Oh boy. Bang and Olufsen 'open to bids'

That radio station is available on the Tune In app so i'm thinking, that since the Moment is based on Android, it'll be possible to add the Tune In radio app. Hope that helps!

Paul W:

That radio station is available on the Tune In app so i'm thinking, that since the Moment is based on Android, it'll be possible to add the Tune In radio app. Hope that helps!

Thanks, but I meant the Encore. 

Oh damn - is there anyway B&O can add stations to the Encore by a software update? Surely B&O would be able to if requested?

Paul W:

Oh damn - is there anyway B&O can add stations to the Encore by a software update? Surely B&O would be able to if requested?

I wouldn't hold my breath. 

I

Hey Bayerische I think I had some great news for you. Ive just reinstalled the BeoPlayer app on my iPhone. I know that this contains the exact amount of stations that the Encore does. AND YE the station is indeed on it as long as its a soft rock one from the USA! 

Hope that makes you happy :)

The BeoPlayer app looks horribly dated when I play my playlists. Looks like an old black ios5 type player. I've taken the app off again - too dated sadly. Come B&O please update it!

I think Apple have got their music player perfect with the white layout design in ios7/8

Paul W:

I think Apple have got their music player perfect with the white layout design in ios7/8

Thanks for that - that's really helped!

@bayerische

What do you actually like, at all - apart from the Encore (perhaps)

MM

Millemissen:

@bayerische

What do you actually like, at all - apart from the Encore (perhaps)

MM

Wow!  I can see that his "signature" doesn't list his B&O "investment" but I seem to recall he was a BS9000/BL5 type of guy ............ amongst a whole lot else! I think he deserves more of an opinion than most!

Paul W:

I

Hey Bayerische I think I had some great news for you. Ive just reinstalled the BeoPlayer app on my iPhone. I know that this contains the exact amount of stations that the Encore does. AND YE the station is indeed on it as long as its a soft rock one from the USA! 

Hope that makes you happy :)

That is good news! Thanks!

Now I perhaps need to find an Encore!

Millemissen:

@bayerische

What do you actually like, at all - apart from the Encore (perhaps)

MM

You want my B&O list that I currently own? 

BL5, BL8000, BL Penta mk3, Beovox CX50, BL5000, BS9000, BV9, BV6, Beosystem 4500, Beocenter 2300, BeoSound3, A dozen remotes from Beolink 7000 to Beo5, 4 headphones, A2, Beolit 500, I've probably forgotten something.... 

I love all of these! + my wife. 

Oh, 3 pieces of  LC2 and one LC1. 

My list keeps building. 

You're welcome Bayerische. Speak to Aussie Michael about the Encore before you buy one. He bought one and B&O treat him absolutely terrible when he had many many many problems with it!

Puncher - sorry that was a message for Bayerische continuing the Beo thingy app.

bayerische:

Oh, 3 pieces of  LC2 and one LC1. 

My list keeps building. 

Nice to hear

From most of your postings one might easily get the impression, that you dislike anything B&O made/make.

But that was probably me mis-reading you.

MMis

Millemissen:

bayerische:

Oh, 3 pieces of  LC2 and one LC1. 

My list keeps building. 

Nice to hear

From most of your postings one might easily get the impression, that you dislike anything B&O made/make.

But that was probably me mis-reading you.

MMis

There needs to be a balance to this though. I buy a lot of gear, and thankfully as it comes from my favourite brand, most of its awesome. But if things don't come up to standard(or even work in the case of the Beolit and A9) as a consumer and fan, we have a right and duty to say so.

If the public hadn't complained about the Airplay dropouts on the Beolit and A9, with its consequential impact on sales, do you seriously think B&O would have gone to the length of redesigning Bluetooth aptX into the devices? If only B&O had the sense to give Beoworld Gold members a few weeks to play with the devices, we could in a shot do the work of many highly paid execs!

 

I like Tue and I like BeoPlay 

BeoPlay was good to introduce to a younger crowd (i hate myself sounding like that), but Bang & Olufsen is too traditional for a certain crowd looking for hip existentialism.

