ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hi Beoworlders,
My dad recently boughty a Beolab 7.2, to add to his Beolab 3's.What a sound!!! Dialogs (voices) are soooo crisp. Deep bass, strong mids, clear highs, excellent overall sound. (My dad had some trouble with the stereo sound, coming from the Beolab 3's while watching movies/listening to voices).
At this point, he wants to buy a new TV (can't wait untill B&O is going the LG (oled) route), so looking for a new LG Oled or Samsung Quantum 65" screen.
He wants 5.0/5.1 surround in the tv-room, and because the TV will be a non-b&o model, we are looking for a decent AV-Receiver to do the job.
He want his Beolab 3's a front left and right channel, the Beolab 7.2 as center channel and two Beovox C75's as surrounds/rears.Yes, C75's!!! He bought them second hand in mint condition last month and made two selfmade/designed floor stands for them.The black 'base' is in the same design/dimensions as his beolab 8000's (in another part of the room).They look sóóó good with these floorstands:
I've looked at several av-receivers and found the Marantz SR5010 suitable (very good price at the moment and does everything he wants).We need to connect the Beolab 3's, the Beolab 7.2 and the Beovox C75's to this receiver and this is where I need your help:The SR5010 has a 12v trigger output, which I want to use to trigger the Beolab's on/off.I don't want to use a 220v triggering kit, like Steve from Soundsheavenly sells (I have this triggering kit lying around, but don't want to use it, because I want all Beolab's go on when I switch on the receiver automatically.(@Steve from Soundsheavenly: Do u also sell rca to powerlink cables with the 12v trigger jackphone connectors?)Which adapter cables should I buy? What options do I have? Only 'Powmasscables'?(We live in The Netherlands)And how can I connect the Beolab 7.2? Because this is 'stereo-speaker' (has build in left and right channel amps). Can I use a simple 1xmale rca to 2xfemale rca splitter cable, together with a triggering cable to make this a dedicated center speaker, with these wiring:+?
Thanks,
Tim
Maybe this solutions will bring some anwers: http://www.beomac.com/toepassing/ander-merk-tv-aansluiten-en-geluid-via-b-o-speaker/
Living Room: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-2 (Center), Beolab 9 (Fronts), Beolab 8000 (Rears), no Subwoofer. Screen: Sony KD-85XH9096Dining Room: Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 4000 on stands, fed by Amazon Echo Show 8Home Cinema: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-4 (Center), Beolab 1 (Fronts), Beolab 4000 (Rears). Projector: Sony VPL-HW55Home Office: Beosystem 3, Beolab 7-4, Beolab 5000, Screen: Sony KD-55XH9005 on Beovision 7-40 stand, ML to Beosound 9000 MK3 and Beosound 5/Beomaster 5 (1 TB SSD version)Bedroom: Sony KD-65XH9077, Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 6002 and Beolab 11 (all white, wall-mounted)
In storage: Beolab 5000/Beomaster 5000 (1960s).
@Playlink: Your link brings me to some Almando products. This isn't what I need. My dad bought a Marantz SR5010 receiver and we wan't to connect the described beolab speakers to it, using the correct converter-cables.
@kallasr: Yes! I found your thread yesterday and showed it to my dad. Your setup is almost the same as what I want for my dad.The only difference is the way you connect your center speaker:
You connected two Beolab 4000's and I guess you looped the second 4000 with a powerlink cable to the first 4000, so they work as 'one' center speaker.
My main question is about how I should connect the Beolab 7.2 so it uses both internal amps to play the same center channel.Will my described solution work (with the 1xmale rca to 2xfemale rca splitter cable, together with a triggering cable, showed in my pictures)?And what about the Beolab 3's, will they be 'humm-free' if I use the audio+trigger cables from http://www.powmascables.com/contents/en-us/d56_Kabels-voor-aansluiting-aan-receiver.html ?@Steve (from Soundsheavenly): If you read this, do you also have sell the correct cables for my described setup / do you have any advise?
Hi Tim,
Thanks for your enquiry. I do sometimes get asked about whether Beolab 7 and Beolab 2 speakers can be triggered from the 12v output of non-B&O receivers and I did look into this in some detail recently. The first thing I did was to speak to the Technical Support departments at a number of the receiver manufacturers (including Yamaha, Onkyo and Denon) to determine the specifications for the 12v outputs on their receivers.
