ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
PhilLondon:You're right, there's a Powerlink socket on the NL/ML converter, and a connection for an IR receiver, and an AUX IN. So it's indeed the successor of the Beolink Active, it's also a mini audio system in the sense it can have a source!! It's a shame (but rather fun) it needs all of us to put our bits of knowledge together to understand this new NL system. Dealers told me they aren't told much more than what we know about the NL. I wonder what the two USB ports ports are about??? And the IR connecter is also a RS232 connector... Are they going to merge the Beolink Gateway and the NL Converter into one?? Download the Beoworld app at http://appstore.com/beoworld - Now with direct photo upload and emoticons.
Ah, you know... A little B&O here, a little there
Millemissen: I always tell people - who want/need one - to plan, where it should be located.
I got BeoCare confirmation that Wireless speakers can be paired to only one WISA source.
If I got for the BS Moment, my Transmitter 1 will be redundant and I'll have to find a solution to connect my TOSLINK source to the BS Moment.
Cheers
BS Moment, BS Core, BG 4002, BC 4500, BS1, BL18, BL19, BL8000 + RCV1, A6, M5, M3, A1, P6 (tks Botty), H5, TR1
I meant CANNOT
Only way to do this is to convert the toslink to analog - and use the analog-in of the Moment.
Maybe your 'box' even has a DAC built-in and therefore an analog-out?
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Yep, the option is a DAC, or, the Peritel output of the "box" to a split that can output the sound to RCA (I know these kind of boxes exist)
mbolo01:Peritel
Peritel = SCART for non French people....
Beoworld app with direct photo upload and emoticons.
I would not use the 'Peritel'
A scart-output normally involves bad DA-convertion.
PhilLondon: Thanks for translating Peritel :-)
Millemissen: Can we really talk about DA conversion when converting SCART to RCA? For me it's just a wiring story isn't it?
Yes - of course - we can!
If the scart must output sound, it needs an analog signal from somewhere.
And since most of the built-in sources of the 'box' are digital, there must be a DAC somewhere in it.
Using a scart connection again is not the best choice either.
Going from sscart to RCA with an adapter only makes things worse.
Better would be a normal L/R RCA output.
What I meant was, that if that 'box' only has the scart output (for analog out), they probadly did not built in any particular DAC solution - just a 2 cents chip.
Ok got u, I thought your were talking about a converter outside of the "box"
Agree, there is a DAC inside the "box" and unfortunately scart output this is my only analog option to connect to the Moment RCA leveraging a scart/RCA adapter.
I wonder how A/V of HiFi amps owners could take advantage of the Moment to stream sound from multiple classic sources like CD, SACD, turntable or other legacy systems .... Transmitter 1, while simpler, is more versatile and it's a pity B&O didn't carry TR 1 connectivity in Moment.
I'm new to B&O, there's maybe a magic box for that somewhere .....
@mbolo01 => Considering your French location, I presume that "The box" you are talking about is probably the Freebox Player V6
@Millemissen => I agree with you on a pure theoretical point
On a practical point it is not so obvious
- In fact The scart connector on this box is a mini-din connector, so we are only talking about a Mini din/Rca adaptor that has been quite often used in audio systems (especially in the 70' and 80') regarding tha analog signal that should not greatly impact the signal
- Regarding the DAC inside the box it is probably not a High End Dac, but I do not know the technical carateristics of B&O DAC Inside the Moment (And in other B&O product involved with DAC)
but I am not sure that he will hear a great sound quality difference between his Scart output and his toslink
output because (to me) the only format available as passthrough on this box are (Dolby Digital and DTS) every thing else is transformed into PCM 2.0
By using the RCA inputs of the Moment, (or other B&O product like the NL/ML converter or the Playmaker) you can only transmit an analog stereo signal => that signal will be converted into a digital one (please correct me if I am wrong) and then sent to the active speakers / or other sound system through WISA or NL (I suppose that signal sent over the 2 x Power link connectors is an anolog one)
In the case my speculations are correct,, B&O should have also implemented a digital input in the moment ...and an RCA one, not a Toslink. (Sorry mbolo01)
because if you want to read , DTS sound or 7.1 Dolby surround or 192 KHZ Flac on an other system inside your network it is just sad to convert it into simple analog PCM / Stereo signal before sending it to other equipments able of decoding any format.
