ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
I'll be honest - unless you're looking for BeoLink capabilities (you'd need a Core or an Essence MKII for this anyways), I'd probably skip the BeoSystem 4. I owned one and just got too tired of trying to work around its limitations.
When it was a contemporary product it did some really terrific things, but as one that's now fairly out of date in every meaningful way I can't see even taking one for free.
There are plenty of good AVRs with pre-amp outputs that you can attach B&O active speakers to.
For music-only sources, there is the option to set PICTURE OFF to TIMEOUT, ALWAYS, OR NEVER. However, you can't do this with the Apple TV source. A good solution would be to add an inexpensive speaker such an a BeoPlay M5 in another room. Then, you can add its sources for the BeoSystem 4 to access as one of the 2 available linked products under PRODUCT INTEGRATION. Then, you could could set the PICTURE OFF as ALWAYS.
FYI, BeoSystem 4 does have Deezer and TuneIn built into it.
I actually think the BeoSystem 4 is still a great product -- especially since you aren't using 4K yet. When you switch to 4K, you can just be sure to get a UHD player that has 2 HDMI outputs. My Sony UHD player does this and B&O made a PUC to control it.
Just saw the post from beojef, while writing my own.
Here goes my posting, since both posts might add something of interest for you.
There are lots of options using the BSys4 - many that you won’t find in most AV receivers of today (unless you go for something like the audio processors from Storm Audio or Trinnov). Alone the use of the Beoremote is worth it to concider the BSys4.
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@ BeoMatthe
Sorry, but I do not see the limitations - please be more specific…I want to know, if what you call limitations, might be something special that you need. In which cases do you see the absolute need for a Core/Essence?
There is a tv - and there is a BV
No, there is absolutely no need for an additional subwoofer, since that can easily be handled by the BL5’s (BL50’s etc), because of the bas manament options in the BSys4.
The ‘subwoofers’ in those speakers are more powerfull than the BL2 and you have two of them!
Have a look here:
https://bangolufsenassistentgohe.blob.core.windows.net/manuals/TELEVISIONS/BEOVISION_AVANT_2016_NG/Technical_Sound_Guide_1210.pdf
page 7/8.
(Since you have no bas management possibilities with you current 2 channel setup, you won’t benefit from the.1 channel when playing - what you hear is the 2 channel aka stereo signal).
MM
The Beosystem 4 was introduced in 2013 (basicly to drive the BV12 screen).
In 2018 it was discontinued, since B&O had changed the way they sell tv’s.
Nowadays it is part of the Sound Center that is sold and used with the BV Eclipse/BV Harmony….and contains no tv tuners etc. It is basicly a sound processor and a source/HDMI hub, that can be part of a B&O NetworkLink setup.
It is/was the basic part of the Beoplay V1, the BV11, the BV14 and the BV Avant series.
There are several threads here of how it is used with projectors and 3rd party tv’s.
As far as I am aware noone has reported severe problems with this standalone system - however, that can not be a guarantee that it could not happen at some point. And noone can guarantee that you could get parts for it in the unfortunate case.
It is long ago that it was last time updated - there is no need for any updates!
So - as with any modern tech product - you have to count in a risk…..just like with your BL5’s.
pauliander:If you are using BL5 or BL 50 as front speakers with a Beovision or Beosystem 3/4 there is no need any more for a dedicated sub (BL2) I presume. Has any of you tried this or does an additional sub make no sense anymore with these speakers?
Living Room: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-2 (Center), Beolab 9 (Fronts), Beolab 8000 (Rears), no Subwoofer. Screen: Sony KD-85XH9096Dining Room: Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 4000 on stands, fed by Amazon Echo Show 8Home Cinema: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-4 (Center), Beolab 1 (Fronts), Beolab 4000 (Rears). Projector: Sony VPL-HW55Home Office: Beosystem 3, Beolab 7-4, Beolab 5000, Screen: Sony KD-55XH9005 on Beovision 7-40 stand, ML to Beosound 9000 MK3 and Beosound 5/Beomaster 5 (1 TB SSD version)Bedroom: Sony KD-65XH9077, Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 6002 and Beolab 11 (all white, wall-mounted)
In storage: Beolab 5000/Beomaster 5000 (1960s).
pauliander:My wife will be happy as well
Maybe………..untill she hears what the BL5’s can do, when properly set up
Millemissen: @ BeoMatthe Sorry, but I do not see the limitations - please be more specific…I want to know, if what you call limitations, might be something special that you need. In which cases do you see the absolute need for a Core/Essence?
