ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Puncher: Paul W: It seems to me, that none of these products are actually ENRICHING people's lives. Maybe you guys should stop being so shallow and materialistic and life more simply and appreciate the simpler things in life. Seriously, it's very sickening reading your comments. Shallow shallow shallow people! Gross in fact! I'm limping out of semi-retirement to comment! Over recent years you Sir, have been probably the main culprit for Brand Name dropping in every other word in every sentence!!! If I could be bothered I'd root through some old threds to find sentences constructed of nothing other than brand names!! I can only assume you've either found religion or else joined a cult!
Paul W: It seems to me, that none of these products are actually ENRICHING people's lives. Maybe you guys should stop being so shallow and materialistic and life more simply and appreciate the simpler things in life. Seriously, it's very sickening reading your comments. Shallow shallow shallow people! Gross in fact!
It seems to me, that none of these products are actually ENRICHING people's lives. Maybe you guys should stop being so shallow and materialistic and life more simply and appreciate the simpler things in life. Seriously, it's very sickening reading your comments. Shallow shallow shallow people! Gross in fact!
I'm limping out of semi-retirement to comment! Over recent years you Sir, have been probably the main culprit for Brand Name dropping in every other word in every sentence!!!
If I could be bothered I'd root through some old threds to find sentences constructed of nothing other than brand names!!
I can only assume you've either found religion or else joined a cult!
I am going to limit myself to agreeing with Puncher.
Nothing that I type in response to Paul W comes out right.
Graham.
Chris: I took the step to B&O merely of the quality they provided years ago, the good old tube Avant. No other brand could deliver that picture quality in those years and I payed with pleasure the amount of money it cost. One thing led to another, was there any brand with a multiroom sound system (ML link) in those days who could deliver the same simplicity of use and interactivity? No, so that was my natural next step... Now I'm stucked with a lot of B&O goods and I entered the digital age once more with B&O. All back from a same perspective, simplicity, interactivity... but now I experience it don't deliver me anymore the same quality in electronics as it did years ago. It still looks wonderfully but I have the feeling the internals are made in Ali Baba factories. Poured into a beautiful jacket, and sold at a premium price to keep the name and factory going. The question to me is, would I invest again in B&O as a first starter in 2016, definitely its a No Go. Don't understand me wrong, I still enjoy everyday my BL 8000, BL2000, ... and the sound they deliver and I'm not planning to change them. But there are at present standalone and multiroom sound systems who deliver the same satisfactory for a lot less money. To compare, a Rolex is today still delivering at least the same quality as it did some hundred years ago.
I took the step to B&O merely of the quality they provided years ago, the good old tube Avant. No other brand could deliver that picture quality in those years and I payed with pleasure the amount of money it cost.
One thing led to another, was there any brand with a multiroom sound system (ML link) in those days who could deliver the same simplicity of use and interactivity? No, so that was my natural next step...
Now I'm stucked with a lot of B&O goods and I entered the digital age once more with B&O. All back from a same perspective, simplicity, interactivity... but now I experience it don't deliver me anymore the same quality in electronics as it did years ago. It still looks wonderfully but I have the feeling the internals are made in Ali Baba factories. Poured into a beautiful jacket, and sold at a premium price to keep the name and factory going.
The question to me is, would I invest again in B&O as a first starter in 2016, definitely its a No Go.
Don't understand me wrong, I still enjoy everyday my BL 8000, BL2000, ... and the sound they deliver and I'm not planning to change them. But there are at present standalone and multiroom sound systems who deliver the same satisfactory for a lot less money.
To compare, a Rolex is today still delivering at least the same quality as it did some hundred years ago.
So the condemnation has progressed from occasional mechanical or electrical component failure to software failure ( or poorly developed software only evident after some hours of use)? And B&O no longer has a USP?
Graham
BeoGreg:Let's talk of the Apple watch accurancy after a few years/dives/tennis matches/golfs/saunas...