Of course there is a DAC working in the Moment.
But it is more like a DSP solution, that involves digital to analog convertion in order to create a consistent quality on all outputs (WiSA, PL, NL) from all inputs.
How that exactly works, I guess only one of the 'wise guys' in Struer could tell us.
Of course they could have built in a digital input (spdif as coax or toslink) - but they did not!
Again, why not - only the makers of the Soundheart can tell us.
However, you must not think of the Moment/Soundheart as a hub for (several) different external sources.
Look at it a an audioplayer with the possibility to connect a single analog source such as a vinyl record player or occasionally an MP3 player or a PC.
I would - in case of wanting to connect that 'box' - go for a small descent external DAC from the toskink to the RCA analog.
But - I would also try out the solution before making it permanent. D/A convertion often creates sound-delay.
Or I would simply stick to the present solution with the Essence - and let go of the Moment.
By the way - PCM is not analog!
It is uncompressed digital audio - the most used and useable sound format at all.
Millemissen: Look at it a an audioplayer with the possibility to connect a single analog source such as a vinyl record player or occasionally an MP3 player or a PC.
Now THAT is intriguing. Make me want to try the Moment out with my BG6500TT later in the year.
There is no Wise Guys from Struer on this Forum ?
Millemissen: However, you must not think of the Moment/Soundheart as a hub for (several) different external sources. Look at it a an audioplayer with the possibility to connect a single analog source such as a vinyl record player or occasionally an MP3 player or a PC.
Ok but can I think of the Moment / Soundheart as a Digital Media Controler (in a DLNA sense ) able to help me selecting my Music from my NAS Synology and control one Media Renderer across my local Network ?
=> a media render could be a Beovision 7 .... or a Beovision Avant ....... or a PC With JRiver Software connect to a DAC connected to hIFI System
I also have the same question with the control of several Media Renderer (with perfect synchro for multiroom usage) => not now but sometimes when the guys from Struer will release the right upgrade)
Because to me... if the Moment can (also) achieve tha ...t, B&O is definitvly On the right direction
By the way you are 100% right " PCM is not analog!" The digital output of mbolo01 box which mainly drive only PCM involved me into this confusion. ;;; (Sorry for this poor excuse)
One of the menu's of the Moment:
You can limit the output of the volumen - might be nice if you have younger children
You can change the sensibility of the Line-in in order to adjust it to the output of your external gear.
Nice feature, I think.
Correct Facel, it's a V6 ! and thanks for your very good and detailed analysis.
The scart to PCA is my simplest option to connect the box, a DAC could add enough latency on top of the WISA one to make it perceptible
Do you think that an A/V "pre out" connection to the Moment RCA could make it? This would expand my audio sources landscape by inserting back my SACD and turntable.
In all cases, if I go for the moment, the Transmitter 1 will become redundant
Already looking forward to read about your experiences - when the Moment has arrived.
@mbolo01 => As Millemissen said the moment is mainly an Audio Player not a hub for CONNECTING different audio sources
Simply by reading the B&O product caracteristics of the Transmitter 1, the only thing I can suggest you would be to connect your differents sources as Input to your A / V Multi channel Amplifier and connect your A/V Multi channel Output to the PL1 to PL4 Inputs of your Transmitter 1
Of course you need to check my "connexion theory" on this forum or /and with your B&O technician (if he knows) before doing it because I do not have any Transmitter 1 nor experience .... it is a pure deduction from myself
you also need to have the right cable of course ... but we are driving away from the original discussion
@Millemissen => I was hopping that you could have already tested or played with the Moment and DLNA functions in oder to tell us
You have already delivered so much interesting and "balanced" informations about the Moment
@Facel
I fully understand that the Moment is not a hub, but I'm also looking at keeping as much as I can my old sources, listening to a noisy Vinyl, playing my SACDs or just having the sound of my Apple TV going to my BL ...
I just tested my A/V pre out to the Transmitter 1 RCA input connector and it's perfect, so I guess it will be the same with the Moment.
