Beosound Level and JRiver

Looking for any help.

i use JRiver as a DLNA server. I also use the JRemote app to access in within my home network. I have an A6, A9 and an M5. JRemote recognizes all of these speakers and it all functions normally when playing an album.  Select speaker, choose an album and it plays through the album.

Just added the Level and have encountered an issue. Using JRemote was able to connect to the Level and select an album to play. Here’s the problem. The Level will play the first song and then stop. The only way to get it to play is to open JRiver app up and then it moves to the next song. That really is not a workable solution.

Also if I use the B&O app connecting to the JRiver server everything functions fine BUT without indexing available in the B&O app scrolling through a large music collection is not feasible. 

Wondering If anyone has any suggestions?

Much appreciated

 

 

 

Hi jgreen8240,

Unfortunately the DLNA standard is relying heavily on a "control point" (the app in your setup) to control everything. This means the DLNA renderer (the audio device) rely on your app to tell it what song to play. The app can only set one track to play on the device. This means after end of track your device waits for the next track given by your app. I have used "upplay" with my balance (also mozart based like your level) and it works fine. 

The DLNA standard also have optional support for "next track" so it could be that either mozart or the old platform doesn't support "next track" and the "JRiver" app only works with or without that feature. Or more likely it could be a bug in mozart handling of "next track" and B&O simply didn't catch it because of their test control points/apps handles it better than "JRiver". 

There're many, maybe even thousands of different DLNA servers and DLNA control points and all of which have a slightly different implementation. Could you try another DLNA app? Like "BubbleUPnP"? I know you mentioned it works fine through the B&O app, but i suspect B&O use a proprietary queue system. Simply because DLNA is quite limited and rely on being able to reach your app and that is not feasible. B&O have a big ecosystem and you can control your level through different B&O remotes, multible B&O apps and on the device itself. The DLNA standard has support for multible control points but it's optional and not wide spread.

 

I will investigate if I can find a bug on my balance and let B&O know :) 

Hi again jgreen8240,

I have now checked if my balance support "next track" with the tool "gupnp-universal-cp" and it doesn't. So it seems like the JRiver app doesn't handle that scenario correctly.

What phone are you using? You could see if it's the same on IOS and Android?
I think your best option is to try contact JRiver's support to see if it's a known problem.

Hope you'll get it to work :) 

I think that the OP wants to raise the point that while it’s DLNA Jriver setup (server and controller) works perfectly with its former B&O DLNA renderers (A6, A9 and M5), the Level does not support playing albums.

For me it looks like a different DLNA server service implementation on the Level (maybe on all Mozart based platforms) that is no longer fully compatible with the Jriver DLNA setup.

As DLNA is supposed to be a well known standard that has not changed a lot since years, I’m tempted to say that B&O may have not correctly implemented the DLNA service on the Level if not on all Mozart platform.

I agree it's most likely a different DLNA renderer implementation on Mozart based devices. But i want to point out even though the DLNA standard is well known. It's still a big and complex standard and have a lot of optional features. So it might be the old B&O platform offers a few extra optional features that the JRiver rely on.

I'm not saying the error couldn't be the implementation on the Mozart platform. But the core required DLNA features has most of its complexity in the "control point"/controller, so this is where it's most likely to find bugs. And OP mentioned it works fine while the JRiver app is open and it also works fine with the controllers i have tried. So it seems to me it works fine until OP's controller is closed/"running in the background". 

As far as I have read in the standard. The renderer only know the current playing track and it's the controllers responsibility to keep track of any playlist/album. So it could be the JRiver has a "bug" when it's running in the background, it relies on the optional feature like knowing the "next track". This is why i'm interested, if he have the same problem with other controllers and on other phones :) 

svendsen991 and mbolo01,

Thank you both for your very thoughtful and helpful responses. For context I have very minimal knowledge in this area. As a user I can make it work but basically know nothing about technical DLNA issues. Your answers though have given me a much better idea of the issue.

Highlighting that Mozart is probably the underlying issue for why my older B&O products work while the Level doesn't...that I get and agree with you both it is what I am likely experiencing.  

To answer some of the questions you have raised. I am using IOS only. I do not have any Android products. The products I am using are iPhone 13 and a mini iPad that is new. Both with the latest IOS software. Other things I have tried - LMS server and its corresponding app iPeng and I get the same result stopping after one song. Also tried another controller app 8player. 8player which uses my JRiver server. The result is the same stopping after one track. Based on what you both have educated me on this also suggests Mozart is the issue. 

