ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
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Present: BL90, Core, BL6000, CD7000, Beogram 7000, Essence Remote.
Past: BL1, BL2, BL8000, BS9000, BL5, BC2, BS5, BV5, BV4-50, Beosystem 3, BL3, DVD1, Beoremote 4, Moment.
Hi,
1: the upcoming BeoSound Moment is supposed to solve all your problems!
2: I did not 'move to a streaming product' - I extended my posibilities for access to music using a streaming product.
Means: in addition to playing my CD's/SACD's/PureAudioBluRay's, I have access to what I have on my NAS drive and to Music Services (Spotify, WiMP HiFI). I use a Playmaker and an iPad (and my local network).
3: I would certainly call my BM4500/CD4500 'older gear' - but the Master with the Playmaker (connected to the unused A-Tape port) is all that I actually need to allow the above*.
My speakers aren't the newest either, but surely they are active. In addition I have access to all sources in a couple of link rooms..
It was never 'Streaming or CD' to me - old and new live happily side by side in my case, when it comes to listening to music.
*OK - my BluRay player is used for the PureAudioBluRay's and the Concert/Live BR's/DVD's.
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
seethroughyou:am I a prematurely ageing dinosaur in my 30s?
Are you in the 'where has the magic gone' zone.?
I enjoy the whole process of selecting a cd and the visual impact of these systems in a room (and the listening bit)
I have not had the occasion or need to even try streaming.
What colour slippers did you get ?
The by far easiest solutions for those problems is Sonos! Installation is nearly foolproof and you don't have to hassle with technical things. It MIGHT be required to config your NAS -depending on type and software - but that's all. Connect a ZP90 or an older ZP90 to your B&O and you can use many devices (smartphone, tablet, computer...) to control the Sonos stuff. The devices even have AUX-in ports for connecting 3rd party sources.The Beosound Essence could be so much more... but B&O still doesn't seem to have the required software skills.
TWG: The by far easiest solutions for those problems is Sonos! Installation is nearly foolproof and you don't have to hassle with technical things.
The by far easiest solutions for those problems is Sonos! Installation is nearly foolproof and you don't have to hassle with technical things.
Using Sonos since years (with Beosound 9000, 3000, Beocenter 9300 etc).
"Best of both worlds"!!
You can even use Spotify, Deezer etc. with it..
Ralf
Living Room: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-2 (Center), Beolab 9 (Fronts), Beolab 8000 (Rears), no Subwoofer. Screen: Sony KD-85XH9096Dining Room: Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 4000 on stands, fed by Amazon Echo Show 8Home Cinema: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-4 (Center), Beolab 1 (Fronts), Beolab 4000 (Rears). Projector: Sony VPL-HW55Home Office: Beosystem 3, Beolab 7-4, Beolab 5000, Screen: Sony KD-55XH9005 on Beovision 7-40 stand, ML to Beosound 9000 MK3 and Beosound 5/Beomaster 5 (1 TB SSD version)Bedroom: Sony KD-65XH9077, Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 6002 and Beolab 11 (all white, wall-mounted)
In storage: Beolab 5000/Beomaster 5000 (1960s).
4 beolab 5, beolab 9, beolab 10, beolab 5000, beolab 8000 mk2, beolab 6002, beolab 3500, beovision 7 55 mk2, 2 beovision 11 46 mk4, beotime, beosound ouverture, beosound essence, beoplay A8, beomaster 900 RG de luxe and the collection continues...
Dom
2x BeoSystem 3, BeoSystem 5000, BeoSystem 6500, 2x BeoMaster 7000, 2 pair of BeoLab Penta mk2, AV 7000, Beolab 4000, BeoSound 4000, Playmaker, BeoLab 2500, S-45, S-45.2, RL-140, CX-50, C-75, 3x CX-100, 3x MCL2 link rooms, 3x Beolab 2000, M3, P2, Earset, A8 earphones, A3, 2x 4001 relay, H3, H3 ANC, H6, 2014 Audi S5 with B&O sound, and ambio
I sometimes feel streaming takes my music pleasure back to the days when I listened to Radio Luxembourg on MW... my favourite song just starts and then bingo I loose signal....