But they haven't made it relevant yet.... come on B&O Marketing... you can do it. :-) 

Chris Townsend:

MMis

There needs to be a balance to this though. I buy a lot of gear, and thankfully as it comes from my favourite brand, most of its awesome. But if things don't come up to standard(or even work in the case of the Beolit and A9) as a consumer and fan, we have a right and duty to say so.

If the public hadn't complained about the Airplay dropouts on the Beolit and A9, with its consequential impact on sales, do you seriously think B&O would have gone to the length of redesigning Bluetooth aptX into the devices? If only B&O had the sense to give Beoworld Gold members a few weeks to play with the devices, we could in a shot do the work of many highly paid execs!

'right and duty to say so' - I was or am not questioning that - not at all.

I merely asked bayerische that question, because I had the impression, that he dislikes more than he likes.

Seems that I was wrong - no big deal, then!

 

BeoLit/A9: I see no 'public complaining' about AirPlay in those devices. But I hear, that people often have problems getting AirPlay to work in their network constellation.

I am not quite sure, that the BeoLit and the A9 are/were selling bad - and especially not that 'the AirPlay issue' should be the reason.

And - as I have written before - the adding of Bluetooth aptX is done in order to reach more costumers - mainly the Android users.

Note: the coming new version of the A9 has AirPlay as well as Bluetooth aptX built-in.

It might be a good idea to let 'the Beoworld Gold members' do some testing.

But you don't seem to know that (at least in DK) there are beta-testers, who already do this - ordinary people like me and you. And some of the employees in Struer are doing it at home too.

 

MM

The issues were very prevalent on my items, and even after our dealer helped us with the network, and we bought the recommended router, still useless. The US Apple Store used to have pages of people complaining, but they have mysteriously disappeared !

I've just seen an aptX Bluetooth dongle for sale, so if you've got a 12 and sick of Airplay, there's no need to take a financial loss to upgrade it to a Beolit 15

Why didn't I think of this before

I totally agree with you, Beroli!

Seems like B&O managed to make a "cheaper" TV, assembled in Czech... But all those problems with the new Avant are about to break their neck.

Perhaps it would have been better to bring out a more expensive TV made in Denmark, instead of this disaster...

Back in the 80's and 90's B&O TV sets was just 20-50% more expensive than comparable Tv's. And perhaps twice the price of the cheapest Tv's on the market. (I remember in  Denmark: A Beovision LX6000 cost 13.000 DKKr, while one of the cheapest 28" TV you could buy costed around 6.000 DKKr.)
Today the prices are 10-20 times the cheapest TV's. And at least 2-3 times the price of comparable TV sets...
So the customers should expect that it just works.
One has to be a die-hard fan to to accept so many faults on a new device. Others would just say: Never Again. Sad, but true...

Steffen:

... Back in the 80's and 90's B&O TV sets was just 20-50% more expensive than comparable Tv's. And perhaps twice the price of the cheapest Tv's on the market. (I remember in Denmark: A Beovision LX6000 cost 13.000 DKKr, while one of the cheapest 28" TV you could buy costed around 6.000 DKKr.) Today the prices are 10-20 times the cheapest TV's. And at least 2-3 times the price of comparable TV sets... So the customers should expect that it just works. One has to be a die-hard fan to to accept so many faults on a new device. Others would just say: Never Again. Sad, but true...

+ 1

Agree

Beroli:

Today - B&O still lacks in software development and in Quality Management, when it comes to the main products - like TV´s I bought the Beovision Avant 55 and I owned the device for for 3 weeks. Besides the many quality issues (a literally broken Motor-Table-Stand, huge gap between Front-Glass and frame, cracking noise from the sophisticated speakers and stand) I experienced a lot of software flaws. The TV freezed completely while connecting to several supported video-files on my Synology-NAS, showed terrible ghosting and backlit issues/clouding and the upscaling from sd and dvd-sources didn't worked as it should be. My dealer tried really hard to get the issues fixed and I felt terrible for him - but finally I had to ask for a refund. My desire, to own the new BeoVision Avant, vanished completely. I felt like a beta-tester and not amused anymore. Other customers experienced some of these problems likewise. Just have a look on the several posts regarding the flaws of the new Avant in this forum.

