ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
If You are making use of Twonky Server from the QNAP App Center on their NAS then beware of that they have dropped the support for Twonky Server in the current beta v4.3.x and moving forward. Quoting a brief response that I got from the QNAP support after that I realized that Twonky isn't no longer combatible with the current beta:
"After 4.3.x, Twonky service is not available on NAS system. For DLNA service, we will suggest please apply the built-in DLNA service and install media streaming add-on app on App center for advanced management too."
Depending on what QNAP NAS you have, you can quickly overcome this issue by making use of the ContainerStation and run a dedicated Twonky Server to support the BeoSound Moment. The container solution dosn't add any significant overhead compared using the twonky server from the app center.
Livingroom: BL3, BL11, BV11-46 Kitchen: Beosound 1 GVA, Beocom 2 Bathroom: M3 Homeoffice: M3, Beocom 2 Library: Beosound Emerge, Beocom 6000 Bedroom: M5, Essence remote Travel: Beoplay E8 2.0, Beoplay EQ, Beoplay Earset
dueno:And for the playlist you have no problem?
I´m not using playlists, unfortunately.
Hiort:I have Synology NAS and recently skipped using Twonky over my iMac. Now I only use Synology Media Manager. Works really well with Moment, actually.
- Flere
smile and enjoy the moment
Flere:In the past the search and index did not work with Synology via the Essence and BeoMusic app. Does this work now with the Moment and Synology? - Flere smile and enjoy the moment
These are the settings i used:
In the Media Server, under General Settings, set the DMA menu style to "Advanced Style"
(Before I did that change, the Moment displayed the music file extension (e.g FLAC))
Also, make sure that Media Indexing in the Control Panel is set to index the folder where you keep all your music files.
It works fine to search for e.g an artist in the Beomusic app to play it on the Moment.
This is terrible news! LOL I just purchased a QNAP NAS and have been incredibly happy with Twonky on it. I'll have to look into the containerstation workaround. Or just not update the OS on the QNAP.
kimhav: If You are making use of Twonky Server from the QNAP App Center on their NAS then beware of that they have dropped the support for Twonky Server in the current beta v4.3.x and moving forward. Quoting a brief response that I got from the QNAP support after that I realized that Twonky isn't no longer combatible with the current beta: "After 4.3.x, Twonky service is not available on NAS system. For DLNA service, we will suggest please apply the built-in DLNA service and install media streaming add-on app on App center for advanced management too." Depending on what QNAP NAS you have, you can quickly overcome this issue by making use of the ContainerStation and run a dedicated Twonky Server to support the BeoSound Moment. The container solution dosn't add any significant overhead compared using the twonky server from the app center.
Is there a step by step guide to using Container Station to run Twonky? I have an Essence, and a QNAP TS451+
Sal:This is terrible news!
Maybe the QNAP DLNA will do the job, similarly to the Synology DLNA that seems to behave better now then two years ago, thanks to updates from each vendors I guess.
I'll try the QNAP one before attempting the ContainerStation and acquiring Twonky server.
BS Moment, BS Core, BG 4002, BC 4500, BS1, BL18, BL19, BL8000 + RCV1, A6, M5, M3, A1, P6 (tks Botty), H5, TR1
mbolo01: Sal:This is terrible news! Maybe the QNAP DLNA will do the job, similarly to the Synology DLNA that seems to behave better now then two years ago, thanks to updates from each vendors I guess. I'll try the QNAP one before attempting the ContainerStation and acquiring Twonky server.
That's my homework for this week to turn off Twonky and see how the Essence handles QNAP's own MusicStation pointed to the folder in which the Twonky music is housed currently! Maybe it has more functionality or customizability than Twonky. Hopefully the folks at B&O are watching the space, and make robust hooks for standard DLNA implementation to accommodate a variety of software through BeoMusic. Plex, Twonky, XBMC, and a myriad of other freeware software all are great on their own, but may have less than adequate results in the B&O ecosystem.