One thing that quickly became clear was that none of the companies I spoke to provided a trigger output that was suitable for use directly triggering Beolab speakers in this manner. This is because trigger cables of the type in your photos will short circuit the negative leg of the receiver trigger output to audio ground when the speaker is connected. Each receiver manufacturer told me that connecting their receiver in this way would void their warranty and could potentially cause equipment damage.
Hence, I only provide trigger cables with a separate supply for the trigger voltage at the moment. I am looking into producing a fully isolated trigger adapter that will safely convert the receiver trigger for use with Beolab speakers, but this is a few months away from production.
I would advise caution if you are looking to trigger your speakers directly from a non-B&O receiver output. Please ensure that you check with the receiver manufacturer before going ahead. If someone else tells you that this is "safe", please remember that each receiver model behaves differently, so your receiver may not be wired in the same way as theirs. Just because they haven't had a problem doesn't mean that you won't. If you purchase a product that claims to safely trigger your speakers from a receiver, please ensure that the seller has tested your receiver and that they will fully insure you against any problems.
The completely safe option is to trigger the speakers separately from an independent voltage source - you lose the automatic control of the speakers from the receiver, but you can sleep soundly knowing that there won't be an expensive fault on your receiver caused by untested wiring.......
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but I want to ensure that the cables and advice that I offer don't result in expensive damage to anyone's equipment!
Kind regards, Steve.
Steve.
www.soundsheavenly.com
Founder of Sounds Heavenly Cables and Brand Ambassador for Bang & Olufsen
Sounds Heavenly are proud to sponsor BeoWorld!
Please check out my YouTube channel at https://youtube.com/soundsheavenlycables
@Steve:
Thank you for you detailed answer.I know that powmasscables is one of your 'competitors' and I understand that you can't judge their cables/designs, but the only real difference is that they use a 12v (with internal stepdown to 5v) triggering on pin 4 and u use a 220v to 5vdc adapter to pin4.Theoretical: If I would cut the 220v adapter on your triggering-kit (I have one, because I used it in a former setup in my own house), and solder a 3.5mm jackphone with a 12v>5v stepdown to it, your cable will be the 'same' as the powmasscables/av-connection designed cables. Am I correct?
What would be the downside? Triggering is triggering... Original B&O equipment also sends 5v to pin 4 to turn beolab speakers on, nothing fancy....? Any forummembers who use the powmasscable design triggering cables? Do they 100% work? No humm, etc.?
And Steve, 'if' I decide to buy you triggering kit (I have one, and need at leas one extra, so I can connect both beolab 3's and the beolab 7.2), instead of the 12v kits from your competitors (because you are telling me that this is the more 'safe' route), would a MASTER/SLAVE-socket be a solution to trigger your 220v to 5v adapters automatically when I switch on the AV-receiver?So something like this:
And apart from the 220v vs 12v triggering cables, what do u suggest to make the beolab 7.2 a dedicated center speaker? How to connect it to a rca pre-out (on a av-receiver), so both internal amps (left and right channel) in the beolab 7.2 are used for the same mono center channel? Should I use a simple 1xmale rca to 2xfemale rca splitter cable for this?
I think in this case, the safe option is to use the "Master/Slave" remote control mains power sockets that you suggested.
I apologise if my first post was a bit long-winded. To summarise this:-
1) Triggering Beolab speakers directly from a receiver may damage the receiver
2) Each receiver model is different, so even if this works with one receiver, it may not be safe with your receiver.
3) Using a separate mains supply to trigger the speakers avoids the risk of receiver problems.
Hope this helps.
Thanks Steve.I will test the new ordered Marantz SR5010 receiver with the triggering kit I already have (from soundsheavenly), together with a master/slave-socket.If it works, I will order a second triggering kit from you, so I can connect both the BL3's and the BL7.2On the other hand, Why does your 'competitor' sell dozens of 12v triggering cables if it 'could' damage the receiver...Are there any forummembers who use the mentioned cables and can give their opinion?
