ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
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I threw in the towel with my first Beomaster 1600, poor cosmetics, really terrible and obvious repair attempts, more body rust than I am comfortable with, and countless fried capacitors in the amplifier, which is way beyond my meager electronic skills to address.
Still, it arrived “dead” and I was able to get it to power up and interestingly enough, the FM section is still functioning. Even in its battered state, it IS rather stunning.
Today the Beomaster 1600 I found recently on eBay arrived and oboy, a few surprises. This 1600 was “supposed” to have excellent cosmetics (excellent is being too charitable, but quite good would be fair), sound (I don’t know yet as I want the amp to warm up before trying), broken belts (they aren’t), but none of the volume or tuning functions work vis-à-vis the clutches.
This came as a surprise as the seller said the “belts need repair.” He didn’t say anything about non-functioning clutches. I say surprise as my non-functioning 1600 has all its clutches working and working well.
Of course everything had to be cleaned and lubricated for this to be an accurate assessment concerning the original.
Also finding the glass cover loose was unexpected, but then the packing could have been better.
This will not be a “quickie” repair, so I will tackle this on the weekend. Hopefully I can get the clutches working properly, but worst case scenario I do have the functioning ones in my tattered and much abused original, but I would MUCH rather get these existing clutches working as I don’t know if I have the ability to swap them out.
Anyway, such thoughts are premature. I need to get “at” this 1600 to know where I stand as like my friend Søren, I like a challenge. NOT as big a challenge as Søren, but a reasonable challenge.
I am sure there will be an update or two on this project.
Jeff
Beogram 4000, Beogram 4002, Beogram 4004, Beogram 8000, Beogram 8002, Beogram 1602. Beogram 4500 CD player, B&O CDX player, Beocord 4500, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 8004, Beocord 9000, Beomaster 1000, Beomaster 1600, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 4400, Beomaster 4500, Beolab 5000, Beomaster 5000, BeoCenter 9000. BeoSound Century, S-45.2, S-45.2, S-75, S-75, M-75, M-100, MC 120.2 speakers; B&O Illuminated Sign (with crown & red logo). B&O grey & black Illuminated Sign, B&O black Plexiglas dealer sign, B&O ash tray, B&O (Orrefors) dealer award vase, B&O Beotime Clock. Navy blue B&O baseball cap, B&O T-shirt X2, B&O black ball point pen, B&O Retail Management Binder
Cant wait for the updates There is nothing we cannot do
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
Hi Søren,
This is a “teaser” update in that I only had a short time to inspect the Beomaster 1600 further, and like all these projects there is good news and bad news.
On the “good” side, I had been hearing a good deal of rattling (of broken parts) coming from inside the Beomaster and found the four offenders this morning, all inconsequential.
I also believe the cosmetics can be made perfectly acceptable with rather little trouble. I am missing two pads (feet) for the bottom and the glass panel has a 1 inch light scratch (2.5cm); neither are important. The glass also came out in transit, but it is not too difficult to get it back into proper position.
Removed various stickers with adhesive remover from repair shops and after which; compared to my original this 1600 is virtually pristine. (Close enough, although it ain’t really PRISTINE…)
The seller stated the belts needed repair, so before buying this 1600, I secured a pair from Martin. (Thank you again Martin!) However when the 1600 arrived it was clear the belts were intact. Hummm, gave me pause.
The seller also said “There is sound,” and in that he is correct.
I spent an eternity looking for my earphone adaptor so that I could test for sound, but never did find it. Finally schlepped my lone S45 speaker downstairs and discovered truly excellent sound quality, I was impressed. Not only that the tuner section was bringing NPR (National Public Radio) from Washington State clearly with NO antenna.
Suffice to say at that point I had a pretty big smile on my face. OK, time for reality.
The belts maybe fine but not a single clutch works, but with the mechanical area, I have a chance, as it lies within of skill set. None the less this came as an unwelcome surprise as my original and totally tattered 1600 has ALL of its clutches working.
I also knew right off that something was wrong as all the controls (Volume, Balance, Bass, Treble) were at the top of the sliders; no would listen to an amplifier like that. Bringing them back to a more neutral position with the balance in the middle I was delighted with what I found.