With the information you have provided I did reach out to B&O support and they have said they would foreword to their development department.

Again can't thank you both enough for your help.

 

svendsen991:

Unfortunately the DLNA standard is relying heavily on a "control point" (the app in your setup) to control everything. This means the DLNA renderer (the audio device) rely on your app to tell it what song to play. The app can only set one track to play on the device. This means after end of track your device waits for the next track given by your app.

Sorry this is not correct. 

Simple said: if I start an Album and switch of the Control point off (or take my phone somewhere else)  the Renderer would always stop after the actual playing track. This is not the case.

Carolpa:

Simple said: if I start an Album and switch of the Control point off (or take my phone somewhere else)  the Renderer would always stop after the actual playing track. This is not the case.

Switching off the control point is that total power off? and take your phone elsewhere is it still connected on the same wifi?

I will point out i'm talking about the core features with only the required DLNA/UPnP features. That said there're many controllers and renderers that have implemented a couple of the optional features :)

I'm also a bit curious, which controller and renderer device are you using? :) 

jgreen8240:

svendsen991 and mbolo01,

Thank you both for your very thoughtful and helpful responses. For context I have very minimal knowledge in this area. As a user I can make it work but basically know nothing about technical DLNA issues. Your answers though have given me a much better idea of the issue.

Highlighting that Mozart is probably the underlying issue for why my older B&O products work while the Level doesn't...that I get and agree with you both it is what I am likely experiencing.  

To answer some of the questions you have raised. I am using IOS only. I do not have any Android products. The products I am using are iPhone 13 and a mini iPad that is new. Both with the latest IOS software. Other things I have tried - LMS server and its corresponding app iPeng and I get the same result stopping after one song. Also tried another controller app 8player. 8player which uses my JRiver server. The result is the same stopping after one track. Based on what you both have educated me on this also suggests Mozart is the issue. 

With the information you have provided I did reach out to B&O support and they have said they would foreword to their development department.

Again can't thank you both enough for your help.

 

Glad i could help :)

jgreen8240:

svendsen991 and mbolo01,

Thank you both for your very thoughtful and helpful responses. For context I have very minimal knowledge in this area. As a user I can make it work but basically know nothing about technical DLNA issues. Your answers though have given me a much better idea of the issue.

Highlighting that Mozart is probably the underlying issue for why my older B&O products work while the Level doesn't...that I get and agree with you both it is what I am likely experiencing.  

To answer some of the questions you have raised. I am using IOS only. I do not have any Android products. The products I am using are iPhone 13 and a mini iPad that is new. Both with the latest IOS software. Other things I have tried - LMS server and its corresponding app iPeng and I get the same result stopping after one song. Also tried another controller app 8player. 8player which uses my JRiver server. The result is the same stopping after one track. Based on what you both have educated me on this also suggests Mozart is the issue. 

With the information you have provided I did reach out to B&O support and they have said they would foreword to their development department.

Again can't thank you both enough for your help.

 

Glad i could help :)

Carolpa - thanks for weighing in.

My experience with the JRemote controller is different with my older B&O speakers (A6, A9 and M5). Once I select an album or a much longer playlist and hit play all it will go until the end no matter what I do with the iPhone.

jgreen8240:

Carolpa - thanks for weighing in.

My experience with the JRemote controller is different with my older B&O speakers (A6, A9 and M5). Once I select an album or a much longer playlist and hit play all it will go until the end no matter what I do with the iPhone.

Thats the correct way.

But I noticed also the same hick-up when music streaming to my Balance sometimes.

I informed B&o through the beta program for the Balance of this behaviour.

svendsen991:

Switching off the control point is that total power off? and take your phone elsewhere is it still connected on the same wifi?

Total off or take the phone with you (if the phone is the controller). The controller in DLNA/UPnP says to the renderer where to get its stream to play, then in principle its role has finished.

I have used all types of servers (Twonky, Kodi, Plex, Foobar, JRiver, etc) now I use solemnly Minimserver.

The same for controllers, but now I only use the B&o app, Beoliving app and Audirvana.

The renderers are different B&o NL Controllink devices.

Got it. Thanks again for your help.

Got it. Thanks again for your help.