I to gain a simplistic pleasure either with a good coffee or cold beer physically selecting an album admiring the artwork and enjoying the pleasures of the music, personally i like this journey.
But then I like B&O which is not everyones cup of tea and maybe I mumble too much in the supermarket ...
I blame it on being brought up on Star Trek
we tend to forget there is more to design than designing.
I use a computer to download the music on my BS5.
After that, i shut my laptop down, stand up, feel the delight of the aluminium wheel to choose the music i want to listen and... let MOTS play
Mark: I blame it on being brought up on Star Trek
Resistance is futile
Mark:I sometimes feel streaming takes my music pleasure back to the days when I listened to Radio Luxembourg on MW... my favourite song just starts and then bingo I loose signal.... I to gain a simplistic pleasure either with a good coffee or cold beer physically selecting an album admiring the artwork and enjoying the pleasures of the music, personally i like this journey. But then I like B&O which is not everyones cup of tea and maybe I mumble too much in the supermarket ... I blame it on being brought up on Star Trek we tend to forget there is more to design than designing.
BeoNut since '75
valve1:Resistance is futile
I am totally into vinyl and analog when I turn on my amp and play a record on the BG it does just that and nothing more.
When I turn on my computer it tells me that my computer is in danger and click here and there, I do that as obedient owner, it then tells me that I need an update, I check the date, it is always the same, before or after the update, It then tells me, to install the update, close all windows before installing, I close the windows and to be sure, also the doors, and tell my wife to stay put. After a time the computer tells me, installation complete, click Finish, never Danish. I click finish, it then tells me that the new update has saved me from 319 virus attacks, 14 Trojan Horses, some sneaky worms, other insect and animals. I go wash my hands, while thinking about how to feed the horses, if they get into my computer (I like horses), I also think about if one day some update will save me from the BeoVirus. I am now ready for some digital music.
I double click the Amazon music icon, the screen comes up with all the music I have stored there, I find a good Rock and Roll album and click play, after some 20 seconds the computer tells me, the selected file is not available at the moment, please try again later. I didnt ask for a file, nor a hammer, but for music. I turn off the computer, it tells me, close all open documents or you will loose your work, I do that, who wants to loose his job nowadays.
I go to my lovely BM 4400, powers on, press phono, select a record, put it on the BG TX2, press play and enjoy the sound coming from the P45s, returning to my relax chair, I turn around just to admire design, I never do that with the computer.
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
Oh dear, Soren, I think we really will have to start a 'Grumpy old men' thread!
I have a huge amount of sympathy with your views, firmly believing we are at heart analogue creatures. I spend much of my working day in front of a computer screen and much of that time being frustrated by it. It is a great relief to come home, pour a glass of something and sit down and listen to a vinyl record. The sheer ritual of taking the thing out of its sleeve, carefully placing on the deck and pushing the start button helps the process. It is almost cathartic after a difficult day. But, on the other hand.....
There is something extremely appealing about having access on demand to music you do not have to physically own and which does not require you to have great lumps of equipment, however attractive, cluttering up the space you live in.
Ivor Tiefenbraum the man who founded Linn, the makers of the Sonndek LP 12, and a company that is now also a very successful purveyor of high quality downloads always saw CD as a stop gap until there was a method of distributing digital music that didn't need a physical carrier - which is where we have arrived at now, particularly with high speed broadband.
So perhaps an ideal mix is vinyl and very high quality streaming/downloads
Cleve
I like streaming via Apple TV into my B&O system most days of the week - it works all round the flat and no drop outs. But it is great having the option of playing Vinyl on a Friday night after underwinding from work with a glass of wine.