UNTIL I connected my single speaker to the left speaker and all I get is a moderate HUM. I tried both speaker 1 and speaker 2, it is the same.
I didn’t check to see how a phonograph would sound, but I think we can assume it is the left amplifier not the FM section. I sure wish I could check with earphones, but whatever.
Frede, Martin, Jacques, Ricardo, and Søren could take a 10 second look and know if any capacitors look suspicious, but I am not so gifted. However even with a close (uneducated) look everything looks close to NOS to me, no signs of leakage or physical distortion.
So much for the quickie inspection. This weekend, I will get more serious, first to get all the clutches freed-up and working (if possible), find out why all the LED’s are out on the Volume side of the BM, and lastly, look for anything that could be causing a short on the left channel. There is no hint of music from the left channel, just a low level HUM.
I don’t have high hopes to personally restore the left channel, but I haven’t given up hope either.
What about the other 1600, is both channels working there ?,
BTW, this coming weekend I will be prepacking your BL/BM 5000, I will make a thread on how to, The last part of the packing will be done in McAllen (outer boxes).
Please mail me your address and what ever needed for shipping, 1 box 12 Kg 65 x 25 x 40 cm, 1 box 9 Kg 65 x 25 x 40 cm, measurements depending on the box size I can get
I have in Mcallen UPS, Fedex and I think also DHL, and of course USPS, so tell me which one
Hi Soren,
No, the original 1600 has a working FM section, but the amp is a mess. There are numerous caps that are distorted and leaking, way beyond my meager ability to repair.The broken on/off switch and wire were repaired, but that only restored power and the LED's.
The seller of the new 1600 misinformed me by saying the belts needed repair, but that is not the case. Perhaps he meant to say that the volume and tuner sliders needed repair, but he didn't say that. I had not counted on all 11 (I think there are 11) clutches not functioning, but clutches are mechanical and I may be able to clean & lube them.
The original has ALL its clutches working, so that may be were they come from, if I can't get the new ones to function. However I am pretty certain that I can take care of the clutches, so this is not my main concern.
The seller also stated that the 1600 has sound. I didn't think to ask if he meant BOTH channels.
What has me stumped is why ALL the LED's on the left side (Volume control) are out, but all the tuner LED's work. Plus the left channel has that mild HUM, but NO sound. The hum is exactly the sound you get when you insert a RCA plug into an amp that is already on. Sounds the same when you remove the plug.
You know (really well by now) that electronics are not my specialty but I would have assumed that one or more failed caps would give silence, as I said previously, not make a HUM.
The other thing that strikes me is how PERFECT the electronics look. I am sure a cap can go bad and look fine, but everything is just as it left the factory in appearance. If anyone ever changed anything, they were an artist.
I will tackle the clutches over the weekend and look long and hard for anything amiss with the electronics.
I'll send you my address this evening vis-a-vis the BL/BM 5000.
A little more information. Spoke with the seller and he made a fairly convincing assurance that both channels functioned properly when he had it "tested," whatever exactly that means. However, I DO believe him, in part because he said he wasn't sure about the left side LED lights..... had he been covering up, he would have said that everything worked.
As such it appears the 1600 was damaged in shipment which is entirely different from aging/failing caps.
Spent 2 hours going through every room, cupboard, box, and cubby hole I could think of, but still can't find that adapter for the headphones, so I could check the sound.
In any case a broken solder point (or two) is easier to find and correct as compared to a fully electronic diagnosis, which I could never perform properly.
Will report back after the weekend.
I found a broken part, I can't read the number on the schematic but here is a picture. Will get to the clutches after lunch, but I would really love to know what part this is, as it has literally broken in half.
Thanks!
Sorry guys, please NOTE the part number is clearly shown on the board R222.
I need my morning coffee.
Jeff check your mail please
Burned emitter resistor.= Blown output stage.Replace the two output stage darlingtons, both emitter resistors and preferably the remaining semiconductors in that circuit.
Martin
EDIT. Second attempt at posting this.Frankly, these timeouts are getting annoying.
Thank you Martin, you are indeed a "treasure."
This amp has the mellow sound quality that I so enjoy [Beomaster 4500] but I know it is a combination of failing caps/resistors and that is never good for the long haul.
I will adhere to your suggestions sans exception.