Beovision 8 40 - How to adjust light sensor, white balance and get rid of the soap opera effect.

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gizze Posted: Thu, Aug 23 2018 11:34 AM

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EDIT:  I have worked all the issues out, hence changing the title of the thread. All info is on the first two pages. 

Hi All, 

I just picked up a Beovision 8 40 (MK1) with the idea of using it along with a sub as something to listen to the radio on which would be good enough music wise to replace amps and speakers. I thought if it beats a Play 5 Sonos that would be fine, and to be fair it does. 

The sound on its own is pretty good, with a sub plugged in it has exceeded expectations. The fact I can watch Sky news on it too is a bonus. In fact I have really liked it so have my Apple TV plugged in and decided to add all my Netflix, Amazon, Plex etc. 

So, here are my questions....

Is there away to adjust the aggressiveness of the back light? 

The room it is in is pretty dark, dark grey walls, dark wood floor, and the image dims down too much. 

I have turned off the ambient back light, and during the day it is fine, a little too bright, but fine. But obviously when it gets to evening it is too bright. 

If I turn the light sensor back on the image is far too dark, maybe for my room, but it is too dark to the point where it changes the whole image, colours oversaturated, gamma curve changes etc. 

So, just wondering if anyone found out how to make it less aggressive? 

Next thing is 60hz and the Soap Opera effect.

When fed a 60hz signal the image is so processed. Game Mode doesn't help at all. Anything in the engineer menu we can adjust while being fed a 60hz signal to stop this? 

Not the end of the world as I am in the UK so most content is 50hz based anyway, but annoying. 

Any ideas? 

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elephant replied on Thu, Aug 23 2018 11:50 AM

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gizze:

I have turned off the ambient back light, and during the day it is fine, a little too bright, but fine. But obviously when it gets to evening it is too bright.

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gizze replied on Thu, Aug 23 2018 11:56 AM

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On the remote press...

Menu > Menu > 0 > 0 and then Enter/Go. 

This brings up the service menu. 

Then go into Monitor. 

Picture Settings.

Then you have the setting for the ambient light, can't remember the name now, about the 3rd or 4th option down. In here you can toggle it on and off. 

It will activate when you leave the menu. 

You can also calibrate the image properly in here for RGB high and Low to get rid of the really cold push B&O tend to have. 

Take pictures before you change anything. 

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gizze replied on Thu, Aug 23 2018 11:56 AM

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On the remote press...

Menu > Menu > 0 > 0 and then Enter/Go. 

This brings up the service menu. 

Then go into Monitor. 

Picture Settings.

Then you have the setting for the ambient light, can't remember the name now, about the 3rd or 4th option down. In here you can toggle it on and off. 

It will activate when you leave the menu. 

You can also calibrate the image properly in here for RGB high and Low to get rid of the really cold push B&O tend to have. 

Take pictures before you change anything. 

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gizze replied on Thu, Aug 23 2018 3:59 PM

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OK, so got rid of the horrible video processing that makes everything look like it is being shot on an HD Handycam. 

MENU - then highlight OPTION - then press the RED button - then press GO. 

Under picture adjustments turn off FILM MODE. 

Now juts need to work out if we can adjust the sensitivity of the light sensor. 

Does anyone know who you remove the red cover on these that cover the sensor? Does it just pull off? 

I'm wondering if that would be enough to get it to be just a bit brighter and good enough.

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elephant replied on Thu, Aug 23 2018 5:40 PM

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gizze:

Take pictures before you change anything.

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Frederikjensen replied on Mon, Aug 27 2018 2:38 PM

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Hello do you know a good setting in the RGB white point setting because I also have the very white blue picture on my Beovision 10 and I looking more for 6500k if that’s possible 

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vikinger replied on Mon, Aug 27 2018 4:19 PM

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Frederikjensen:

Hello do you know a good setting in the RGB white point setting because I also have the very white blue picture on my Beovision 10 and I looking more for 6500k if that’s possible 

Potentially answered in the reply to your original post Frederik! Read that link, with all the warnings, before you try anything.

Graham

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Frederikjensen replied on Tue, Aug 28 2018 2:30 PM

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No it doesn’t have the answer 

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gizze replied on Tue, Aug 28 2018 6:30 PM

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I have turned off the auto back light, them reduced the BL HIGH setting to 320, this gives me OK brightness for day and night. I need to test again and see if that does alter overall backlight brightness, I 'm sure it did, but need to double check. 