BeoNut since '75
Chris Hassell:B&O brings great pleasure to me and it's very much about being materialistic yeah. I work hard and am lucky enough that I can 'play' with such toys. I'm not into much else materialistic; cars aren't my thing etc. But for whatever reason I'm very much into the B&O brand. Fully aware how shallow that is but that doesn't stop me enjoying 'playing' with them, loving the sound and vision they provide and the design effort put into them. I still enjoy switching on my BV11 2 years after getting it. That to me makes it 'worth it' if you're lucky enough to be able to indulge. BV11-46, Beoplay A2, H3 ANC, Beo 4, Beoplay S8, Beosound Essence MkII
Well, just last night I spent more than 2 hours listening to music on my BeoLabs 5 (bought through Lee a few years ago), with a renewed sense of delight. What fantastic speakers they are, indeed! I should actually get another pair.
So I am sure I will ALWAYS cherish them, as long as I do not give in buying the BeoLab 90... ;)
With the newer stuff - not so much... It is not build to last. Take my BeoPlay 8 (w/ Airplay) for example: the other day, I tried to buy an adaptor for my iPhone 6: it is not even possible to order it anymore!!?!
You mean this?
elephant:I am now officially jealous 🐸 BeoNut since '75
And that comes from a person, who only a few years ago looooved his Dolce &Gabbana leather bag for his iPhone, and his Paul Smith designer toothbrush, and, and, and... And now we should all stop being so materialistic and appreaciate the simpler Things in life... Paul has seen the Light - Hallelujah...Not the first time that Paul has made a 180 degree turn, and it won't be the last...At least he's consistent when it comes to one thing - he feels sickened when people do not agree with his way of life...whatever that may be.
Next week he has probably found a new meaning of life - again...
LOL! It's the journey, not the destination...
B&O products are V1-32, BS2, H95, E8 and an Essence remote.11-46 now replaced with Sony A90J 65”, Sony HT-A9, Sony UBP-X800M2 and Sony SRS-NS7.
vikinger:And B&O no longer has a USP?
Hi Graham
I’m defining USP to “what you have that competitors don’t.”
If we took as an example the symbiosis between converging different materials, then B&O is an absolute winner. No one is mixing aluminium with wood in to such an appealing form. B&O is still outstanding furniture to have in your home, no matter if its 30 or more years old, the looks is timeless.
On the flip side, I’m extremely disappointed on the inside. Integrating in those wonderful encasements are now some cheap, low leveled electronic parts. One example: the Jukebox Tablet, is connecting to my wireless with a cheap USISH wifi module. Even my retired 20 years old phone realizes a more stabile connection. And be honest, B&O software engineers are struggling and jumping behind the rest of the IT-world. They don't even get closer.
This is off course my personal opinion and a comparison of the quality in electronics parts they used in earlier days.
PS.: don't refer now to the BL90, thats a different level, designed with a view 'money is not an issue'. Not many people can afford this pearl.
"Believe nothing you read and only half of what you see, let your ears tell you the truth."
Seems that it has taken less than one month for many BV14 owners to have gone through the 'Buy Praise Condemn' cycle!
The way I think many minds work:
Each stage offers a different emotional reaction, the reaction to "want" is over powering and can drive to a purchase or craving, the "initial ownership" is one of joy and happiness as you have purchased what you wanted and it satisfies your emotional wants and needs and then you have "lived it" you realise after a period of time it does not satisfy your needs or has not lived up to your expectations in satisfying your needs.
I'm always amazed on some websites where buyers offer 5 Star reviews as soon as they have bought and unwrapped their product, a true barometer would be for a review after 3, 6 & 12mths of ownership..
we tend to forget there is more to design than designing.
Perhaps aspirational is a better word than Materialistic - I have no problem with either and actually I really enjoy the shared moment when someone has worked hard and purchased something they really want for themselves. I would say that we are not Materialistic but rather apirational and enjoy the finer things in life.