It's my opinion as a former BeoSystem 4 owner. I'm continuously surprised by what people are willing to live with and pay for so clearly YMMV.
If you think the internal music apps are usable then really the world is your oyster. There's no user interface you won't tolerate.
How do you AirPlay to the system? You don't. Or you AirPlay to an attached device that creates a delay.
How do you pass 4K video? You don't. You pass video AROUND the system and not through it.
If you do this, how do you strip audio out of a device like an AppleTV such that video is delivered to the television screen and audio is handled by the BeoSystem 4? You use some sort of wretched greeble.
Again - people have described cherished setups on this forum that would give me fits so heaven knows there's an audience for almost any nonsense setup, but to me there's no cache to a BeoSystem 4. It's not like a BeoSound 9000 where I'd keep it on display for its beauty alone. The BeoSystem 4 is an appliance that can no longer perform the majority of its functions with contemporary equipment. Simple as that.
BeoMatthew: Millemissen: @ BeoMatthe Sorry, but I do not see the limitations - please be more specific…I want to know, if what you call limitations, might be something special that you need. In which cases do you see the absolute need for a Core/Essence? It's my opinion as a former BeoSystem 4 owner. I'm continuously surprised by what people are willing to live with and pay for so clearly YMMV. If you think the internal music apps are usable then really the world is your oyster. There's no user interface you won't tolerate. How do you AirPlay to the system? You don't. Or you AirPlay to an attached device that creates a delay. How do you pass 4K video? You don't. You pass video AROUND the system and not through it. If you do this, how do you strip audio out of a device like an AppleTV such that video is delivered to the television screen and audio is handled by the BeoSystem 4? You use some sort of wretched greeble. Again - people have described cherished setups on this forum that would give me fits so heaven knows there's an audience for almost any nonsense setup, but to me there's no cache to a BeoSystem 4. It's not like a BeoSound 9000 where I'd keep it on display for its beauty alone. The BeoSystem 4 is an appliance that can no longer perform the majority of its functions with contemporary equipment. Simple as that.
I was just trying to answer the questions, that the op had!
Obviously what you expect - and need - is something different….which is totally ok.
E.g. he did not ask for or cared for any ‘internal music apps’ - he wrote that he will use an ATV.
As for your experience with delay when airplaying, I know of no problems there.
Passing 4K video and keeping the audio for the BSys4 is easily done with the right HDMI splitter…..should he ever want that.
This is more about how much worth the audio configuration options and the ease of use (Beoremote/PUC controls, NL support etc) are to you - compared to what a recent A/V receiver can offer you (integrated apps, newer HDMI versions etc).
The BSys4 may not be what you need - but that does not mean that other people could not benefit from it.
Obviously these threads have value beyond the OP's specific needs so it bears mentioning that the BeoSystem 4 is essentially non-functional as a modern AVR. It doesn't process contemporary audio or video, nor does it have internal support for streaming music in the modes commonly used today. Most folks would be better off with a high-quality AVR with pre-amp outs. I chose the NAD T778 and have been thrilled with it.
Understandably, if someone is so deep in the BeoLink Multiroom eco-system that a non-BeoLink piece would cause disruption then by all means... obtain the beast and whatever little gremlins you need to make it work.
I'd suggest investing in a good control system, if only for unified video control. I have Control4 with the Neeo remote and it's wonderful and has a very "B&O" feel to it. I expect the next gen will be even better.