My local B&O reseller was not able to build working A/V to PL cables, reason why I had to park my A/V amp and use the V6 box which was satisfactory as 95% of my listening sources are Airplay and TV, but I was missing the other sources .... and to be honest, I don't know why he didn't try what I just did with the RCA .... nor I don't know why I didn't try myself, lazy guy I am!
Of course you should continue to use the sources, that you have.
I would do the same.
It seems that you have no problem at all doing this!
If it works well with the Essence, I am sure it will work with the Moment too.
As you see from my pic above, the guys in Struer have even thought about the need for adjusting the sensibility of the analog input on the Moment.
'build working A/V to PL cables' - that is a bit tricky, but it surely can be done.
You can even buy the cables for this purpose:
http://www.av-connection.dk/?ML=2126
And I am sure Steve at SoundsHeavenly would have been able to help with this too.
Facel: @Millemissen => I was hopping that you could have already tested or played with the Moment and DLNA functions in oder to tell us
I am not quite sure, that I know what you mean by that.
Which information are you missing?
Do remember, that I had about three hours to 'play' with the Moment - that can't posibly cover all aspects of the device.
If you are looking for something specific, I can try to get that infomation from the guy, who 'owns' the device.
But since they will be in the shops from end next week on, your dealer might be able to tell you and demonstrate it 'in real life' there.
I though that you still have acces to the Moment !!! ... and you have been until now for me the best information source
about this new product (I am not kidding you ) product which is not "fully" released I must admit.
To me, the Moment make (Great) sense as the Ultimate interface for selecting and playing music not only localy,but on any device on my Network, => Old B&O system (via Master link) => New B&O System via NL => any device running a decent DLNA (That's why I was talking about PC Running Jriver System as DLN Renderer or as DLNA Server (like JRiver or Synology)
and in an ideal world I could either
- choose to play simultaneously some differents music on these different systems from ONE Moment device but also
- have a "true synchronize multiroom system" able to play the same song (at the same time ) on several systems (I think it is called Party Mode by B&O)
That is up to now the main info missing for me
I am afraid that many B&O dealers won't be able to answer my questions
No - unfortunately I am not the one, who has full-time access to a BS Moment.
Most is already written in my post in this thread, but I might still be able to provide some information if needed.
I have no idea, if or how the Moment (or rather the sources of the SoundHeart) will be reachable on a ML-system. It would surely involve a NL/ML Converter - you (and I ) will have to be patient about how things will work in such a setup.
What the Moment is able to, is to distribute it's sources to other NL component (the A9 2.nd Generation and the Essence has been mentioned). This 'multi-room' functionallity is expected during springtime this year (I'd say in the first half year of 2015). Of course the software that is needed is still being developed/tested. Again - please be patient.
One of the spectacular things with the Moment, is that it draws from local (DLNA/NAS-based) music as well as on the music from the music service (Deezer) - you won't notice from where the music you hear is coming. This (and netradio) is, what can be distributed on the NL. That is - probably - what you see as Party Mode.
The ability to play different music on different components is another cup of tea. And it is something that is already there, because the A9 (2.gen), the Essence and the NL-BV's also have their own built-in sources.
I am not sure, what you mean by: 'play simultaneously some different music on these different...'??
You can't play different music simultaneously - in my understanding.
Very soon we will hear more about the Moment from the dealers, that are Beoworlders (I hope so) and from those, who are the first to buy and use it. They will probably be able to tell much more, than I was.
My intension in my posts (from what I have experienced) was to give an impression of what the Moment is capable of - and what it maybe is not capable of.
I am pretty sure that this device - in particular for those, who have made the move to NL - will be a damn good opportunity to be served with the music they like.....in a very easy and convenient way.
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
Like with any other combination of MasterLink and NetworkLink you will need a ML/NL Converter.
@BeoGreg - So Deezer and Internet radio stations will be you unique music sources, very simple indeed and one of the very valid options.
@BeoGreg
Chris was talking about using the BL7-6 of his BV7, which is ML. For this setup, you would need the converter.
If you (just) want to run it with a couple of speakers as a pure audisystem, all you have to do is connect the speakers to it, connect it to your home network and - of course - to the power outlet. Speakers and/or network could be wireless - that's all.
Not that complicated!