To reduce the blue push just see what your settings are now and adjust white point adjustments.

Start with the gain and reduce blue. Depends what it was on to start with I guess. You may find Red or Green or Blue is on 255 already, so you will need to adjust from there. 10 point difference makes quite a bit of difference. 

Just take a photo of each menu before you change things. 

In the scaler menu I have reduced the Peaking to 06, that has taken away a lot of the artificial sharpening. 

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Frederikjensen replied on Tue, Aug 28 2018 8:10 PM

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Okay thanks

my settings:

red gain 255

green gain 254

blue gain 243

what about red, green and blue offset do you also adjust them or what?

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gizze replied on Wed, Aug 29 2018 11:52 PM

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My settings:

Red gain 255

green gain 240

blue gain 255

My Offsets are

my settings:

090 Red

057 Green

100 Blue

These I raised quite a lot as the dark areas were too dark, got a sort of weird black crush with lots of green in them. 

This has a much nicer, smoother gamma across the ire range. 

The other think I adjusted in the scaler menu was the flesh tone, it is now on 10. 

My ADC asdjustments are...

Offsets...

Red 124

green 116

Blue 135

Gain 

Red 058

Green 054

Blue 057

Auto black level 000

video AGC 001

Clamp 001

PLL 001

Then on the main settings I have brightness on the middle, towards right, contrast about 5 clicks from centre and colour around 7-8 clicks from centre. 

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Frederikjensen replied on Thu, Aug 30 2018 3:28 PM

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Okay thank you. 

How do you know all these settings?

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gizze replied on Thu, Aug 30 2018 11:46 PM

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I'm not sure what you mean? How do I know what settings to adjust? 

I have just been playing with the settings, I don't have a colorimeter anymore to test to see how accurate it is as I sold mine a while back, but I have had the screen next to my ISF calibrated OLED to compare. 

I have been ISF'ing screens for years, started doing it with CRT projectors, then with Panny commercial plasmas, through to DiLA projectors and OLEDs. I have some source material I know well to know I am pretty close to accurate. 

I do have certain issues with this set which to me seems to be in the software that B&O have implemented. The main thing is the greyscale does not track accurately enough across the IRE range, you can adjust at 30ire and 80ire (which is like most TVs) but there is very obvious green push in the 3-10ire range, if you dial this out there is then far too much blue in the 20-50ire range. There seems to be no getting round this. 

There is also a lot of noise in the lower ire ranges too, which isn't helped by the higher gamma in this region, you can up the RGB offsets and raise the gamma slightly but there is still noise in the lower/darker parts of the image and the problem you have then is the controls are coarse and then the upper/brighter parts are too bright. Also, adjustments in one area have massive effects on other areas, as in the RGB luminance etc. 

I have spoken with a couple of ISF calibrators about B&O sets and they have mentioned this before, and without being able to adjust RGB gamma, luminance, saturation, brightness etc. etc. you are in B&Os hands. Someone I know had the same issues on a Beovision 11 fairly recently. 

You can see the strange colour pushes in different ire ranges when you have say some pasty looking white guy on screen at the same time as someone with a bit of a tan and a black guy, the white guy can look a little blue, the tanned guy can look pretty spot on and the black guy can look a bit green. Haha

If you then adjust the set so the white guy looks OK the other two look out. This can be easily seen next to a screen that is correctly ISF'd. 

It is a shame as the areas it gets right are wonderful, I just wish there was some more control to get the image spot on. 

I have a Samsung panel still from the same era and that copes far better. Maybe it is more to do with the ambient light sensor and the way it adjusts colour temperature as well as gamma and contrast that it is designed like this? 

Anyway, it is what it is. There are tweaks to be made, but it does struggle with dark scenes, and in more serious ways than the fact it can't do blacks very well, which as I said is a shame as the brighter scenes are superb. 

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Frederikjensen replied on Fri, Aug 31 2018 9:24 AM

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Okay but It sounds like you are very good in this stuff so I believe I have a better picture now I have also think the screen was too cold on my Beovision 10 and I have always wanted a more red/warm picture like 6500k instead of 9000k I think b&o use on their led tv

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Frederikjensen replied on Fri, Aug 31 2018 9:24 AM

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Okay but It sounds like you are very good in this stuff so I believe I have a better picture now I have also think the screen was too cold on my Beovision 10 and I have always wanted a more red/warm picture like 6500k instead of 9000k I think b&o use on their led tv

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gizze replied on Mon, Sep 3 2018 11:27 AM

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Adjusting the offset for RGB under the White Point Adjustments makes quite a bit of difference to this set in the middle ire areas, more so than many displays. 

