mixed Netlink and Masterlink installation

Hi all,

I've had a full masterlink system for a number of years now and just purchased a Beovision Avant 55 into the mix. It is replacing the Beovision 7-40  I bought 1 year ago. 

I have mixed feelings about all this now.

I've installed the product myself each time but the lack of information now is making it difficult and the dealer isn't any help - all I get is "I don't know".

My first issue is that to get the Beosound3000 or the Beosound5 to play, the TV must power up, raise up on the table stand and turn the screen on before any sound is released. I have a pair of Beolab 9's attached to the TV and so I can understand that the TV powers up, but it is all the extra activity it does that concerns me. This didn't occur with the BV7.  I have the BS3000 as my audiomaster and my BS5 is not. I had to buy a NL/ML converter so that I could integrate the TV with the rest of the system. I have for example, the CD set so that it uses a separate speaker group that includes only the 2x BL9's. 

Next question is the blu-ray player. I purchased a Panasonic DMP-BDT370GN. there is no PUC code for this so I selected Generic Panasonic Bluray. I have setup the bluray to perform 4K upscaling but do I connect it to HDMI input 1 or any of the other inputs. As I understand, only HDMI 1 supports a 4K input.

I will leave it at that for now but if anyone can either correct me where I have a misconfiguration or confirm that my setup is correct.

cheers,

Brent.

 

 

 

 

 

Brent:

...the TV must power up, raise up on the table stand and turn the screen on before any sound is released. I have a pair of Beolab 9's attached to the TV and so I can understand that the TV powers up, but it is all the extra activity it does that concerns me. This didn't occur with the BV7.  

Next question is the blu-ray player. I purchased a Panasonic DMP-BDT370GN. there is no PUC code for this so I selected Generic Panasonic Bluray. I have setup the bluray to perform 4K upscaling but do I connect it to HDMI input 1 or any of the other inputs. As I understand, only HDMI 1 supports a 4K input.

Your previous BV7 did eaxacly the same - mabey you did not notice it that much.

You probably had set it to not move, when playing 'only audio'.

The tv with its processing of the sound etc was with the BV7 the center/brain of your setup - and so is it with the Avant.

One difference is that the speaker is hidden and has to be 'released'. From what other people tell (in other threads) this is because the WiSA sender is located behind the grille.  Some people feel annoyed by this - others don't mind. Has been discussed several times here before.

The screen turns on - but dimmed - because it is used for the feedback/the infos of e.g. connected sources. Again, some aren't pleased with this, others welcome it, because they want to see 'what is going on'. However it is easy turn turn it off - just use the P.Mute command.

i know a lot of hardcore BV7 users favorite having the display on the (right) screen side and the screen unused/blank, but using the panel gives room for extended informations. I guess that having the display on the right side of the panel was a pretty expensive solution - and it made the screen overall bigger.

To me the behaviour of the Avant is no big deal - maybe you will get used to it.

As for the 4K upscaling. I would prefer to let the Avant do the upscaling. It probably does a better job.

Leave the HDMI 1 for a future native 4K device.

MM

Some points from me regarding your statement, dear MM:

1. If I want to listen to music from a ML device connected to NL-BV (via ML/NL converter), I only want to switch on the Beolabs connected to BV. There is no need to switch on the screen or to move the speaker at the Avant. This is the way how a ML-BV works and this is perfect.

2. If WISA is the reason why the speaker moves at the Avant this behavior should be suppressed if the speakers are connected via Powerlink wires.

3. There is no need to get the info at a Beovision which ML audio source is working. The display at BV 7 is just a nice gimmick; if you use a BV 10 as video master without such a display, the screen doesn't switch on too.

4. The real reason of this annoying behavior of the Avant is the fact that the Avant (and all other NL-BVs) is not able to be switched on in audio mode without switching on the screen. I guess this is not a software bug, the software developers are simply not able to program this feature.

5. B&O should add in FAQs: Q: If I want to replace my ML-BV by a NL-BV in my masterlink system by using a ML/NL converter, can I use the NL-BV the same way like a ML-BV? A: NO, you will miss many features!

Regards

Räuber

As I am very happy with how my Masterlink system works, but have also been considering new NL products, this thread is very interesting. With respect to point number 5 above, that is very disappointing. As for point 3, there is one exception to the BV10 not displaying sources. If one switches from a video source to an audio source, it will display the audio source on the BV10 screen briefly. Also, switching audio sources after that will, at least for some period of time,  cause the new selected source to be briefly displayed on the BV10 screen.

Hello Razlaw,

regarding point 3, you are absolutely correct.