This is what is still keeping me from buying the Avant: the many reported issues. Combine that with the scarcity of actual B&O dealers in my country, and a problematic Avant would be a nightmare. My dealer and a proper service option is 600 km away.

Even though the service procedure mentioned in B&O's service manuals is that a product is to be serviced at the customer's home, that is not the case any longer — at least not in Finland, probably due to economics/savings. When products still were serviced at home (my BV10, for example), it was fantastically convenient, and in part made owning B&O a good value.

This is the scenario that currently puts me off: I receive a new Avant, and as a two-man-job it is istalled (not an easy task). I detect a fault. There is no trained B&O service personnel in my city. What to do? Unassemble the TV/stand, repack the TV and send it to the dealer. A huge inconvenience, as the Avant is not exactly easy to handle & move around.

Let's assume the issue gets fixed, and the TV travels 600 km back to me, is setup again, and another issue comes up. Repeat the "fun" of unassembly, shipping and reassembly again upon return. Repeat it again for any other possible issue.

I don't have the confidence that a TV with so many moving parts (in the speaker assembly) and a glass covered with delicate coating would remain in "as new" condition with all the unassembling/assembling, packing/unpacking, trasportartion and handling at a service center.

So I am sticking with my perfectly functioning Beovision 11 — however treading the day it might develop a fault.

The quality control of the big items from B&O (well, all items, but you get my point) should be impeccable: products should be thoroughly tested at the factory before shipped to customers. That's not an unreasonable expectation for products that cost what the Avant costs.

Also the distribution / service model should be looked at by B&O, country by country. Yes, a new Avant would arrive directly to my home door from Denmark. But the after sales support is crippled by B&O selling & servicing their products only through proprietary shops (and in some cases by long distances).

They should look into the logistics involved, and minimize any inconvenience to customers who don't live near B&O dealerships.

They should also look into the components they source, and what happens on the assembly floor. Something has obviously not been quite right recently.

When buying B&O I want something I can trust will last, and the peace of mind that comes with it. Currently, the new Avant appears to be very much of a gamble. Too much so, in my opinion. The question is, why?

Could someone get me up to speed with the Avant problems?

I have missed all of this. 

KMA's post below is also true here in the States. I am not going to speak for everyone, but I, for one, don't have the confidence that my experience purchasing B&O will live up to the investment anymore. 

The horrendous experience I had back in 2007 was the reason I left the brand in the first place. But I am slowly warming up to B&O again. Maybe where the brand is in a year or two will help make the decision easier.

bayerische:

Could someone get me up to speed with the Avant problems?

I have missed all of this. 

Not to hijack this thread, but there are quite a few Avant problems threads if you look back in these forums, but here are some randoms I recall reading about: noise from the speaker motors, stand issues, dust under the screen, flickering, software (source) problems, buzzing noises, etc. 

My wife, sent me this... she thought I'd be interested.. check out retailer #3.

 

Sal:

My wife, sent me this... she thought I'd be interested.. check out retailer #3.

 

Not looking good. Some sort of take-over seems inevitable. It needs a company involved that sees the true value of the company and is willing to pay a premium. 

I think that if they can survive 2015 then they should survive long-term. Can they survive 2015 without taking on more financial debt or finding a major investor?

Graham

The H8's should be a global success bringing a new generation into the stores. They will then leave said store with the new super cool Moment system and matching Beolabs. Not content with just fantastic sound, the new customer ends up ordering a new Avant and so do his jealous friends.

That's so not going to happen Chris as apart from the guys on BeoWorld, i've never come across anyone who will spend £15K on the sound system & TV. It's not going to attract the youngsters like that. Now Beo Play should. The Moment doesn't do anything what their iPhones / iPads doesn't all ready do. Don't forget these youngsters are 'used' to one device that does everything from the days of the desktop to the laptop during their university years to the iPhone etc.