Changing RGB values by 5 points can make a difference, trying upping red and green first and see what you think? If it is still a bit cool drop blue by 5 points. This does change the gamma too. 

I would say the gamma is too high in the 0-20ire range (image to dark) and then too low from 20-100ire (image a bit too light). Without having a 10 point control this is a compromise, you can raise the Offsets slightly to lower the gamma at the lower end, but it also lowers it more in the 20-60ire range too which it doesn't need. 

For me, very slight tweaks in the RGB offset and gain can get the image much better/warmer. Plus everything can be put back so no harm playing, not in this setting anyway. 

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gizze replied on Wed, Sep 5 2018 8:13 PM

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OK, so sorted out the backlight issue. 

Under the service menu-monitor-picture adjustment menu you have Picture Offsets. 

These adjust how the brightness, contrast and colour reacts to the light sensor. 

I now have contrast on 63, colour on 28 and brightness on 30. 

I may have to play about with them a bit more, but Light sensor is back on and it is now working far better for me. 

I should add, these settings are not live adjustments, in other words you have to adjust and then leave the service menu for them to take effect. Hence I didn't think they were doing anything originally. The fact it tells you the amount of light the sensor is....well.....sensing, in that menu should have given the game away. Anyway, sorted now and well chuffed. 

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elephant replied on Wed, Sep 5 2018 11:55 PM

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beolion:

Looking forward to see your complete configuration change, I hope you will share a consolidated list of you adjusted settings.

Could be interesting to measure the screen afterwards

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gizze replied on Thu, Sep 6 2018 9:56 AM

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Edit: see post below.

This one suddenly appeared a few hours later. 

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gizze replied on Thu, Sep 6 2018 10:25 AM

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I typed out a long reply and it was lost. 

Once I get a coloromieter I will adjust probably for gamma and greyscale and post up my settings. 

Can we not attach images? It said it was posting and then.....nothing. 

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elephant replied on Thu, Sep 6 2018 1:31 PM

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gizze:

Can we not attach images? It said it was posting and then.....nothing.

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gizze replied on Thu, Sep 6 2018 4:45 PM

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Oh OK. 

What I said was…

I haven’t actually changed that much now. 

Once I had changed the Picture Offsets I actually put everything else back to where it was originally, with the exception of leaving Film Mode to Off. 

And then made some smaller adjustments. 

I now have the following…

Picture Offsets….

The number is the lowest it will drop to when the room goes dark. 

Brightness 29. 

This means even at the lowest setting I can still see the difference between 0ire (absolute black) and 1ire (smidge above black). 

Dropping to 28 means black bars get no blacker and 1ire is no longer seen, so too dark. 

Upping to 30 I can’t see the black bars getting any lighter, so might end up here. 

Colour 28

This actually reduces the colour a bit, but you need to when the contrast is reduced, otherwise everything starts to look oversaturated. 

Contrast 63

This is the highest it will go. 

This is like having the contrast set to 3 clicks left of middle with the light sensor off. 

This now means that when I have the contrast set to around 90% on the main user setting, it is plenty bright enough during the day and how I like it in a dark room. 

It could actually be a bit brighter at night, but then a bit too bright during the day, so 90% is a good position to leave it at just there is no fiddling. 

Since doing all this I have found the picture is much better all round. 

I do still think there is a bit too much green in the lower ire ranges, and too much blue in the very highest ire range. 

I have upped the Red and Blue Offset in White Balance by 3 clicks. 

This has got rid of most of the green push down low and also lowered the gamma slightly, which gives less crushing of dark detail. 

I have dropped the Red, Green and Blue Gain slightly too, this has raised the gamma slightly in the upper range which makes it look less washed out. 

That is it for now. I would like to get a coloromiter on it and measure the white balance at least at 30ire and 80 ire (which is the pattern that the TV outputs) and check the gamma. I like a gamma of 2.4 normally, but if the display struggles with dark detail a bit then 2.2 in the lower region is good with 2.4 up top. My guess is the Beovisions tend to be more like 2.4 at the bottom and 2.2 or even 2.0 at the top. 

