ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Back to work, still waiting for spares, so I went on to the transformer as I want to change the main bridge rectifier, fastened stupidly at the side of the transformer, I took out the transformer and opened it. Here it is with the rectifier desoldered. The BM 4000 must be about the same
Here open, filled with some plastic, I checked if it was loose in the box, but seams OK, I think if it is loose adding some epoxy on the 4 sides will do it.
Here the back end rubber bushing, if hard or damaged it has to be renewed, to do this you will have to take out the transformer. Obs there are 2 holes but only one bushing, I checked the spare part list, shows only one. This is sitting directly over the connections for speaker and other, to avoid humming going to the connectors.
Here the front side, its attached directly to the front frame with 2 screws, this means that there must be good rubber feet on the BM, if not, the vibrations will go to the surface and make the humming louder. There are 4 more screws connected to the side frame
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
Then unto the Fm preset cover (was missing, and I knew it). Someone in the old forum made one from a cassette cover, I intend to do the same.
Here the cover, with the to use part taped of to avoid scratches, in the vise, ready to be cut with a small hacksaw.
As you see the cover has rounded edges, the original has 90 degrees square edges, lets see how it looks when finished, I didn't find one with square edges, yes I did, but that is my B&O tape covers, and I'm not going to use one of these, they are also kind of smoke colored and the original is totally clear
Here cut to size and filed down to fit exactly, with the raw holding taps glued on, will leave to dry until tomorrow.
Hello Søren,
You must be getting tired of hearing how impressed I am with your work, but risking this yet again….. I am SO impressed!
How on Earth did you learn to do all this intricate electronic work? Whatever your answer, you have a remarkable talent!
Jeff
Beogram 4000, Beogram 4002, Beogram 4004, Beogram 8000, Beogram 8002, Beogram 1602. Beogram 4500 CD player, B&O CDX player, Beocord 4500, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 8004, Beocord 9000, Beomaster 1000, Beomaster 1600, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 4400, Beomaster 4500, Beolab 5000, Beomaster 5000, BeoCenter 9000. BeoSound Century, S-45.2, S-45.2, S-75, S-75, M-75, M-100, MC 120.2 speakers; B&O Illuminated Sign (with crown & red logo). B&O grey & black Illuminated Sign, B&O black Plexiglas dealer sign, B&O ash tray, B&O (Orrefors) dealer award vase, B&O Beotime Clock. Navy blue B&O baseball cap, B&O T-shirt X2, B&O black ball point pen, B&O Retail Management Binder
Jeff, thank you for the compliments, but until now I have only done mechanical work on this unit, taking things apart and put them together again is what I do for a living. Electronically I'm no good, but is starting, thanks to the forum, to get the hang of it, following a drawing and finding failures in a circuit is not easy for an amateur like me. When my spares arrive the fun begins.
Soren,
Just great!
Don't take my silence as non-interest. It's just that all the other members are doing such a great job of complimenting you, that anything from me would be completely superfluous.
You can come and work with me anytime! And I am very choosy who I allow into my workshop!
Menahem
Hi Søren,
To do the electrical work you will need a tester. (I’m rather sure you know this already.) I purchased a Fluke Multi-meter and have been very pleased with it.
With focus and determination I have ZERO doubt that you can do this and do it exceedingly well.
The FM preset cover finished
Here in place
One more
And from a distance, Done
Piaf:To do the electrical work you will need a tester.
I have some instruments the left one does the same as a 400 USD Fluke and cost here in Mex. 85 USD, I find Fluke way overpriced, My vernier is there for sentimental reasons, because its 35 years old and I love it. I have some more but this one has been in nearly as many countries as I have.
I bow to your expertise vis-à-vis the tester….. although still I like my Fluke.
The cover you made for the FM-presets is amazing, absolutely amazing. The difference between yours and the OEM is minuscule.
So did you ever get the chance to listen to an Il Divo CD? If so, what did you think? Be honest, as we all have different taste.
Hi Beofan53,
I am beyond happy for you as your experience very much justifies all the talk about the iconic Beomaster 4400.
I had the opportunity to purchase a very nice Beomaster 4400 from a fellow BeoWorld member, but felt obligated to buy another as I had already agreed to do so. Live and learn.