So I just enabled the QNAP DLNA app and pointed to the music folder. I can't see the Server name in the source list in Beomusic. I have Twonky running as well. Can both be run at the same time? Is that the issue?
I can confirm that the QNAP sees the Beosound Essence, Beosound A6, as well as my BV11 in the devices list o the scanned media receivers, but Beomusic doesn't show the renamed "QNAPServer" in the source list. Damnit B&O!
Sal:I can confirm that the QNAP sees the Beosound Essence, Beosound A6, as well as my BV11 in the devices list o the scanned media receivers, but Beomusic doesn't show the renamed "QNAPServer" in the source list. Damnit B&O!
Carolpa: Sal: I can confirm that the QNAP sees the Beosound Essence, Beosound A6, as well as my BV11 in the devices list o the scanned media receivers, but Beomusic doesn't show the renamed "QNAPServer" in the source list. Damnit B&O! All Dlna servers switched on in my network are shown in BeoMusic (minimserver, twonky, kodi, Microsoft media player, jriver). So it is to easy to blame it directly on B&o! Check your settings!
Sal: I can confirm that the QNAP sees the Beosound Essence, Beosound A6, as well as my BV11 in the devices list o the scanned media receivers, but Beomusic doesn't show the renamed "QNAPServer" in the source list. Damnit B&O!
All Dlna servers switched on in my network are shown in BeoMusic (minimserver, twonky, kodi, Microsoft media player, jriver).
So it is to easy to blame it directly on B&o!
Check your settings!
Checked and double checked. Maybe it is QNAP, maybe it is B&O but it is not working. But DLNA is DLNA, with B&O's track record with SW, I choose to believe it is BeoMusic which is the culprit. B&O themselves recommend Twonky. Can anyone with a QNAP device please advise?
I will graciously admit if it is my settings which are at fault here.
Sal: Checked and double checked. Maybe it is QNAP, maybe it is B&O but it is not working. But DLNA is DLNA, with B&O's track record with SW, I choose to believe it is BeoMusic which is the culprit. B&O themselves recommend Twonky. Can anyone with a QNAP device please advise? I will graciously admit if it is my settings which are at fault here.
Sal:I will graciously admit if it is my settings which are at fault here.
Sal - I don't think your settings are wrong.
I have the same issue with my A6. My QNAP is running both Twonky and QNAP DLNA server. While the BS Moment sees the QNAP server as well as the Twonky server in the list of media servers, the A6 only sees the the Twonky Media server through the BeoMusic app.
When using third party APP such as Media Connect app on IOS, I can see both Twonky and QNAP servers which is a proof that the A6 (and the BS 35) do not behave correctly.
@Carolpa: The Media Streaming add-on is used by the QNAP Music application to stream music to DLNA receivers which is not what Sal wants to achieve here. That said, I have the add-on installed, both the BS Moment and the A6 are listed as Media Receivers but the QNAP Music only sees the A6 as a possible receiver ......
To summarize: lot of inconsistencies between DLNA management for product of the same brand.
@Sal: We need to escalate to BeoCare before moving to the next QNAP, assuming we don't want to avoid adding the management of a virtual machine with Twonky inside, even in a light environment such container station
Still strange thinking it is a Beomusic issue if
Twonky, Kodi, Jriver, Plex, Microsoft Media center, Minimserver all DLNA servers and all are visible by Beomusic.
mbolo01:@Carolpa: The Media Streaming add-on is used by the QNAP Music application to stream music to DLNA receivers which is not what Sal wants to achieve here
The Moment, Essence, BS35, Beoplay A6 aren't DLNA receivers/players? And he want to stream music from the QNAP server to these players, or.....?
His problem is Beomusic as DLNA controller doesn't seem to see the QNAP server. Does QNAP have a check box to switch on/off DLNA control of other brand controllers?