I have no idea why Paul W comments in such an unappreciative, uneducated, narrow minded, derogatory way, seeking only to stir things up with daft comments for a brand he has little time for - unless he has nothing better to do with his time, which frankly is a little sad!
Suggest that his comments are simply ignored rather than paid any attention too - as I have just done!
Mr 10Percent:Buy.....praise....condemn. See this a lot. Luxury cars, carbon fibre bikes, watches, cameras, B&O and so on. Bottom line is a lot of this stuff costs big money and some people are genuinely too quick to buy out of compulsion, they fail to evaluate properly what they are buying. Buyers remorse etc.. I mean, wrt B&O, I've casually gone into a shop after seeing an A2. Bought it there and then. Never really use it and its under the bed 350 days a year and only comes out if I'm on vacation. Does it have a good sound? Its OK I guess. Do I regret buying it? No. Not at all. Was it a good buy? Well I've done better if I'm honest. However, life is too short and I don't have to worry about that one too much. But there are people that do regret going through that process and do get remorse. Now buying something that would really hurt me big time financially - you can bet I'll get to know every aspect of what I'm buying upfront and centre and of I then still get it wrong......is it me or is it the product I just bought? Alot of people just dont do their homework and generally blame something other than themselves.
A lot of people don't really know themselves fully, so how can they be expected to make good buying decisions? If you don't understand yourself and why you want things, you're probably going to be unpleasantly surprised at times when Brand X didn't suddenly make you handsomer, prettier, more socially accepted, whatever. Or as you say, buying without thinking and realizing the device isn't what you expected or wanted/needed. Oh the humanity! People are fallible, and they usually blame the product not themselves, though sometimes a product can be a true lemon and worthy of later derision of course.
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
It may come as a shock to some here but the (simple) secret is -
After the necessary and appropriate research, buy something that does whatever it is you want and does it well. If that thing you want is that it has to look good, then fair enough, if it needs to sound first class then that's good too. If it needs to be both (or more) then that's harder to find, but if you find what you want, then well done you!
The problems arise when you shop to impress others and then find it doesn't do what you wanted or expected, - there is no excuse, it's no one's fault but your own!
Ban boring signatures!
Didn't read this before I posted but totally agree - there are too many people worried about what other people think about what they've bought rather than seriously considering if it does what they really wanted!
Graham - I have been hit with the B&O virus for a number of years and own two complete 5500 systems, one 3300 system, two Beosound 1s (one encompasses a 4500 turntable), Beocentury (with a QDA pre-amp fitted for turntable); two spare turntables 1200 and 1202, two Beosystem 10s and a reel-to-reel and I love them all. My 5500 system in the drawing room is on every day, along with the 3300 in the study and as for the Beosystem 10s they are a constant radio source. I cannot see why people are condemning B&O as mine was built from the late 80s through to the 90s and sound better than up-to-date systems available on the market.
I was very lucky to acquire some of these systems from my late father as he was a devotee of B&O.
The key is that if you can locate a brilliant company who will service and repair your equipment, and you have faith in that company doing, it is bye bye problems, hello great sound. I have been lucky in Quality Dream Audio who service and repair any faults that I have in my systems at very reasonable costs.
As a music teacher I play my classical vinyl on a daily basis so it is important for me to have reliable equipment, and I have found the systems I have meet that.
I have in the past, asked the forums about certain problem issues I was experiencing, but found that many of the replies turned out to be most helpful. It all depends on how you acquired your system or item, I always find if you purchase any B&O equipment from a reliable seller, you will experience very little, if any, operating problems.