What is the brand of your screen? I ask because if it is a Samsung 4K TV it does not have Dolby Vision -- which could pose a problem with the Apple TV 4K. I use an HD Fury Integral 2. It's very important that you configure the HD Fury splitter for the correct EDID. This is because the Apple TV 4K senses information about your screen over the HDMI cable. It also senses your audio capabilities. Since the 2 HDMI connects are sending very different info, you need to set the correct EDID to trick the Apple TV 4K into sensing the correct video and audio capabilities. To make this much easier, I bought the HDFury dongle that lets you program these via an iphone app over bluetooth. HBO Max on the Apple TV 4K causes me problems because it thinks my Samsung TV should be capable of Dolby Vision when it isn't. So I get a blank screen when playing 4K movies on HBO Max. I don't have this problem with the apps on the Apple TV. Even with the correct EDID, this is still an issue.HBO Max will not give you an option to play the 1080p version when it thinks you have a 4K screen.
I think that you'll still want an HDMI connection between the BeoSystem 4 and your screen. You need this to be able to manage all of the BS4 settings and to get the menu overlay on non-4K sources.I think the BS4 will even get upset with you if you don't have it connected to a screen.
I actually have TWO Apple TVs connected to my BS4: one for when I watch the rare 4K content and another for non-4K content. I find that I use the 1080p Apple TV 95 percent of the time!
Something else to keep in mind is that many 4K UHD players will not play DVD properly. Therefore, if you still have a DVD library, you might want a UHD player AND a bu-ray player.
The Apple TV's PUC tells the BS4 that it's a video source, so you can't set it to come on without turning the screen on. You CAN, however, set audio sources to play without turning on the screen. Therefore, you could connect an Apple TV or Airport express the the BS4 and use a PUC for an audio source and possibly get the source to play without turning on the screen.
You asked about automating switching between HDMI inputs of your screen. I do this with a BeoLink Gateway and a Global Cache iTach. You can write macros in the BLGW to have the iTach send out IR commands to switch the HDMI inputs on your screen based on which source is playing. It's a costly solution, but you asked!
beojeff:What is the brand of your screen? I ask because if it is a Samsung 4K TV it does not have Dolby Vision -- which could pose a problem with the Apple TV 4K. I use an HD Fury Integral 2. It's very important that you configure the HD Fury splitter for the correct EDID. This is because the Apple TV 4K senses information about your screen over the HDMI cable. It also senses your audio capabilities. Since the 2 HDMI connects are sending very different info, you need to set the correct EDID to trick the Apple TV 4K into sensing the correct video and audio capabilities. To make this much easier, I bought the HDFury dongle that lets you program these via an iphone app over bluetooth. HBO Max on the Apple TV 4K causes me problems because it thinks my Samsung TV should be capable of Dolby Vision when it isn't. So I get a blank screen when playing 4K movies on HBO Max. I don't have this problem with the apps on the Apple TV. Even with the correct EDID, this is still an issue.HBO Max will not give you an option to play the 1080p version when it thinks you have a 4K screen. I think that you'll still want an HDMI connection between the BeoSystem 4 and your screen. You need this to be able to manage all of the BS4 settings and to get the menu overlay on non-4K sources.I think the BS4 will even get upset with you if you don't have it connected to a screen. I actually have TWO Apple TVs connected to my BS4: one for when I watch the rare 4K content and another for non-4K content. I find that I use the 1080p Apple TV 95 percent of the time! Something else to keep in mind is that many 4K UHD players will not play DVD properly. Therefore, if you still have a DVD library, you might want a UHD player AND a bu-ray player. The Apple TV's PUC tells the BS4 that it's a video source, so you can't set it to come on without turning the screen on. You CAN, however, set audio sources to play without turning on the screen. Therefore, you could connect an Apple TV or Airport express the the BS4 and use a PUC for an audio source and possibly get the source to play without turning on the screen. You asked about automating switching between HDMI inputs of your screen. I do this with a BeoLink Gateway and a Global Cache iTach. You can write macros in the BLGW to have the iTach send out IR commands to switch the HDMI inputs on your screen based on which source is playing. It's a costly solution, but you asked!