All the servers, that I have on my network (on my (relatively old Synology NAS and on my Mac Mini) show up in Beomusic/Essence as well as in HomeMedia on my V1.
Never had any issues there.
I have changed my router recently - which did not have any negative effects either (my Essence is wirelessly connected).
I never tried the Twonky - why should I, when everything is ok with the other DLNA servers?
(Note: I don't have, need or want an iTunes library in my setup.)
That said - I might some day try the Twonky server, since it is highly configurable.
I would install it on my Mac Mini (which is running 24/7) and point it to the files on my NAS.
This way I would not depend on the support from a particular NAS or version of the NAS.
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Carolpa:Help me figure this out? Isn't this exactly what he wants.
We are saying the same thing
Sal simply wants to browse is QNAP DLNA Collection from the the BeoMusic app but the QNAP DLNA server does not show up in the list when the Twonky one does and they both run on the same NAS, which is different than going onto a player such as the QNAP Music app and stream music to a a DLNA Receiver such as the A&, BS 35, etc....
There is no restriction in the QNAP DLNA server that I have seen so far
mbolo01: Carolpa:Help me figure this out? Isn't this exactly what he wants. We are saying the same thing Sal simply wants to browse is QNAP DLNA Collection from the the BeoMusic app but the QNAP DLNA server does not show up in the list when the Twonky one does and they both run on the same NAS, which is different than going onto a player such as the QNAP Music app and stream music to a a DLNA Receiver such as the A&, BS 35, etc.... There is no restriction in the QNAP DLNA server that I have seen so far
Does by any reason QNAP uses different ports than the usual Upnp ports? Or maybe the port is blocked for this program in the QNAP server!
Is the server set to be controlled by Sonos? They use a different port.
From what I can see QNAP does not have any specific ports, nor restrictions.
I have done another test with my internet provider box, Android O/S + VLC app.VLC is able to see and browse all DLNA servers I have on my netwrork, including QNAP and Twonky.
Finally I have installed the Serviio Media server on the same QNAP NAS and it is immediately available to the A6 through the BeoMusic App
To summarize:
Controller = Android ISP BoxPlayer = Android ISP BoxServer = All visible and usable
Controller = IOS MediaConnect AppPlayer = IOS MediaConnect AppServer = All visible and usable
Controller = IOS BeoMusic AppPlayer = BS 35 or A6Server = All visible BUT QNAP Media Server
Controller = BS MomentPlayer = BS MomentServer = All visible and usable
mbolo01:From what I can see QNAP does not have any specific ports, nor restrictions. I have done another test with my internet provider box, Android O/S + VLC app.VLC is able to see and browse all DLNA servers I have on my netwrork, including QNAP and Twonky. To summarize: Controller = Android ISP BoxRenderer = Android ISP BoxServer = All visible and usable Controller = IOS MediaConnect AppRenderer = IOS MediaConnect AppServer = All visible and usable Controller = IOS BeoMusic AppRenderer = BS 35 or A6Server = All visible BUT QNAP Media Server Controller = BS MomentRenderer = BS MomentServer = All visible and usable
Controller = Android ISP BoxRenderer = Android ISP BoxServer = All visible and usable
Controller = IOS MediaConnect AppRenderer = IOS MediaConnect AppServer = All visible and usable
Controller = IOS BeoMusic AppRenderer = BS 35 or A6Server = All visible BUT QNAP Media Server
Controller = BS MomentRenderer = BS MomentServer = All visible and usable
But only in case of the BS35/Beoplay A6 you can speak for sure about "Renderer". In DLNA al the other could be "Players" (the controller= the renderer). So still it could be possible QNAP doesn't accept "other" controllers.
Carolpa:But only in case of the BS35/Beoplay A6 you can speak for sure about "Renderer"
Correct, I have changed my post and replaced "renderer" with "player", sorry for the confusion.