And don't forget this point with a NL-BV:

It's not possible to listen to a source of NL-BV in linkrooms if you use another source in mainroom. This is a key feature for me with my BV 7. On a NL-BV only one single source can be active. When my wife is e.g. watching TV in mainroom, I can in my two linkrooms:

1. Listen to airplayed music from Apple TV,

2. Listen to music from Chromecast audio (Spotify and TuneIn radio),

3. Listen to CD from internal Blueray player,

4. Listen to radio from settop box connected to BV 7,

5. Watching Blueray or DVD from internal Blueray player,

6. Watching recordings from harddisk of settop box.

This is real multiroom. With a NL-BV you can only listen to the same source actually used in mainroom or any source if NL-BV is in standby.

That's why it is absolutely no option for me replacing my BV 7 by a NL-BV!

Regards

Räuber

Hi Räuber,

you have made your point (which I already knew).

As I wrote - some like it so, others different!

In a NL setup there is no 'audio mode' - there are sources!

If you have a NL multiroom setup, you have the sources local too e.g. on an A6 or an Essence (2nd gen).

Combining NL and ML (using the converter) may bring about some limitation, if you compare this to a pure ML setup. However a NL multiroom setup is way more flexible, because you can use one source in one or more rooms and you can use another source in one or more rooms etc. etc. (I am sure you have seen the video about this). You can use the sources across the network - you are not limited to having a master and a slave/link device situation.

In most cases it even doesn't require pulling cables all around your house!

You are used to a specific behaviour in your household, which might be totally ok.

But that doesn't mean, that a NL multiroom setup in many other cases will be the first choice.

By the way - to 3: I don't agree with you on that.

MM

Raeuber:

Hello Razlaw,

 

 

regarding point 3, you are absolutely correct.

 

 

And don't forget this point with a NL-BV:

 

 

It's not possible to listen to a source of NL-BV in linkrooms if you use another source in mainroom. This is a key feature for me with my BV 7. On a NL-BV only one single source can be active. When my wife is e.g. watching TV in mainroom, I can in my two linkrooms:

 

 

1. Listen to airplayed music from Apple TV,

 

2. Listen to music from Chromecast audio (Spotify and TuneIn radio),

 

3. Listen to CD from internal Blueray player,

 

4. Listen to radio from settop box connected to BV 7,

 

5. Watching Blueray or DVD from internal Blueray player,

 

6. Watching recordings from harddisk of settop box.

 

 

This is real multiroom. With a NL-BV you can only listen to the same source actually used in mainroom or any source if NL-BV is in standby.

 

 

That's why it is absolutely no option for me replacing my BV 7 by a NL-BV!

 

 

Regards

 

 

Räuber

Very good points. I recently discussed adding some NL products with a dealer. The advice was 1. Apple routers are not good enough, have a commercial grade home network installed. 2. If possible, hard wire all of the NL products together instead of using wifi. 3. Consider using my current ML products as stand alone items, not connected to the ML or NL.  I am sure at some point I will venture into the NL world. But right now it seems like a lot of effort and expense with some diminishing returns, unless there is an overriding desire or need for a new Beovision.

 

Hi MM,

You say: "In a NL setup there is no 'audio mode' - there are sources!"

But why you can't assign a source as 'audio source' on a NL-BV? Why the screen switches on if you only want to listen to some music? It's possible to mute the picture after switching on a NL-BV, so why on earth it's not possible to switch on a NL-BV without the screen? And why the screen of a NL-BV switches on if you want to listen to a song in another room? I'm sure it's possible to provide software updates to solve these issues. It should also possible to realize using different sources with a NL-BV at the same time; possible with ML-BVs for so many years.

You say in a NL-setup the audio sources are available on all devices. It's obviously clear you can listen to any of these sources in different rooms then. But therefore you don't need the devices be netlinked at all, you can use all decices standalone to reach this goal!

With my masterlink setup I can listen to all sources (connected to BV7 or fitted into BV7) in mainroom and linkrooms. If I want this can be the same audio source in all rooms without sound delay, of course. The only limitation is that I cannot listen to different audio sources of BV7 in my two linkrooms because ML can only provide one audio signal; in this case I have to use an audio source located in linkroom.

So all in all I cannot see any advantage of NL over ML (beside the masterlink wires to connect all rooms). But I can actually see so many disadvantages of NL, but I guess they could be solved by software updates in the future. Except video distribution that I use often with my masterlink system, although it's not HD.

Greets

Räuber

Razlaw:

Very good points. I recently discussed adding some NL products with a dealer. The advice was 1. Apple routers are not good enough, have a commercial grade home network installed. 2. If possible, hard wire all of the NL products together instead of using wifi. 3. Consider using my current ML products as stand alone items, not connected to the ML or NL. I am sure at some point I will venture into the NL world. But right now it seems like a lot of effort and expense with some diminishing returns, unless there is an overriding desire or need for a new Beovision.