It's a bit like food - sometimes you just want a hamburger or kebab, but at other times you want to spend time cooking a gourmet meal and enjoy the whole experience of cooking and eating.
Here I'm using a dedicated only for music Mac mini, connected at a Arcam DAC who streams my music files.
The Mac mini/dac is connected to my Beolink line - input and serves music through the masterlink. Most of my collection is digitized to 44/16 format, but all new music I buy is in 96 or 192/24 bit Aiff format. Planning to do the same one day with my vinyl also.
I'm not using iTunes as my music program to stream, but Sonic Studio's Amarra IRC who has its own very good engine.
"Believe nothing you read and only half of what you see, let your ears tell you the truth."
I can support LP, CD, or streaming playback, and usually choose streaming for ease of use and finding stuff. I have a small Lenovo PC dedicated to being a music server, it stays on all the time, running iTunes, and is set to download updates automatically but not install them automatically, so unless something like a power failure has occurred it's always running when I want to listen to music. I manually update things every week.
My mode is to plomp down on the couch, grab my iPad, fire up the iTunes Remote program, turn on the system with my Beo4, and start streaming music from either the iTunes or Spotify. I find this a lot more relaxing than having to get up and fiddle with an LP or such, which I mainly do when I'm not stressed and such, it's more of a when I feel good and want to play thing, rather than a I want to do this to force myself to relax thing. Also a lot quicker than putting on an LP.
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
I'd love the luxury of having 24 million LP's to hand, but until then i shall have to stick to subscribing to Spotify.
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
Søren Mexico: I am totally into vinyl and analog when I turn on my amp and play a record on the BG it does just that and nothing more. .... I go to my lovely BM 4400, powers on, press phono, select a record, put it on the BG TX2, press play and enjoy the sound coming from the P45s, returning to my relax chair, I turn around just to admire design, I never do that with the computer.
....
Dear Søren - it seems to me that you must have a windows computer - probably still running XP
Just wondering how you managed to watch the Chuck Berry DuckWalk videos?
Is there a vinyl version of Youtube, that I don't know of?
I forgot to mention in my post above, that I have a BeoGram (4500) as well and a (very) small collection of vinyl LP's.
But I must admit, that I rarely listen to them - that is far too complicated.
ajames:I like streaming via Apple TV into my B&O system most days of the week - it works all round the flat and no drop outs. But it is great having the option of playing Vinyl on a Friday night after underwinding from work with a glass of wine. It's a bit like food - sometimes you just want a hamburger or kebab, but at other times you want to spend time cooking a gourmet meal and enjoy the whole experience of cooking and eating.
StUrrock: Beautifully put sums it up perfectly
Beautifully put sums it up perfectly
agree with that!
Apart from:
easily being able to choose, what I want to hear from my own (NAS) collection or from WiMP HiFi controlled by my iPad is 'cooking a gourmet meal' to me.
I believe a lot of the popularity of vinyl, and even musicassettes and reel to reel, can be explained as alternatives sought by people who work with their computers, and who want to relax with something else.
Streaming is very useful - yesterday I listened to a live transmission of the opening concert of the big city symphony, brought to me via the internet and through my analog set-up. Very easy to control. But when I want to turn my listening into a happening, I use vinyl or reel to reel, as per the gourmet parable above.
My CDs have been in boxes for a long time. But after installing solar panels and a wind generator at my mountain cabin, I realized it would also be a great place to enjoy those CDs. Got a BeoSound 3000 and BeoLab 4000s for the cabin, for some reason people are selling these for nothing these days, probably not having understood that BeoLab 4000s are perfect speakers for playback from their computers. Up at the cabin, I am now spinning CDs and getting wonderful sound. I can stream to the BeoSound through a Dab radio I have connected to AUX. The Dab radio accepts Bluetooth streaming - which means that I can play Spotify, or whatever else I find on my computer or iPhone. But find myself preferring playing the CDs up there.