Beo Play has scope with a smaller designed A8 Sonos style multi room system but BANG&OLUFSEN will always be a niche brand for the wealthy and I don't know too many of those since 2008!

Chris Townsend:

The H8's should be a global success bringing a new generation into the stores. They will then leave said store with the new super cool Moment system and matching Beolabs. Not content with just fantastic sound, the new customer ends up ordering a new Avant and so do his jealous friends.

Beoplay won't be a success as long they only keep selling it in their 'exclusive' stores. Beoplay products should be available everywhere, like Apple did years ago after their success of the iPod & iPhone. Apple products today, are now almost sold in the grocery store next door. And therefore even my neighbor says: what a nice computer that is my next purchase for replacement.

Young people won't enter that exclusive B&O shop easily, because they don't have the funds. Rumours in general are still standing for B&O as a very costly brand for rich people and therefore there is hesitation to enter. Sell it al the local HiFi supermarket together with other brands, where you can listen, view... without any pressure and you reach more potential customers. You will off-course loose some buyers who are looking to get an exclusive product  in the house, but with this small buyers audience B&O can not survive today.

It is only a matter of reaching the general public.

Sal:

My wife, sent me this ... she thought I'd be interested.. check out retailer #3.

If this is true, as a supplier you would be nervous sending goods on credit to B&O.

As a customer would you leave a deposit?

CCC+ isn't exactly a comforting credit rating.  

I'm sure there are many, many companies in the CCC bracket at present. In fact, reading the description, it seems like a description of most businesses!

Here's a good LINK to an explanation of company credit ratings...

I would also think that the Danish Government would step in rather than let B&O go to the wall should it ever get that bad.  B&O is a Danish institution, and the Danish Treasury (or equivalent) isn't short of cash as far as I'm aware. I can't comment though as I'm not informed enough but maybe one of our members in the know could offer an opinion!

Lee

9 LEE:

I'm sure there are many, many companies in the CCC bracket at present. In fact, reading the description, it seems like a description of most businesses!

Here's a good LINK to an explanation of company credit ratings...

I would also think that the Danish Government would step in rather than let B&O go to the wall should it ever get that bad.  B&O is a Danish institution, and the Danish Treasury (or equivalent) isn't short of cash as far as I'm aware. I can't comment though as I'm not informed enough but maybe one of our members in the know could offer an opinion!

Lee

You're right Lee, as we all knew several countries and large corporations with a AAA-rating back in 2008, suddenly falling to very bad ratings or even defaulting. So indeed, a credit rating isn't everything...

Having a AAA-rated company myself, I doubt my company could stand very long in this financial market with a CCC+ rating. 

But the government may very well protect B&O if all was to go bad. Struer (and surrounding area) wouldn't be in for good days if B&O went bankrupt. 

 

Maybe B&O should become a partly Danish government owned company. At 90 years old, it's a part of Danish history, it's an epitome of Danish success & industrial heritage, and I for one cannot imagine a world without B&O, or living without B&O!

I'm certain the government as a part-owner would uphold all of B&O's values and preserve the essence of the company.

I'm not sure I agree KMA. Most governments can barely run themselves, let alone companies. 

If B&O was government owned I guess it would swell until becoming unbearable just to be shut down entirely or sold for pennies.

Privately owned businesses tend to do best. 

bayerische:

I'm not sure I agree KMA. Most governments can barely run themselves, let alone companies.

If B&O was government owned I guess it would swell until becoming unbearable just to be shut down entirely or sold for pennies.

Privately owned businesses tend to do best.

Too long to list....

Well, partly-owned

I wouldn't give the government reigns of the company — apart from a seat at the board. The role of the goverment as an investor would be to help preserve the company, the jobs, Danish innovation, the corporate heritage. And when profitable, get returns on the capital.

The idea being that the government wouldn't have any other business agenda than to help B&O thrive, stay Danish and remain a part of the country's future indefinitely.

This view maybe naive, but if the alternative is a certain Korean or Japanese corporation to devour B&O with their own agenda, I'd rather see a part-owner that is very partial about B&O remaining a Danish company.

Better yet, a group of investors called "BeoWorld Capital" could step in...