And this 'overriding desire or need for a new Beovision' will only come true with a Beovision with 4K, OLED and HDR; maybe in 2025...

The advise to connect all NL products by hard wires destroys the main advantage of NL over ML. In my house even not possible because my router is located in the basement without any chance to lay wires. And if it's not possible to realize NL by WiFi without dropouts during music listening there is something wrong with Netlink technology!

Regards

Räuber

BTW, dear Razlaw,

I know you considered to buy an Essence, me too. Finally I bought the new Chromecast audio and connected it to BV7 (cinch input of AV5). I can highly recommend this cheap (only 39 EUR) and simple solution. You only need an IPad/IPhone/Tablet and you can listen to Spotify (Connect) and TuneIn radio. I use A-DTV2 command on Beo4 to switch on BV7 in audio mode. The sound quality is superb, I can't hear any difference to a CD.

Regards

Räuber

I can add to this...

Last night I set a timer on my BS3000 for 6am this morning. The radio came on but no sound - it didn't power up the TV. The TV has no concept of a timer from what I can see in any of the setup options. 

 

With the BV7, I set the timer on the TV as the BS3000 wouldn't let you set a timer when setup as A.OPT = 0.

 

With the Avant, my BS3000 is still set as A.OPT = 0, but I am able to set the timer on the BS3000 now.

 

Did I miss something? 

Brent:

I can add to this...

Last night I set a timer on my BS3000 for 6am this morning. The radio came on but no sound - it didn't power up the TV. The TV has no concept of a timer from what I can see in any of the setup options. 

 

With the BV7, I set the timer on the TV as the BS3000 wouldn't let you set a timer when setup as A.OPT = 0.

 

With the Avant, my BS3000 is still set as A.OPT = 0, but I am able to set the timer on the BS3000 now.

 

Did I miss something? 

When I was talking to my dealer about NL products, I asked if the timer in the BV7 would activate NL products. I was told no, and also no for the other way around. 

 

 

Raeuber:

BTW, dear Razlaw,

 

 

I know you considered to buy an Essence, me too. Finally I bought the new Chromecast audio and connected it to BV7 (cinch input of AV5). I can highly recommend this cheap (only 39 EUR) and simple solution. You only need an IPad/IPhone/Tablet and you can listen to Spotify (Connect) and TuneIn radio. I use A-DTV2 command on Beo4 to switch on BV7 in audio mode. The sound quality is superb, I can't hear any difference to a CD.

 

 

Regards

Thanks! I will consider that. Right now my Beosound 5 is working well for me although it does not connect to my V1 and there is a N. Radio station on the BS5 that I wish I could get on the V1. 

 

 

Räuber

 

if the screen is used for feedback then shouldn't it display the RDS info from the radio? I notice that it will only show the station position number, not station name nor frequency.

And I also guess that the AV function is gone now too with the Avant? For those of you who do not know what I mean... With the BV7 I can go LIST then AV and then press the function that would only turn on the audio component of the TV. My use case is AV then the button that turns on the Apple TV and I would AirPlay Music from my phone.

I see that the Avant has an option to be a Renderer but I haven't managed to work that part out.

 

 

 

Brent:

if the screen is used for feedback then shouldn't it display the RDS info from the radio? I notice that it will only show the station position number, not station name nor frequency.

Hello Brent,

yes, the name of the radio station is only shown on display of the audio device (e.g. BS 9000), on the display of video master (ML-Beovision) only the station position number is shown.

Räuber

Brent:

And I also guess that the AV function is gone now too with the Avant? For those of you who do not know what I mean... With the BV7 I can go LIST then AV and then press the function that would only turn on the audio component of the TV. My use case is AV then the button that turns on the Apple TV and I would AirPlay Music from my phone.

Hi Brent,

with BV 7 (and other ML-BV) the AV command works fine to switch up BV in audio-only-mode without switching on the screen.

With NL-BV you can't use AV command. You have to switch on the screen first and then use P.MUTE. Very annoying!

Räuber

 

with BV 7 (and other ML-BV) the AV command works fine to switch up BV in audio-only-mode without switching on the screen.

 

 

Hi Rauber,

- any ML-BV? Unfortunately i do not get this,working on my last edition of my BV6-26's with the apple tv connected to HDMI, the tv starts up but i don't get any sound (using airplay). This works perfectly on my bv7, bv 10-50/32.

- i full agree, very annoying! This because the people nowadays developping b&o sw and products never got to experience or live/lived with former ML setups and/or do not wish to see the advantages. I eg use it a lot to put on the images of my camera's (my daughters playroom or the driveway when you're expecting someone) on the tv and then press av cd/spotify/radio. This impresses still a lot of people.  I think the more people request it at B&o the more chance we have to get it this integrated in the NL-BV's.

kr

 

F