Can you also answer my other asked question? ->
Sorry I missed your other question
You can either use the Beolab 7-2 as a mono speaker in the receiver centre channel output (via the RCA splitter to feed mono sound to both channels), or you can connect this to the Front Left/Front Right channels of the receiver instead to play in stereo. In this case, please set "Center = Off" in the receiver menu and move your mains stereo speakers from the Front Left/Front Right channels to the Surround Left/Surround Right channels instead.
Hi,
In regards to triggering I use one of Powmas trigger RCA to PL on my set up which works fantastic, flick on system all speakers trigger on and stay on. Once down hit standby and immediately the speakers go to standby. I too also considered that Almando box as well but since I have a tigger socket, it's not required in my case.
At least with my set up I have zero issues like grounding noise or cross talk and yes I have a non b&o TV (LG oled) and pre amp / DAC (Rotel).
For me everything I use is via an apple TV so chain is follows:
Apple TV toslink > Rotel tosink in > Rotel pre out RCA + 12v trigger > Powmas RCA to PL > Beolab 2 PL, Beolab 2 PL x2 > Beolab 8000 PL.
As an added bonus I can Airplay lossless or mp3 audio from my iMac or phone to the apple tv without even having to switch on the tele.
Your Marantz appears to have a 12v trigger so I'm pretty sure that Powmas trigger cable will work. Ask Mr. Ligthart from them to be sure.
@davidr: thanks for your reaction.
Good to hear the powmass cables work 100% on your setup. I will let my dad decide which cables he wants to buy. I prefer the powmass cables, because of the auto triggering, but the soundsheavenly cables could also work when I add the described master-slave socket to do the 220v triggering...
I will let you know which triggering cables we are going to order next week and how they will sound and work in combination with the Marantz sr5010 receiver. First we are going to install his new delivered 65ks8000 quantum dot screen. What a beauty!!!
@Steve (soundsheavenly):I tried your triggering kit today, but when I connected the 220v adapter to them mains, the Beolabs immediately made a loud humming noise.I tried the triggering kit on the beolab 7.2 and on the beolab 3's. But the loud hum is hearable on both...
This is not good...I looked at the way you soldered the + and - wires from the 220v to 5v adapter on the REAN plug.It looks like the + wire is connected to pin 1 and pin 4 and the - wire to pin 2 and pin 7.(I have taken photo's, if you are interested) HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE? Is this correct?Ps: The humm is always there, doens't matter if I connect a source to the rca's or not.
Sorry to hear that you are having problems, the wiring should all be correct (wiring the extra pins allow the trigger to also work with Beolink Passive and MCL2P, as well as directly with Beolab speakers). Pins 1 and 4 should be linked, plus pins 2 and 7. I tested your trigger kit myself before shipping, so I know that it was working correctly.
I will email you shortly to help with your setup so that we can find out exactly what the issue is.
Hi Steve,
Thanks for your very fast answer.I can't understand why I hear the loud hum! It is also there if I connect your 220v to 5v adapter DIRECTLY into a beolab (so the REAN powerlink plug directly into a Beolab), the Beolab switches on and starts to hummmmmmm...(tested this on a beolab 8000, because this speaker had the easiest acces)
Thanks for your reply, I'm sorry to hear that you are having problems. I have sent you an email today with some ideas that should help to resolve the issue.
When you connect the power supply directly to the Beolab 8000, please can you check that the speaker was set to "Left" or "Right", not to "Line"? Giving the speaker a trigger signal when it is set to Line mode can make the speaker hum.
Are you able to try the three parts of the trigger kit (power supply, splitter and audio cable) together with one of your speakers please, with the music source connected before you power on the speaker? Again, please set the speaker to either "L" or "R", not to "Line". Please let me know how you get on and I will be pleased to assist further.
Each trigger cable is tested individually before shipping, so problems are very rare. There are many different things that can cause unexpected noises in speakers, but I will ensure that you get all the help you need to find the cause of this noise and resolve it. Thanks for your patience.
Kind regards,
@Jowus: The (pretty old) Beosystem 3 isn't what my dad was looking for. That is why whe choose a modern (sr5010) Marantz AV-Receiver.This receiver has auto hdmi switching, 4K passthrough, built in airplay, internet radio, audyssey room correction with microphone, etc.It works great with the yesterday installed new 65" ks8000 suhd Samsung tv. The Beosystem 3 'could be an option' indeed, but more modern (non-b&o) receivers have some benefits (4K passthrough being one of the biggest).The downside is that we need correct RCA to Powerlink cables, but they should work fine.
