the B&O app.

Frederik
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Frederik replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 11:11 AM

Csaba:

Indeed, I have had my own thread here on the forum (search for the title "Beosound Balance - Issue with stereo pairing") regarding sound drop-outs in stereo mode on the right-hand speaker, while at the same time I have never had issues with multiroom on the same network. So I wanted to be a little bit more nuanced about a functioning Beolink multiroom potentially ensuring that you also have a functioning stereo mode.

When you had the dropouts in stereo mode, did you try to unpair and then join on the right-hand speaker for regular multiroom? It would be surprising to me if the issue was stereo pairing specific, because technically for the network that shouldn't make much difference.

Anyway, I have an Orbi mesh and my setup is much more stable since I wired most of my speakers.

 

Csaba
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Csaba replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 11:36 AM

Frederik:

Csaba:

Indeed, I have had my own thread here on the forum (search for the title "Beosound Balance - Issue with stereo pairing") regarding sound drop-outs in stereo mode on the right-hand speaker, while at the same time I have never had issues with multiroom on the same network. So I wanted to be a little bit more nuanced about a functioning Beolink multiroom potentially ensuring that you also have a functioning stereo mode.

When you had the dropouts in stereo mode, did you try to unpair and then join on the right-hand speaker for regular multiroom? It would be surprising to me if the issue was stereo pairing specific, because technically for the network that shouldn't make much difference.

Anyway, I have an Orbi mesh and my setup is much more stable since I wired most of my speakers.

Practically speaking I am not sure how exactly you mean these steps would be timed or if the sequence of these steps would have mattered, but I did set up the speakers several times in stereo and several times as a Beolink multiroom setup during the same troubleshooting period. Beolink multiroom has always worked for me since its launch and on both Balances. I did not unpair and immediately join, but I did several factory resets, several stereo pairing attempts and several "Beolinking". That was before I even contacted B&O Customer Service, which was way before I reached out to this forum. During the entire troubleshooting time I was almost convinced that there must be something on the software side because I could not believe my pair of Balances would not work in stereo while there were never any drop-outs in Beolink multiroom using the exact same network setup. I should add that for troubleshooting purposes I would a couple of times test both stereo and Beolink multiroom using the two Balances within a time range of about half an hour. My network is pretty stable, so I cannot have been so unlucky that network stability would change exactly as I change between stereo and multiroom. Especially since I got the same stereo issue vs. no Beolink issue on several different troubleshooting days, so to speak.

I had never done anything to my network, up until the moment we travelled somewhere for Christmas, prior to which I had unplugged my home network. Then we returned 10-11 days later, then I plugged it in again, and at the same time started a dialog with the forum, where a user called c-larsen (most likely from the B&O software team) guided me to a solution where I had found my mesh setup to have the same network name for both frequencies. When I split the name into separate names (one for each frequency), stereo was working finally just as well as Beolink multiroom. Really odd that it was only regarding stereo but the above two network-related steps seem to have solved the stereo-pairing problem.

Frederik
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Frederik replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 12:36 PM

Thanks Csaba for reporting your experience, this is very useful feedback. Tracing network stability issues is very challenging. I have seen multiroom speakers taken an entire network down as well as network issues causing speakers to become completely irresponsive and requiring a hard reboot to function again.

Csaba
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Csaba replied on Wed, Jan 19 2022 12:48 PM

Frederik:

Thanks Csaba for reporting your experience, this is very useful feedback. Tracing network stability issues is very challenging. I have seen multiroom speakers taken an entire network down as well as network issues causing speakers to become completely irresponsive and requiring a hard reboot to function again.

I am happy to share my experiences in hope of being able to help others in a similar scenario :). I think that my thread is quite extensive, thanks to others having contributed too, so it will always be a good reference for "Balance + stereo". I'm really impressed with Beoworld :).

What you describe above sounds scary, I hope I will not experience any of that!

 

Stan
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Stan replied on Thu, Jan 20 2022 5:00 PM

Thanks for everyone's input.  It sounds like the Balance can fit my needs.  Given the pIanned placement, it would be very easy to hardwire them to each other and the router.  However, I never bothered to hardwire my BS2 since it works fine wirelessly.  

Now the only remaining question is whether they can fit my budget? Big Smile

Csaba
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Csaba replied on Thu, Jan 20 2022 8:16 PM

Stan:

Thanks for everyone's input.  It sounds like the Balance can fit my needs.  Given the pIanned placement, it would be very easy to hardwire them to each other and the router.  However, I never bothered to hardwire my BS2 since it works fine wirelessly.  

Now the only remaining question is whether they can fit my budget? Big Smile

You are welcome, Stan! I think it is an excellent speaker, so even if you pay a steep price for it, in my view it is worth all of it! Let us know if you have any more questions!

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