BV11 + BL11: Bass through internal speakers and BL11 at same time?

Perhaps some of you have experimented with this combination:

Is it possible to have the BV11 send out the full frequency bass signal through the both BV11 internal speakers and the BL11 at the same time?

By default, the active filter (set standard to 120Hz) cuts off bass from the internal speakers. Deactivating the filter sends the bass back through the internal speakers, but then cuts off bass from the BL11 entirely.

I guess audiophiles would argue this is how it should be - but BL11 is not that powerful and for films etc it could be more ..exciting.. with bass from all speakers.

Prior to the latest firmware update - I do actually believe deactivating the filter meant that bass was sent to all speakers - but after the update this is no longer the case - at least not on my Bv11.

BR

DGRouge:

Perhaps some of you have experimented with this combination:

Is it possible to have the BV11 send out the full frequency bass signal through the both BV11 internal speakers and the BL11 at the same time?

By default, the active filter (set standard to 120Hz) cuts off bass from the internal speakers. Deactivating the filter sends the bass back through the internal speakers, but then cuts off bass from the BL11 entirely.

I guess audiophiles would argue this is how it should be - but BL11 is not that powerful and for films etc it could be more ..exciting.. with bass from all speakers.

Prior to the latest firmware update - I do actually believe deactivating the filter meant that bass was sent to all speakers - but after the update this is no longer the case - at least not on my Bv11.

BR

I've experimented with this:

You can set the default 120Hz cut-off frequency to for example 70Hz from the settings. This will mean that BV11 handless frequencies from 70Hz upwards, and only frequencies below 70 are handled by the sub.

At the same time, you might like to set the Speaker Level of BL11 to something like +5.0 decibels, which boosts the bass and makes BL11 sound more powerful.

The BV11 itself has speakers with the impressive frequency range of 44 - 22.800Hz, and the BL11 starts from 37Hz, if I recall correctly, so you get fuller overall sound by sending more of the lower frequencies to BV11's speakers. They're very capable.

You might want to experiment with the Speaker Level setting for BL11 (+3.0 ... +6.0 db instead of the default 0) and the cut-off frequency (44Hz ... 80Hz instead of the 120Hz) to find a combination that makes the BV11+BL11 setup sound best to your ears.

I have made an additional Speaker Group called "Fuller" where the cross-over is set at 80Hz and BL11 Speaker Level to +5.0 db.

It's really quite useful to be able to have two or more Speaker Groups with different settings even though you're using the same speakers in them!

By making an additional Speaker Group, which has different settings from the default "TV" speaker group including BL11, you can easily compare them to find the best result — simply by switching Speaker Groups.

DGRouge:

Is it possible to have the BV11 send out the full frequency bass signal through the both BV11 internal speakers and the BL11 at the same time?

Go to your Bass Management menus and set the "Bass Redirection" levels to all loudspeakers to 0 dB.

This will route the bass management's LFE channel (which is below whatever frequency you choose) to all loudspeakers.

If you deactivate Bass Management, then the bass that is sent to a particular loudspeaker is only the bass that is in its channel. Typically there is less bass content in a surround channel than a front channel (or an LFE...) so your Surround loudspeakers will get less bass (for example).

See the Technical Sound Guide (link on this page) for a block diagram and explanations of this. If that document doesn't make sense, please ask!

Please note that, depending on the particular BV11 you have and the placement of the two devices, sending the same low-frequency content to both of them may result in a total REDUCED output at some frequencies. For an explanation of this effect, see this page.

Cheers

-geoff

Gents, thank you both.

Had a entertaining (and ..noisy) weekend working through the many combinations. Now have 6 speaker groups. All of them add somewhere between 4-6db to the subwoofer and have a lower filter setting than default.

Setting "bass redirection" to "0", as Geoff mentioned, certainly sends the bass through all speakers, but the overall level of bass seems substantially lower (as far as I can tell).

For completeness, I also did some testing with the Allpass filter (in the subwoofer menu). The description of this setting in the technical sound guide is .. eh.. technical.. but certainly helpful . In my set-up it definitely had an effect but did not improve sound.

Surprisingly, one of the most efficient ways to boost the bass was not in the BV11 sound settings, but on the BL11 itself. Changing the bass management on the BL11 (switch no. 3) from EXT. to INT. added quite a bit of bass. And in this mode (INT) the BL11 still responds to the changes you make in BV11 speaker level and filter settings. So although this setting is not quite what the BL11 manual recommends (it in fact tells you to do the opposite) -  it did the trick for me.

The only way to increase bass from here will be a BL 2 or BL 19...

 

Thanks again for very helpful input and great articles. 

DGRouge:

Surprisingly, one of the most efficient ways to boost the bass was not in the BV11 sound settings, but on the BL11 itself. Changing the bass management on the BL11 (switch no. 3) from EXT. to INT. added quite a bit of bass. And in this mode (INT) the BL11 still responds to the changes you make in BV11 speaker level and filter settings. So although this setting is not quite what the BL11 manual recommends (it in fact tells you to do the opposite) -  it did the trick for me.

Hi,

Setting the switch to INT engages the 120 Hz low-pass filter on the BL11. This has an effect on the phase response of the loudspeaker which can correct (or at least "better align") its phase with the BV11 low-end in your particular configuration. This is why it has an effect of boosting the bass.

Great to hear that you're happier with your system now. You might be able to squeak a little more out of the BL11 using the Speaker Level menu on the BV11. If you really want to play with it, you could also play with Speaker Distance on the BL11 to fake a phase response alignment using delay - however, use small steps when you do this. A 0.3 m difference will make a huge change at 100 Hz or so.

Cheers

-geoff

 

 

The audioengine of the BSys4 is a 'play-product'

MM