Piaf: Hi Søren, So did you ever get the chance to listen to an Il Divo CD? If so, what did you think? Be honest, as we all have different taste. Jeff
Sorry Jeff, didn't have a chance to go and buy it, listened only to 30 second per song you get on Amazon, but I will get it and I will be honest
Beofan53:Is the above problem to fix? Who can recommend a technician? Any help would be appreciated.
There are some good techs in Netherlands, Leslie will comment, my 4400 was not as good as yours, I didn't dare to connect it before repair.
I have an BM 4000 and it turned out good, but had to do the caps, as I will be doing on my 4400, all of these BMs are prone to that.
your problem with your on of switch is probably just that, the switch, I will come back with more when I get there, or maybe someone else on the forum has some advice now.
Got my spares from Mouser today, caps, presets and bridge rectifiers, I will do all these, and then as I have a hot iron, desolder output Darlingtons and check them, before testing under power.
Its going to be a very nice weekend.
Søren Mexico: Got my spares from Mouser today, caps, presets and bridge rectifiers, I will do all these, and then as I have a hot iron, desolder output Darlingtons and check them, before testing under power. Its going to be a very nice weekend.
Good luck. My "very nice weekend" will involve much music. I've been traveling this week and miss my LPs!
I love it when the new parts arrive, here the new bridge rectifier, a lot smaller than the original
Here the transformer in place with an 4 Mm. aluminum plate inserted between transformer and rectifier to compensate for the smaller size
Big caps inn
PCB 2 and 3 with new caps and trimmers, except 1 trimmer 1 Mohm missed when ordering, I like these Piher trimmers. sorry for the small photo, but I'm having problems with Photobucket, now trying with Picasa
Just had to go on, look at those presets, all of them set to "0"ohms, someone liked a lot of distorted sound or a "like to be technician" was at work.
Old ones out
New ones, beauties.
In place
Finished the wires on the big caps
Today's waste
And the big veiw
Still missing 1 cap and 2 presets, will go and buy tomorrow, Fiesta Mexicana
Great job!
Something that worries me... How are you going to set the tuner trimmers Søren?
Jacques
chartz: Great job! Something that worries me... How are you going to set the tuner trimmers Søren?
I measured the old ones and set the new ones to the same, hope it works, if not I will have to buy some new instruments and learn how to use them
Søren Mexico: chartz: Great job! Something that worries me... How are you going to set the tuner trimmers Søren? I measured the old ones and set the new ones to the same, hope it works, if not I will have to buy some new instruments and learn how to use them
I tend to leave tuner front ends and IF stages alone. There's very rarely anything wrong with them - until you go and touch something!
Those "all-left" trimmers seem to be the level setting trimmers on the input board, so there's not a correct setting for any of them. Turning them all to zero is just as good a starting point as anything else, although I would put them in the middle - but the thoughts of the infamous "previous owner" are always a mystery
--mika
Remarkable work, superb, and impressive! One for sure my friend, you were MUCH too modest vis-à-vis your knowledge of electronics.
tournedos:Those "all-left" trimmers seem to be the level setting trimmers on the input board, so there's not a correct setting for any of them. Turning them all to zero is just as good a starting point as anything else, although I would put them in the middle - but the thoughts of the infamous "previous owner" are always a mystery
I did put them in the middle, as for the other ones, I put them where they were, but some of them was at the extremes, so I wonder what happens when I power on.
This unit was so full of dirt,dust and very fine sand corns that I decided to change all the trimmers, but I wonder I wonder.
This is what my properly set trimmers look like (click - twice in Safari - to enlarge).
Note that I left the reservoir caps well alone.
chartz: This is what my properly set trimmers look like (click - twice in Safari - to enlarge). Note that I left the reservoir caps well alone.
Thank you Jacques, that gives me a little more hope, my trimmers are nearly set to the same positions, as for the big caps, I changed them, but they actually showed good checking with the ESR meter, 0.02 ohms.