Thanks for explaining, well understood! I have looked to the instruction movie of AVR Key and via the GoBlu dongle you can set-up audio and video settings as well, albeit more basically. For video there are 2 EDID choices: 1/ 4K SDR and 2/ 4K HDR while for audio there are 3 choices: 1/ automatic detection of audio mode (adviced) 2/ force all audio to go through and 3/ only stereo mode. I believe it could work and send the required info to the Apple tv! If not I will go for the Integra 2.
I also understand your remark on the use of apple tv and music choice for Beosystem 4 without turning the screen on. I will try and see how it works with some PUC’s.
Thanks a lot 😉
You might want to sent an email to HDFury. They are very fast in responding! They're very fast in shipping, too. I'm concerned about you not being able to be more specific with the EDID. There are quite a few choices. For the first year that I had mine, I did not have the EDID set up exactly correctly. When I modified it, the video become stunningly more beautiful. I was also having problems with Disney+ before I modified the EDID.
I actually use one Apple TV connected completely to BeoSystem 4 for 1080p. I just use the Apple TV 4K for the rare 4K content. (5% of the time.) So I have 2 Apple TVs. The reason is that the Apple TV 4K sometimes will NOT work with 4K based on your EDID and will not give the option to go to 1080p. Like I said with HBO Max. The Apple TV 4K takes control based on the HDMI capabilities detected -- which is not always correct. This is a small investment of cost to get 2 Apple TVs and is well worth it.
beojeff:I actually use one Apple TV connected completely to BeoSystem 4 for 1080p. I just use the Apple TV 4K for the rare 4K content. (5% of the time.) So I have 2 Apple TVs. The reason is that the Apple TV 4K sometimes will NOT work with 4K based on your EDID and will not give the option to go to 1080p. Like I said with HBO Max. The Apple TV 4K takes control based on the HDMI capabilities detected -- which is not always correct. This is a small investment of cost to get 2 Apple TVs and is well worth it.
pauliander: beojeff: I actually use one Apple TV connected completely to BeoSystem 4 for 1080p. I just use the Apple TV 4K for the rare 4K content. (5% of the time.) So I have 2 Apple TVs. The reason is that the Apple TV 4K sometimes will NOT work with 4K based on your EDID and will not give the option to go to 1080p. Like I said with HBO Max. The Apple TV 4K takes control based on the HDMI capabilities detected -- which is not always correct. This is a small investment of cost to get 2 Apple TVs and is well worth it. Agreed, that seems a practical solution and I see why you need the 2 different outputs of the Integral 2. I presume that you are using IR command with PUC’s to control both apple tv’s via Beosystem? Sorry for all those questions but the sky becomes clearer
beojeff: I actually use one Apple TV connected completely to BeoSystem 4 for 1080p. I just use the Apple TV 4K for the rare 4K content. (5% of the time.) So I have 2 Apple TVs. The reason is that the Apple TV 4K sometimes will NOT work with 4K based on your EDID and will not give the option to go to 1080p. Like I said with HBO Max. The Apple TV 4K takes control based on the HDMI capabilities detected -- which is not always correct. This is a small investment of cost to get 2 Apple TVs and is well worth it.
Agreed, that seems a practical solution and I see why you need the 2 different outputs of the Integral 2. I presume that you are using IR command with PUC’s to control both apple tv’s via Beosystem? Sorry for all those questions but the sky becomes clearer
Right. The IR PUC provides control of the Apple TV so you just need your one BeoRemote One remote
I have a Sony UBP-X800b UHD player that has dual HDMI outputs. B&O wrote a PUC for it for me so that it cn be controlled. There is a HUGE boost in audio quality when playing discs compared to streaming. This is something you would especially notice with your BeoLab 5 speakers. Top Gun and Airforce One sound amazing.Game of Thrones on UHD 4K is also a feast for the eyes and ears.
FYI, the BeoRemote Halo now can control the BeoSystem 4. It's really great having it on the side table to adjust the volume by turning the halo wheel with your hand.
pauliander:Just by curiosity, how is the Sony UHD player installed? Since it has 2 outputs, the video output directly to the screen and the audio one to the Beosystem? No need for the HDFuRy here? You have made me interested given the boost in audio quality you mentioned
That's correct. Having dual HDMI connections avoids the need for an HDMI splitter for that device.