Listening to Melvyn Bragg's programs up at the cabin, streamed from the Podcast app on the iPhone, is glorious bliss, of course.
(The person who sold me his BeoLab 4000s for a song told me he was selling them because he wanted speakers he could stream to directly. Was it wrong of me not to point out that he could do that with ease to his BL4000s? )
soundproof: (The person who sold me his BeoLab 4000s for a song told me he was selling them because he wanted speakers he could stream to directly. Was it wrong of me not to point out that he could do that with ease to his BL4000s? )
Stein,
The classic ethical dilemma. I was nearly presented with a similar one recently when a boxed Beogram 1202 was advertised for sale locally for £25. I was too late - it had been sold by the time I contacted the elderly seller - but I may well have been troubled if I had not offered more for it - or at least pointed out that the box is probably worth £25 on its own! Thankfully, I didn't have to make the decision.
Søren Mexico:When I turn on my computer it tells me that my computer is in danger and click here and there, I do that as obedient owner, it then tells me that I need an update, I check the date, it is always the same, before or after the update, It then tells me, to install the update, close all windows before installing, I close the windows and to be sure, also the doors, and tell my wife to stay put. After a time the computer tells me, installation complete, click Finish, never Danish. I click finish, it then tells me that the new update has saved me from 319 virus attacks, 14 Trojan Horses, some sneaky worms, other insect and animals. I go wash my hands, while thinking about how to feed the horses, if they get into my computer (I like horses), I also think about if one day some update will save me from the BeoVirus.
Seems like you need a anti-virus programme for your computer - however, I don't think anyone has found a cure for the Beovirus
valve1: I enjoy the whole process of selecting a cd and the visual impact of these systems in a room (and the listening bit) I have not had the occasion or need to even try streaming.
For me it is not 'either/or' but 'both/and'.
I fully agree with you, when it comes to the visual impact of those systems in a room. That's why I have ended up with a complete Beosystem in (almost) every room in the house - instead of having a link system. I even have a (non-functional Beomaster 1900 in the living room -as a 'piece of art)And then I have a small Collection of vintage B&O on the first floor - but that's another story...(and another thread) Like you I enjoy the process of selecting a CD or a record, and put it on/in the Beogram/Beogram CD -or Beocenter/Beosound.
But often I choose the 'easy way' of modern streaming. I have a WD TV Live box connected to my TV and my "main audio system" - a BeoSystem 9500 with Beolab 5000's. This way I can stream music from my phone and tablet. I often use this solution for parties - then I mostly use Spotify. I have some playlists with mixed music for dinner, for dance - or whatever. And guests can use the tablet if they want to hear something else. And sometimes we put on a CD or a vinyl record, if Spotify doesn't offer the particular track.
In the other rooms, I don't have any boxes for Wireless. But I have a DIN-to-MiniJack cable plugged into the AUX socket in every audio-system. Mostly I only listen to FM radio, when in the dining-room, bedroom or home-office. Otherwise I just bring along a CD (or even sometimes a tape). - or I'll take my phone or tablet - plug the MiniJack into it, and listen to Spotify or Netradio through the audio system.
I have never understood those people who sold all their vinyls when the CD came out. And then later scrapped all their CD's (and most of the 'hardware') -for streaming only. Anyway - I have some music on vinyl and CD, that can not be found on Spotify or iTunes - or anywhere else on the net. (If -then maybe only in some crappy home-recorded version on YouTube - or on some obscure sites...).
Well that was my point of view. I think I use the best of both Worlds
To me it is pretty simple.
I push one button on the Beolink 1000 and the white Beosystem 6500 1991 will play music. Now if I want something else I can find it and put it in. It does not matter if is a cassette, cd or a record. Even on the Beocord 5500/6500 I can locate the tracks by pushing 1 button on the Beolink 1000.