I have not tested the renderer side as I don't think this is the issue that was raised initially, and the BeoApp music is no a DLNA controller as such but a B&O device controller only.
Hi everyone and thank you for putting your heads together.
I’m as flummoxed as you all are. First, I moved to a QNAP TS451+ recently because I wanted an alternative to my always on 2010 Mac Pro, which was a waste for what it was actually doing (serving up music via Twonky, and acting as a backup file server) — though it did that splendidly -- it just took up a lot of space. Though looking back on it, having all the HDDs inside a flexible enclosure and full integration in my Mac environment was pretty sweet.
With the QNAP, I am very satisfied at the straight forward setup, small size, low noise and low power use, redundancy in RAID5, and native apps like Plex, Twonky, and others that my family uses, even when we're away from home.
In fact, this is so recent a purchase, that when I first read in this thread that QNAP wasn’t supporting Twonky any longer I immediately checked my return window with Amazon. Thankfully it is 1/31/2017.
I really didn't want to end up buying a device whose main pleasurable purpose for me — which is to serve up music to my Essence via Twonky — is now hamstrung by never having its software updated for fear of the loss of functionality for which I mainly purchased it. That being said…
What mbolo01 has stated is accurate. There is something inherent in the framework of either the BeoMusic App, or the implementation of the QNAP DLNA, which prevents the BeoMusic App from “seeing” the QNAP DLNA server as a music source.
I have rechecked my settings, and there is no other option I can think of that leads me to think that it is a server issue, as mbolo01 has found in his testing.
I have a rather large music library and I have indeed tried options (on the Mac Pro, and those available on the QNAP) like minimserver, serviio, firefly and even Plex, and what I’ve found is that Twonky ends up being the fastest implementation in the BeoMusic App. An example is that Plex, although being the most functional, takes time (provress wheel to load the next set of data) to scroll through the lists of artists and Twonky offers an index feature (sorting by ABC, DEF, etc) which helps to navigate to an artist quickly rather than having to scroll, since the BeoMusic App doesn’t have a search feature.
I really feel like I’m caught between a rock and a hard place with B&O & the Essence. I don’t want a Moment, and the Essence’s interface (the BeoMusic App), has two glaring weaknesses in my opinion: use ability for large music libraries is cumbersome, and its dependence on a 3rd party software which B&O has no influence over. So the customer experience can differ from user to user.
So, if there is a solution to this quandary and QNAP DLNA somehow ends up working, I fear that the user interaction through BeoMusic would be similar to what I’ve experiences with everything BUT Twonky. That is, it will be slow and sluggish.
I have four options:
In other threads, I have seriously contemplated moving to a dedicated music storage and streaming device like the Auralic Aries MINI (with a 2.5” HDD/SSD installed) which, for my use case would essentially be a hard disk based replacement for the Essence. I’d rather have my BL20’s connected via PL, and with a non B&O system, integration is lost, and I can’t use the Essense Remote Wheely to control the device.
Anyway, I’ll keep an eye on this thread and submit a ticket to BeoCare, knowing their response time with issues like this, I’m not holding out hope.
Millemissen: I would install it on my Mac Mini (which is running 24/7) and point it to the files on my NAS. This way I would not depend on the support from a particular NAS or version of the NAS.
I have to point out that B&O has placed itself in this position already by recommending TwonkyServer, which has weaknesses of its own. I contacted TwonkyServer and asked them about a search feature, they said that's B&O's problem. BeoCare said I should contact Twonky, so we're already depending on support from entities which don't seem to care about their customers. Why is B&O recommending something they don't have control over?
Additionally, MM is right, though. The simplest solution is indeed to run Twonky on an actual computer, which may be what B&O have intended, and which will likely be what I end up doing again - Right back to where I started. Guess I need to learn something: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
One more update. I successfully installed Twonky within Containerstation on the QNAP and it worked. That is, it set up the TwonkyServer fine. The issue is that there is no way I can find to point TwonkyServer within ContainerStation to the directories where my music is stored. It appears that the directories that TwonkyServer makes available within containerstation are somehow sandboxed to within the ContainerStation files and can't be accessed by my Mac's file system or QNAP. Strange. Unless someone can help in that regard.
