ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
I just received a very nice (cosmetically) TX2 turntable off Ebay.
It looks like it was packed well enough, locked cartridge in a pill bottle with foam. The tone armys were not taped but were pushed down in place from bubble wrap in the lid area.
The issues.
1. It powers up and spins but I can't lift the tone arm or move it side to side. Also can't shut it off, have to unplug it. The 33/45 buttons work. Tone arm seems floppy, maybe a belt?
2. MMC2 - I put it on a 8002 I own and it sounded very distorted. The needle seems intact, if I push on it the suspension seems stiff. Maybe worn out suspension? It is possible it was damage when he removed it because of the angle to remove it and he did not have the guard down in the bottle in was shipped in.
Is this thing worth fixing? I paid 530 for it mostly because of the mmc2.
I think the mmc2 could be repaired for like 250.00 or so. But then would need to fix table too.
I think you paid to much $ or Euro's for this machine in non working condition especially if you add the cost for repairing the unit and MMC2.
Brengen & Ophalen
Yes I agree, I was suppose to be working fine. So I can get refund or maybe a partial refund.
Seems many people that own these turntables don't understand basic packing and cartridge protection measures. It was in USA dollars not Euros.
Try to get a refund, it's not worth the money you paid for it for a non working TX. Seems that lots of B&O stuff in the US is a bit overpriced.
Well I did get a BEO 8002 with mmc2 for 200.00 in US. The TX2 was for my son and was suppose to me in great shape. MMC2s are a bit rare and yes I think overpriced. I dunno why, I really like B&O turntables. Probably the 8002 best, have a nice RX2 tone arm model that works great.
If the tonearm is not secured properly the pin in the middle of the pic, may be broken, a "normal " failure if packing is done badly. The tonearm hangs low and wobbles all over the place. And yes you payed too much for a non working deck. A MMC2 repair is some Euros 180.00 by Axel.
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
I'll second what Leslie said - you greatly overpaid for it ($560 with shipping) - even if it was in perfect working condition. 'Looks quite pristine tho, and the tone arm isn't drooping in the photo. He states in his auction that he tested it - I wonder if that means mechanically only, or sonically as well. Sure sounds like a cartridge suspension issue. I'd try to send the whole thing back to him for a full refund. He states that he doesn't accept returns but eBay will be on your side in any dispute. If the box was damaged during shipping, consider filing a damage claim with the shipper (assuming the seller insured it). Good luck!
Nice detective work! Yea I'm the dummy that bought it :)
It was like 230.00 and some sucker jacked up the price to 530 in the last minute then quit. But I had autobid set high as I just wanted a working unit not a broken one.
I'm not sure how he should have packed the tone arm. He did not have a foam block under it to support it. He just had bubble wrap above it pushing it down to the top plate. It did not move much but now its floppy, side to side and up and down. Probably snapped the pin when he packed it.
Does anyone know if a TX2 works without the cartridge inserted? I mean should it be able to power up, turn on and off as well as move the arm?
It just spins and won't even power down.
My BG 6500 (which has the same mechanism) moved the arm to the record, released the tone arm (which didn't drop due to no cartridge mass), then tracked rapidly acrosss the record to the end, at which point it returned and shut off.
Re: Tone arm preparation. You should place something under it such as a styrofoam peanut. Then use a piece of scotch tape to secure it to the deck to prevent lateral movement. And you do need bubble wrap under the lid to prevent the sub-platter from coming loose and sliding around. The platter should be removed of course.
Your only sensible course of action is to make a "not as described" claim with ebay/paypal.
It was too expensive if it worked perfectly but now it doesn't work you have to get a refund.
Regards Graham
Use this as a learning experience - don't use the automatic bidding system on eBay or at least only enter a sensible maximum bid!
Secondly, send it back as previously suggested. It was not shipped properly and has sustained considerable damage in the process. The seller won't have a leg to stand on as far as eBay are concerned - I assume you paid via Paypal? If so, claim it all back and return it to the seller asap.
There are other TX2's on eBay at the moment for a quarter of the price you paid. Even if the cartridge on one you buy is OK now , you must assume that it will need retipping or suspension rebuilding due to its age. You can have an MMC5 rebuilt to the equivalent of an MMC1,2,3 or 4 so don't worry about which cart comes with one. If that costs $300, even buying a good TX2 for $100 still saves you over this overpriced and damaged one.
Don't let the seller BS you over returns - you are in the right over any claim - unless you start to tamper with it.
Dave.
Oh the seller has be good about it, said would give the money back. Just not sure if he sends me a pick up sticker or I have to drive to UPS to send it back. And do I pay return shipping etc.