Anyway, I when I get to borrow one I will set it properly and post my results. 

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gizze replied on Sun, Sep 9 2018 12:38 PM

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I still think it is better with the auto sensor off. 

It doesn't actually seem to dim the backlight, it just adjust contrast, colour and brightness. 

So you lose overall luminance but don't gain better blacks, which is sort of the point imho. 

Anyway, like it a lot. I will be honest, I bought it as a TV to sit on the floor and use to listen to the radio and Tidal, with the ability to watch Sky News and RT etc. occasionally. But we have ended up using the front room more and more with it in. So had to raise it up, sitting on some old speaker stands at the moment, and can't find a unit to fit it on that works in that room. 

So decided to move it on as I think I have done a deal on a Beovision 11 which will work much better aesthetically in the corner of the room. 

Have it advertised on gumtree silly cheap. 

But thought I would post some images of it with my settings as I know people like pics!! 

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gizze replied on Sun, Sep 9 2018 12:57 PM

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And one of the room....

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elephant replied on Mon, Sep 10 2018 10:59 AM

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gizze:

And one of the room....

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gizze replied on Wed, Sep 19 2018 10:34 PM

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Deleted this post as images were not refreshing. 

See below....

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gizze replied on Thu, Sep 20 2018 5:21 PM

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This is my set now properly calibrated.

I have now turned the light sensor back on.

This was after realising the ADAPTIVE BACKLIGHT settings also control the range the back light works in, well I knew that, but what I didn't know and what I didn't try was dropping it down to 0 on LOW. Dropping it lower from the default 113 actually keeps the contrast higher, so it doesn't get that 'ooh its too dark' looking image that Beovisions can tend to do.

So,  the contrast offeset is not at max, 63, and the adaptive backlight is set at 0-255 rather than 113-373 it was by default, so we still have the same range on offer, but even in a darkened room I now have an image that is wonderful, and in my room today with the light coming in it was plenty bright enough. Closing the blinds I could see it was dimmer after 30 seconds or so, but it was subtle and that is what you want. 

I guess these setting will apply across the range, I have gone from thinking this set is good but old and shows it, to genuinely being blown away but what it can do. I dragged my OLED in the room to compare and they are so similar now which is amazing really. The difference in darker areas and skin tones and just the overall performance between when I got this and now is stunning. 

Anyway, I saw so many posts saying "My TV is too dark" and "The colours don't look right" that I thought I would post this thread. Hopefully it will help some of you and not bore you all to death? Haha

Anyway, my settings...

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Frederikjensen replied on Fri, Sep 28 2018 8:47 PM

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Hello I don’t know if you want my question here or in private message but you also get it here. 

But my question is can I also use These settings for my Beovision 10?

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gizze replied on Fri, Sep 28 2018 9:06 PM

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Yeah I would guess so, they share the same firmware and menus as I understand it. 

I would take a photo of every setting screen before making adjustments so you can got back to where it is now if you need to. 

Let me know how you get on? 

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Frederikjensen replied on Fri, Sep 28 2018 9:49 PM

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I have now tried to change the settings but I rather like the more warmer picture. I think it might look like the original picture settings or is it just me? 

Also when black or dark scenes appear it makes some weird circles or something in the black 

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gizze replied on Fri, Sep 28 2018 10:29 PM

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I would leave the white point adjustment for now. 

Try turning off the Light Sensor, turn Peaking down to 0 in the scaler menu and see how that is. 

Then do things one at a time. 

Do remember to take pics before you make adjustments!! ;) 

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gizze replied on Fri, Sep 28 2018 10:31 PM

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It maybe the backlight adjustment that is causing issues in darker areas?

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Frederikjensen replied on Sat, Sep 29 2018 10:43 AM

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Yes I have taken pictures before. 

But which picture is it you want self. 

For my eyes is it because I think my Beovision 10 is too cold and too light/strong in the white picture. 

And want a more natural picture with a more warm picture. I don’t know if you also want that because then we maybe want 2 different pictures. You want one picture and I want another. If you know what I mean. 

But is it possible if we can chat on Facebook or Skype?

best regards Frederik 

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gizze replied on Thu, Oct 25 2018 1:41 PM

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Sorry, I wasn't ignoring you, I haven't been around for the last couple of weeks as I sold my TV. 

I didn't take a pic of the firmware version. 

What's different?