Sal:Unless someone can help in that regard
I think I can help. I just did it for myself and it looks ok.
1 - you have to enable Telnet (or SSH) on your NAS to connect with a terminal session2 - connect as Admin3 - identify the directory where your music collection is ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" in my case)4 - go in the directory where the container directory files are located ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Public" in my case)5 - in the ../Public directory, create a symbolic link named "Music" (for example) to the music collection: ln -s "/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" Music6 - When creating your Twonky Container, in the Advanced Settings/Shared Folders, add a "Volume from host", browse the /Public directory, select the Music directory created in step 5 and name the mount point /Music (for example), hit enter to validate7 - Create the Twonky Container
I now have a Twonky 8.3 running in a Container that has indexed my 35k track in a very fast time. running in // with the QNAP Twonky 8.2 app.
If QNAP DLNA server does not make the job, I'll purchase a Twonky License
Hope it helps
mbolo01: Sal:Unless someone can help in that regard I think I can help. I just did it for myself and it looks ok. 1 - you have to enable Telnet (or SSH) on your NAS to connect with a terminal session2 - connect as Admin3 - identify the directory where your music collection is ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" in my case)4 - go in the directory where the container directory files are located ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Public" in my case)5 - in the ../Public directory, create a symbolic link named "Music" (for example) to the music collection: ln -s "/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" Music6 - When creating your Twonky Container, in the Advanced Settings/Shared Folders, add a "Volume from host", browse the /Public directory, select the Music directory created in step 5 and name the mount point /Music (for example), hit enter to validate7 - Create the Twonky Container I now have a Twonky 8.3 running in a Container that has indexed my 35k track in a very fast time. running in // with the QNAP Twonky 8.2 app. If QNAP DLNA server does not make the job, I'll purchase a Twonky License Hope it helps
Thanks for your steps. I'm only superficially familiar with terminal and ssh, so I'll have to tread lightly with it.
I still have to say: this is a lot of work to get our expensive audio equipment working the way we want it to :-) Still frustrated at this whole ordeal.
mbolo01:I think I can help. I just did it for myself and it looks ok. 1 - you have to enable Telnet (or SSH) on your NAS to connect with a terminal session 2 - connect as Admin 3 - identify the directory where your music collection is ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" in my case) 4 - go in the directory where the container directory files are located ("/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Public" in my case) 5 - in the ../Public directory, create a symbolic link named "Music" (for example) to the music collection: ln -s "/share/CACHEDEV1_DATA/Multimedia/iTunes/iTunes Media/Music" Music 6 - When creating your Twonky Container, in the Advanced Settings/Shared Folders, add a "Volume from host", browse the /Public directory, select the Music directory created in step 5 and name the mount point /Music (for example), hit enter to validate 7 - Create the Twonky Container I now have a Twonky 8.3 running in a Container that has indexed my 35k track in a very fast time. running in // with the QNAP Twonky 8.2 app. If QNAP DLNA server does not make the job, I'll purchase a Twonky License Hope it helps
Just to be sure; this check box has been enabled?
Or............Alternative server (music only): Minimserver; very stable, adjustable (even dsf to lpcm)
Of all tried I found this one the best. In my setting even Twonky couldn't beat Minimserver. I found the latter is faster and always visible and ready for use. Also like the easy access to artists and albums.
Sal:which prevents the BeoMusic App from “seeing” the QNAP DLNA server as a music source
Sal:I really feel like I’m caught between a rock and a hard place with B&O & the Essence. I don’t want a Moment, and the Essence’s interface (the BeoMusic App), has two glaring weaknesses in my opinion: use ability for large music libraries is cumbersome, and its dependence on a 3rd party software which B&O has no influence over. So the customer experience can differ from user to user.