Millemissen: I am not sure, what you mean by: 'play simultaneously some different music on these different...'?? You can't play different music simultaneously - in my understanding.
Simultaneoulsy is not equal to Synchronous
I am thinking about a multi room music system where all your music is stored on a central NAS = Digital Media Server
You have 2 behaviours a) Each room select an play a different song from the same Digital Media Server (that's what I call to play different music simultaneoulsy)
b) The same song will be played in each room in a total Synchronous way => that's what B&O called Party Mode(*) (If my understanding is correct)
By the way you can also add on that cental storage, the ability to access web radio or web streaming services.
The fact that the Beosound Moment can be a local player is ok, but I much rather would like to be able to use the tablet of the Moment as a remote control for selecting and playing my music anywhere in my house either in mode a) or in mode b).
(*) like if you have a party at home and you play the same song (on real time synchro) on your Beolit 15 located in the garden, on your Beovision in your living room , and on your non B&O Hifi in your kitchen.
Facel: The fact that the Beosound Moment can be a local player is ok, but I much rather would like to be able to use the tablet of the Moment as a remote control for selecting and playing my music anywhere in my house either in mode a) or in mode b).
There are many good ideas, of how the Jukebox (the tablet remote) could be used!
I have heard a few already
Personally I think, that B&O will let it/the interface remain slim, and keep it for controlling the SoundHeart.
They wanted to create a musicsystem (the Moment), that is easy, logical and 'fuss free' to use.
Think of the BeoMusic app, when it comes to more complicated control of a 'whole home audiosystem' - including
the two basic functions, that you mentioned.
I am sure we will see something from B&O coming, that will satisfy your needs, in the first half of this year.
But do remember, that multiroom music nowadays is not just a matter of local stored music via DLNA.
It is much more a matter of involving and including streaming music services.
And do remember, that this also is very much about the user interface for achieving this.
The less complicated the better.
We'll see, what they will come up with.
Just for keeping this thread alive ...
(you can replace "bogous" with "bogode" for Germany ..etc ...)
http://bogous.custhelp.com/#s=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
Hello:
Haven't been logging in the forum for the longest time as I am happy with all the B&O gears I got; but with the trend of digital and wireless, time for me to get back to see what B&O has to offer.
Was trying to signup for the newsletter for BeoSound Moment, but the site only have Canada - French. Guess we folks here in Canada all must speak French :-)
Anyway, my question is can anyone tell me how this will integrate with my existing BS9000 and BL8000? i.e. is there a wireless solution or I better off buying the new BL18?
@Facel - Great! Tks
Facel: Just for keeping this thread alive ...
Sorry - just curious.
What exactly did you have in mind, when you posted that link?
MooMooMonkey: Guess we folks here in Canada all must speak French :-) Anyway, my question is can anyone tell me how this will integrate with my existing BS9000 and BL8000? i.e. is there a wireless solution or I better off buying the new BL18?
Guess we folks here in Canada all must speak French :-)
1: I guess Geoff (Martin) would not agree
2: as with any other integration of a ML and a NL product you will need a NL/ML Converter for this.
The BL8000 can be directly connected to the Moment via PL using an adapter cable from RJ45/PL to Din/PL.
If you prefer a wireless solution with the (BL8000) speakers, you will need a set of the (WiSA-) BeoLab Receiver1 for connecting the speakers - the Moments then sends the sound wireless to it.
Millemissen: Sorry - just curious. What exactly did you have in mind, when you posted that link? MM
Nothing else than sharing some additionnal "official" technical info about the Moment
It is also funny that B&O has first added the Q&A web section about the moment before the "Marketing & sales" section
I did not get straight to the 'Moment subpage' from your link
Did you notice that there is a section on the A9 2nd gen too?
Note: the BS Moment is out today - at least my dealer has got it today.
And he told me, that he also has gotten the A9 2nd gen.
I think the Moment like Beosound 5 shows is why B&O is not like other in the industry. We haven't seen it hands on yet. Though not happy about the wood, polished aluminium like on the Beosystem 9000 would look much better 😀
Beovision 7-55" 3D, Beosound 5, Beolab 9, Beolab 8000, Beovision 6, Beo 6, Beoremote one, H8, H2.