With the white Beosystem 6000 1981 it is just as simple. One button from the remote tablet or push directly on either source you would like of cassette, record or radio. I got a CDX added so it is a 2 step function for play back. Get the CD going and select tape 2.
I do use old passive Beovox but it might be some day that I will get active for the 6500 again and Beovision AV9000. It will depend on the living conditions later in my life.
Both of my Beosystems are working great thanks to Dillen and I don't mind not going to streaming as it sounds great as I got it. Why change as I love the design of both and besides who would care for either system anymore? Yes the 6500 is classy but the 6000 does give it a good run in sound production. That 6000 had 3 dead main units in an auction late 2007. Dillen had 2 of them fixed pretty soon after and they are now all 3 going. Who would have thought the system ended up working and complete again?
The last few days I have had the Beogram 6006 with a mmc20cl pickup playing Down to earth in clear vinyl with Rainbow and Graham Bonnet pretty loud. ROCKS! I can tell you!
If we're talking about comfort, modern music devices are hard to beat. Remote controls and huge music databases are so handy and convenient.
But IMHO, unless it's uncompressed music (16 or 24 bits, 44.1/48/96 Khz) it's not hi-fi. It's just a background sound, that works well in the car or in the workspace. Hi-fi needs dynamic and full frequency range, and if the source is crappy, even if you connect it to the best sound system in the world, the sound remains crappy.
My ears are good enough to tell the difference: I'm not a purist, though, and I listen to my iPad and my laptop quite often. But I know the difference, and I hear it.
Guess I'm ready for the Grumpy Club
B&O Beogram 4004, Revox B790/Audio Technica VM520EB, Yamaha CX1000/YSTA5/TX350, Philips CDP400/BDP3100,Technics RS-B965, Infinity Qbx, Audio Pro 4/40 MkII
Friedmett: The last few days I have had the Beogram 6006 with a mmc20cl pickup playing Down to earth in clear vinyl with Rainbow and Graham Bonnet pretty loud. ROCKS! I can tell you!
That's a great album
- and I agree with you on most of the other things you mention. I really can't see why some people try to make it a big issue to find a CD and put it in the player (or put a record on the turntable).Sometimes it is nice to listen to an entire album with one artist - instead of randomly jumping between artists/tracks... (but try to tell that to the youngsters today...)
Jantoman:If we're talking about comfort, modern music devices are hard to beat. Remote controls and huge music databases are so handy and convenient. But IMHO, unless it's uncompressed music (16 or 24 bits, 44.1/48/96 Khz) it's not hi-fi. It's just a background sound, that works well in the car or in the workspace. Hi-fi needs dynamic and full frequency range, and if the source is crappy, even if you connect it to the best sound system in the world, the sound remains crappy. My ears are good enough to tell the difference: I'm not a purist, though, and I listen to my iPad and my laptop quite often. But I know the difference, and I hear it. Guess I'm ready for the Grumpy Club B&O Beogram 4004, Thorens TD160/Shure V15IV, Yamaha CX1000/YSTA5/TX350, Philips CDP400/BDP3100,Technics RS-B965, Infinity Qbx
Steffen: Sometimes it is nice to listen to an entire album with one artist - instead of randomly jumping between artists/tracks... (but try to tell that to the youngsters today...)
Sometimes it is nice to listen to an entire album with one artist - instead of randomly jumping between artists/tracks... (but try to tell that to the youngsters today...)
Noone forces you to 'jump between artists/tracks', just because you are using a music service as your source.
I hardly ever listen to a 'single track' via Spotify/WimpHiFi, as I am (and ever was) an album guy.
To me using a music service is like 'popping in a cd' - just much more comfortable and without having to buy it before - and waiting for the delievery.
Chris Townsend:[ Try Qobuz which has a minimum Flac Lossless quality, and an increasing "Studio master" library.
Try Qobuz which has a minimum Flac Lossless quality, and an increasing "Studio master" library.