Just as a matter of interest, I have noticed that the main board on my 4401 has no markings on it - the boards pictured above all seem to have the component reference and a track line. Has anyone else an unmarked board and, if so, is it an early model. The tuner and decoder boards have markings, though these do vary from some of the ones pictured but these boards were common to the 1500 and 2200 as well.
For those interested, Tim has written a piece on the Beomaster 6000 quad which should be appearing in Hi-Fi News fairly soon and also has submitted one on the Beomaster 5000 tuner. A friend of his has just got his hands on an ex BBC BM5000 which until recently was used to monitor broadcast signals.
Peter
The Beomaster 5000 tuner was in the Hi-Fi World favourites for some time... before inexplicably disappearing one day!
I regret Tim's decision to leave the HFW team... Hifi News has never been my cup of tea.
Søren, I see that your preamp board has RCA sockets! I thought that no 4400 had them!
The 4400 has both DIN and RCA sockets, which when you think about it, is a reall good idea!
Not in Europe! Only DIN. The Beomaster 3000 had both.
The Beomaster 4000 and 4400 units have RCA inputs for Phono, Tape 1 In and Tape 1 Out (along with DIN plugs for those). Tape 2 has just the DIN plug.
...Guess that is just in North America (or maybe outside of Europe) though.
-sonavor
sonavor: The Beomaster 4000 and 4400 units have RCA inputs for Phono, Tape 1 In and Tape 1 Out (along with DIN plugs for those). Tape 2 has just the DIN plug. ...Guess that is just in North America (or maybe outside of Europe) though. -sonavor
That describes my BM4000.
What I have wondered is whether you can use both the inputs. For example, have an RX 2 hooked up to the Phone RCA jacks, and a BG4002 hooked up to the DIN jack. Would both work? In practice I'd only use one of the tables at a time, like use the RX 2 for used records of unknown condition and the BG4002 for pristine records.
Yes you can - the BM5500 has twin inputs which are jolly useful!
Rich:What I have wondered is whether you can use both the inputs. For example, have an RX 2 hooked up to the Phone RCA jacks, and a BG4002 hooked up to the DIN jack. Would both work? In practice I'd only use one of the tables at a time, like use the RX 2 for used records of unknown condition and the BG4002 for pristine records.
The inputs are simply connected together in parallel, and that creates two problems:
As I recall my (European) BM4000 has the PCB placements, all traces etc for the RCA connectors, but the connectors and cutouts for them are missing from the rear panel.
tournedos: Rich:What I have wondered is whether you can use both the inputs. For example, have an RX 2 hooked up to the Phone RCA jacks, and a BG4002 hooked up to the DIN jack. Would both work? In practice I'd only use one of the tables at a time, like use the RX 2 for used records of unknown condition and the BG4002 for pristine records. The inputs are simply connected together in parallel, and that creates two problems: The non-amplified phono signal from the cartridge to preamp is very sensitive to noise, proper input impedance at the amp end, etc. The "extra" cabling to the other turntable would load the other, pick up interference, and probably result in very poor sound. In Beograms, the muting switch actually short circuits the signal wires to ground. Therefore, while the other Beogram is stopped, it will mute the other one as well. Which is good, because otherwise the signal from the playing Beogram would be moving the stylus of the other Beogram As I recall my (European) BM4000 has the PCB placements, all traces etc for the RCA connectors, but the connectors and cutouts for them are missing from the rear panel.
Well, then, I guess leave the Phono input well enough alone. But Tape 1 could have CD X on the RCA jacks and an iPod dock on the DIN?
Rich:But Tape 1 could have CD X on the RCA jacks and an iPod dock on the DIN?
That should work fine. The only downside might be slighly lower volume, depending on how the dock output is implemented internally.
tournedos: As I recall my (European) BM4000 has the PCB placements, all traces etc for the RCA connectors, but the connectors and cutouts for them are missing from the rear panel.
Yes, that's correct. So no European ones had them!
Sorry Peter,
I didn't realize that B&O altered their products to better suit the market that early in the game. Well we all learned something.
I can confirm the RCA connectors on My BM 4400 as well as on my BM 4000, both US models.
The main PCB on the the 4000 has no traces printed on the component side, and on the solder side no component codes printed.
The BM 4400 has traces on the component side and codes on the solder side.