He did pretty good on the packing. Locked it, removed platter put it under table. Put bubbles in the lid area. But did not put a peanut under the tone arm and did not put the stylus protector down.
Oh the autobid, well if it was in perfect shape I would have kept it. It was a chunk of change but if in perfect shape I'd have kept it.
You got lucky.
Yes, you pick up the tab on the return shipping by the carrier of your choice. And make sure it's trackable.
(stylus protector would have been useless - it takes virtually no force to push it up)
(double-post)
Well I've ordered enough tables off ebay that I was bound to get lucky. Probably 1/2 of them raise a stink when they mess up on packing. I've not had to send any back yet, usually they do partial refund. I've got too many broken tables in my house, no room for anymore so this one is going back for sure.
I think maybe 1 out of 8 was packaged well. They think they know what they are doing and even when given proper instructions they somehow fail. Its really not hard to follow simple instructions. Makes me wonder the intelligence of some of this folks.
Dave,
Are you saying that MMC 1-5 are all identical except for the tip and cantilever? So you could take a mmc5 and put a nude diamond like on the mmc1-2 and it would be the same sonically? Thats good to know.
Absolutely. The main part of the cartridge is the same but only the cantilever and diamond combinations are different. This has been covered many times here on Beoworld and this is the man who rebuilds them to whatever spec you want:
http://www.schallplattennadeln.de/REPARATUR-RETIPPING/MC-SYSTEM-Reparatur/
Well thanks, I am a noobie B&O owner. In past two months ive picked up two 8002s, a RX2 and TX2. I have two mm2s, two mmc3s and one mmc4 and a older 20n cart.
None of them have ever been rebuilt. They seem to sound ok but never played a new one so don't know for sure.
I don't see a ruby cantilever offered on that site, just aluminum and carbon.
I'm in USA, wonder how much longer it takes.
In the USA there is soundsmith and Benny http://aminaaudio.com/cartridge.html
don't know who does the best work. Benny is fast charges around 200.00.
RAJOD: Benny is fast charges around 200.00.
Benny is fast charges around 200.00.
Pretty sure it's less than that. See the web site.
With regard to badly packed turntables, I've bought 2 Beogram 3404s on Ebay that were badly packed. Neither were disassembled at all, and neither were locked. One just had some wadded up newspaper in it for packing material - and not even completely full!
Yet both tables survived shipping and both work fine today. My conclusion: some tables are just more robust than others.
According to a recent thread here, Axel does now supply a saphire cantilever I believe. It may just not be on his website yet. You can contact him directly to ask him. I think the rebuild service Axel offers is more comprehensive than that offerred by Soundsmith/Benny but I stand to be corrected. It may take longer with Axel - an indication of how busy he is due to his reputation.
I have one MMC 2 and some MMC 4s from Axel, also have a SMMC4 (Soundsmith) The SMMC 4 is brighter (CD like) than Axels, Axels is IMO more B&O like, his MMC 2 is my favorite, he also repaired a SP14 that sounds like a very good original I have here.
I do have a distorted mmc2 that I might have rebuilt. Sounds like axel is the only person that can make them sound like a mmc2, Benny makes them mmc4 like due to have no supply of ruby cantilevers.
I don't know how Axel could be more comprehensive. Its just a part you replace and it either works of it does not.
So sound-smiths being more CD like are probably better than the original mmcs. I love my vinyl but they don't have the dynamic range of a good CD.
1/2 speed masters give them a run for thier money though.
I am about to ship the TX2 with distorted mmc2 back. The seller offered a refund of 430.00 which would make the table 100.00. It would still need repair.
Is this still not worth fixing?
Sounds like a very fair settlement. The defective MMC-2 by itself could be worth $150.
We ended up settling on 90.00 for the unit with mmc2.
Now have to find someone good with turntables to fix it. I can see the ruby cantilever is intact but can't make out if the stylus is there. Tip might be broken.
I have a microscope at work, I'll try to inspect it.
Some sources say the MMC-2 has a sapphire cantilever - e.g. Beoworld. Others say it's ruby. Not sure who is correct. In any event, the stylus should be visible with the naked eye.
Not my naked eye, old eyes, need a magnifier. I can see a tip with a convex mirror on my needle brush. It seems smaller than my other mmc2 needle.
The cantilever is see through. looks like glass. Could be sapphire or ruby, either one is much stiffer than soft aluminum.
MediaBobNY: Some sources say the MMC-2 has a sapphire cantilever - e.g. Beoworld. Others say it's ruby. Not sure who is correct. In any event, the stylus should be visible with the naked eye.
The two materials are identical except for the colour.
Sapphire is any colour of the mineral corundum and ruby is the red variant.
I called Benny on my mmc2 and he said 200.00 plus shipping. Maybe mmc2 cost more dunno.