EDIT: or weak network infrastructure - bad experience
Sal:the BeoMusic App doesn’t have a search feature
Carolpa:Just to be sure; this check box has been enabled?
Not sure about Sal, but in my case yes and the QNAP DLNA Server is seen by ALL players BUT the A6
In my opinion, something in he A6 code prevents the identification of the QNAP DLNA Server and it will be hard to have either B&O fixing it as they may state that they have no issue with other DLNA Server brands or QNAP that will state that they have no issue with other DLNA Player brands ......
@Sal: Have you installed the QNAP 4.3 Beta or are you still on 4.2?
Justin:Can you also create playlists with that Twonkey setup which the Moment reckognizes?
If you had playlists while using Twonky as a QNAP App, then there is no change with this setup as the media directory points to the same one.
In my case I'm loading my music through iTunes on a QNAP Shared folder and I have placed my m3u in the iTunes Media/Music directory which is the directory processed by both Twonky QNAP App and Twonky running in a Docker container.
The playlist are taken into consideration by Twonky and the Moment can see them.
Sal:I'm only superficially familiar with terminal and ssh,
Don't hesitate to ask for help.
I agree it is a lot of work to maintain such setup, reason why non tech aware B&O customers are leveraging and paying their resellers for that ...... resellers who have all the pain!
Sal:Is there a step by step guide to using Container Station to run Twonky? I have an Essence, and a QNAP TS451+
It's quite straight forward to get it up and running once you've fired up the ContainerStation:
1. Start ContainerStation and click on Create Container and search for Twonky container image if you want to use pre-defined containers (else you could also search for Debian and install Twonky server yourself). I've used the wieweet/twonkyserver container image for my test setup.
2. After you've choosen the image to make use of you then come to the configuration part and first step is to limit the memory to make use of and set this to for example 2048MB which is more than enough for Twonky. Containers (the containers make use of virtual memory ballooning, so they will only reserv what is needed.)
3. Click on the Advanced Settings and choose the Shared Folder section and mount the volume for which you keep your music archive to be indexed by Twonky. Click on the Host Path and locate the directory and then enter the mount point to be used by Twonky container, for example /mnt/music.
4. Hit Create and with that the container image will be downloaded and configured and setup by ContainerStation. So this might take a few minutes depending on your connection speed.
5. After this just fire up Twonky Server as you normaly would do by using your NAS IP (for example http://192.168.0.15) and port 9000 (or what ever port you choose to make use of) which Twonky server makes use of.
To be honest I'm still struggling with getting Moment to locate my Twonky Container and I don't know whether it's the container image itself or what. So I'm going to give it a try with a Debian container image and install Twonky Server myself and see if this make any different. The issue is that I can't get the stream to work which I've only tried from my laptop but need to test from a mobile phone as well. But, let's see, it could also be an issue with hte beta I'm running of QNAP OS so looking forward to hear if any other makes a quick success of this.
Same here, the QNAP sees the Beosound Moment but not the other way around; did try to make use of both the standard port 8200 which QNAP makes use of for it's media server and as well port 9000 if the Moment excepts to see a Twonky server which didn't make any difference.
Sal:The issue is that there is no way I can find to point TwonkyServer within ContainerStation to the directories where my music is stored.
Well, you do this under the Advanced Settings/Shared Folders - Pick what directory on the the NAS you want to map to the container and enter a mount name; /mnt/<Your Name of Choice>. Then once Twonky Server is fired up just pick the /mnt/<Your Name of Choice>.
mbolo01:I now have a Twonky 8.3 running in a Container that has indexed my 35k track in a very fast time. running in // with the QNAP Twonky 8.2 app.
Which Twonky container image did you make use of and you didn't have any problem for Moment to locate the Twonky Server?