ProfDFlynn
Professor David A Flynn JP LM
Right on Puncher...I've never shopped for things in order to impress anyone else, my sole reason for buying anything, from clothing to watches to cars and stereos, is if I liked it, and my tastes are most decidedly not mainstream. I remember right after I'd bought my first Mustang GT, a bunch of us from work were standing around looking at it, and this one guy walks over (I vaguely knew him, not my dept) and started going on and on about how, well, HE wouldn't buy such a piece of junk, the new twin turbo Mazda RX-7 was a far far superior car (at over 3 times the price). Then he sniffs, walks away, and we see him getting into a complete junker of an old Volvo that looked like if he hit a bump it'd fall apart and sounded almost as bad. Go figure.
And Prof, yes, I can see your point. I used to churn audio gear a lot, never being quite satisfied. When I bought my first B&O setup, BS9000 and BL8000s, I started listening to and enjoying music without obsessing over the hardware, and just really enjoyed owning something that was such a striking piece of design. My collection is larger now, but the BS9000 and BL8000s are used daily, along with my BL9s. Timeless, classic modernist design and great performance, and at least so far outstanding reliability. Knock on aluminum!
Agree with Puncher - we should be buying to please ourselves (and reward ourselves) rather than others - most of my friends ridicule my BV8-32 for being too small but admit that it is nice to look at - if I wanted a bigger TV I would get one and it would be B&O rather than the makes they have with all the remote controls and flimsy build quality. They say that it is a waste of money and over priced when you get a Panasonic 60" for a third of the price - but it is my love of B&O design and performance that will keep me coming back rather than what anyone else thinks, its the same with Jacob Jensen kettle and toaster - despite what they say in the press they work really well and I've had them years - sure they cost more but I like them, same with Rolex etc. etc. etc. An old saying is you get what you pay for and if it makes you happy, well what harm is there in that. Some will buy to impress others of that there is no doubt but I would imagine most people base spending their hard earned cash on what they want.
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
Chris Townsend:So none of have ever looked at a car, and thought "yeah that's me" Personally I don't give a toss what it or I looks like from the outside, when I'm sat on the inside which nobody ever seems to be bothered about. But loads of people including a lot of the posters here I guarantee , will base one of their biggest financial decisions....on what they'll look like in it whilst driving by complete strangers etc I used to work with a buyer who thought my selections of what I thought we should stock, were simply based too much upon "brands", and that she hates "brands" I therefore asked her if she wouldn't mind me taking off the BMW badge on her car, and replacing it with a Rover badge then! Guess what? Everyone has brands/items they are proud of and show off in some way or another. For some, it might even be their body
Personally I don't give a toss what it or I looks like from the outside, when I'm sat on the inside which nobody ever seems to be bothered about. But loads of people including a lot of the posters here I guarantee , will base one of their biggest financial decisions....on what they'll look like in it whilst driving by complete strangers etc
I used to work with a buyer who thought my selections of what I thought we should stock, were simply based too much upon "brands", and that she hates "brands"
I therefore asked her if she wouldn't mind me taking off the BMW badge on her car, and replacing it with a Rover badge then! Guess what?
Everyone has brands/items they are proud of and show off in some way or another. For some, it might even be their body
I laughed yesterday after reading the recent "car" thred. I've just bough a hatchback for commuting - it came down to a shootout between the A3 Sportback or the Ford Focus. After driving both I went for the Focus Toilet! - it was a nicer place to sit, drove better and was quieter on the road.
I tend to spend more time driving it than I do looking at it out of the window!
Puncher: I laughed yesterday after reading the recent "car" thred. I've just bough a hatchback for commuting - it came down to a shootout between the A3 Sportback or the Ford Focus. After driving both I went for the Focus Toilet! - it was a nicer place to sit, drove better and was quieter on the road. I tend to spend more time driving it than I do looking at it out of the window!
Some years ago I drove a Toilet at the time that a car mag admitted that it was so good that it could have sold for 50% more with a german badge on the bonnet.
Unfortunately, at about 1 year old, my toilet had a minor bump that was just enough to set off all the airbags and seat belt tensioners...... resulting in a total insurance write-off. I went out and bought back into my long standing favourite SAAB brand, a brand that GM subsequently really did put down the toilet.