Unfortunately, I have the bad luck that I've got a cable that makes all beolab humm, so have to sort this.
The Beolab (switch) is set correctly to Left or Right (I tested it on the BL8000's, both BL3's and the BL7.2 in my dad's house), not to line.I tested it on the bl3's and ont the bl7.2, fully wired with an rca audio signal, but the loud hum is always there.I even plugged your 100-240v to 5v adapter DIRECTLY into a beolab (so the REAN powerlink plug directly into a Beolab), the Beolab switches on and starts to hummmmmmm...(tested this on a beolab 8000, because this speaker had the easiest acces in my dads house.)
If you plug the mentioned adapter (the ones you have in store) directly into a beolab, it should be 'completely silent', only switching the beolab on. Can you test this for me please? (I know there is a very little humm/noise, coming from each beolab tweeter if they are on without playing music, but this is only hearable from 10cm away and this is not the loud hum I mean. That very soft 'hum', some even can't hear it at all, is always there, also in full b&o setups).
I'm very sorry to hear about this problem. Some Beolab speakers (with digital ICE Power amplifiers) may hum a little if a trigger voltage (from any voltage source) is connected directly to the speakers without an audio source connected, but there should not be any humming when the power supply and audio source are connected. I will get a replacement power supply tested and posted out to you in the morning so that we can get a better idea of what is happening. Please let me know how you get on when this arrives.
@ Steve:
Hi Steve,I made a mistake. The Marantz receiver wasn't connected to the mains yet (we bought it new and are still installing all the components).When I connected the receiver to the mains, the hum was 100% gone.So your triggering kit is working correctly, but only when all components are connected. So if I only connect the triggering kit directly to a beolab, the hum excists...So all is good. My fault...We are going to order a extra triggering kit in your shop, because we need two (one for the beolab 7.2 as center and one for the beolab 3's as fronts).Thanks for all your service!Tim
PS: Today we tested the new bought Marantz SR5010 for the first time (only with front and rear speakers connected, without center channel, because we only have one triggering kit at this moment) -> It works great. The Marantz sounds very good/clear/audiophile in combination with the connected b&o speakers.The Marantz works excellent with the stylish small remote that came with the Samsung 65ks8000 uhd tv, so only one remote is needed.Things like internet radio, spotify connect, airplay, auto hdmi switching between all sources, etc work perfect!
Thanks for your reply, that is good news - I am pleased to hear that all is working well! For the Beolab 3 speakers, you don't need a trigger kit, you can use these cables instead to connect to the receiver pre-out sockets:-
http://soundsheavenly.com/powerlink-8-pin-din-connection/105-av-processor-pre-amp-sonos-to-beolab-using-powerlink-din-sockets.html (standard cables, for the best value)
http://soundsheavenly.com/powerlink-8-pin-din-connection/62--rca-7pd-super-.html (high-end cables, for the best performance)
Please set both speakers to "Line" mode using the small switch next to the input sockets. If you choose the “standard” cables, then you need one cable for a pair of speakers, if you choose the “high end” cables, you need two cables (one cable for each speaker).
Steve at Sounds Heavenly: Hi Tim, Thanks for your reply, that is good news - I am pleased to hear that all is working well! For the Beolab 3 speakers, you don't need a trigger kit, you can use these cables instead to connect to the receiver pre-out sockets:- .........
.........
The Beolab 3's will be used for the front left and front right channel in my dads '5.0' setup.If I use your suggested cables, the speakers will switch off after (if I remember correct) 2 minutes.I had a similar setup in my old home and sometimes, in 5.1 movies, the front beolab speakers switched off because there wasn't any audio signal on them for that given time. This is because, when you have long dialogue, coming from the dedicted center channel, without extra special effects that go the the FL and FR channel, the FL and FR channel switch off.Of course, when sound is going to the FL and R channel again, the speakers switch on immediately, but you can hear them switch on and this is frustrating if this happens more than once in a movie...This is why I want to trigger them permanently on when the av receiver is on, and only off when the receiver is off.