BEOVISION ECLIPSE

Take you point of course, could change the value proposition to an extent - i'll defer thoughts on that until we get something more official and well explained from B&O on that.

That said, from a design coherence point of view, its hard to make modular stuff like this work in my view - what works for the Vitsoe shelving system doesn't necessarily for high tech stuff.

There are plenty of us on the forum largely because we have found added value in paying the premium in the past (and i'm very happy with what i've got, it cost me more than sum of the non B&O parts, but its cleanliness and performance make my life easier and more pleasant). 

Paying the premium is a harder sell these days - not impossible but harder.  It requires :

- Distinctive exterior design ( traditionally their strength) - still see some of that in their speakers, TV's are proving tricky.

- Modern and functioning software - think we all know the answer here, but something they must address or experiences just become poor or diluted.

- Performance - doesn't all need to be leading edge, but close-ish is good enough.

Anyway for the TV products, using someone else's UI and platform dilutes the experience to me - unless they can re-skin webOS to give it the B&O treatment.  

 

moxxey:

Sal:

Kudos to B&O for potentially allowing the panel to be updated for future-proofing as best they can.

Hold on. We're just assuming they are offering updates as it's detachable. Has it been confirmed? At a guess, the reason it's modular is that it's not a B&O component and, as it's not a B&O component, I'm assuming this part is serviced/updated by LG.

I'd be very surprised if B&O decide to produce an update panel in the future to drop into your old Eclipse.

I was assuming as well. Hence "potentially" based on some previous posts. Yeah, lots of assumptions. I think, as B&O fans we instinctively try to see the best in B&O, and sometimes take leaps of faith, too. LOL

Can't help but feel that B&O has lost its way on this one (and perhaps in general). :-(

The Eclipse's design is decent, but certainly not among B&O's best. I.e I doubt the Eclipse will ever find its way into MoMA's permanent collection. Seems the era of designs that were true works of art died with David Lewis and Jacob Jensen, may they rest in peace.

Using an LG panel (and even LG video processing) is fair enough, the picture is still miles ahead of yesteryear's LCDs. However, compromising on key parts of the heritage "Beomagic" such as exclusive use of premium materials (e.g. aluminium and glass), high build quality, simple / clean UI and the iconic electronic curtain completely ruins the Eclipse for me. Same story as with the cheap Android tablet embedded in the BS Moment, although they at least in that case took control of UI.

In the back of our heads we probably all knew that B&O's pricing was irrationally high, but somehow the combined magic of the various premium elements combined beautifully and made the past Beo-products greater than the sum of their parts. Well, no more! Without the full set of B&O heritage elements the magic is gone, the emperor indeed has no clothes and the Eclipse is perceived for what it is, a decent but overpriced TV that will likely be obsolete in a few short years (modular design or not).

I will stick with my BV11 for a few more years as it in many ways represents the last real Beovision (the BV14 and BV Horizon already suffered from the *** Android SW with all the issues that has so far entailed). After this, all bets are off.

So a sad day for us long time B&O fans indeed. There is always hope, but I feel this might have been B&O's last chance and that at least the AV business might soon be headed for oblivion (despite most of the BL speakers still being phenomenal design and soundwise). I could see B&O Play faring better due to its more Apple-like strategy of decently designed products at a reasonable premium. 

Reading some coments, it seems that after the BV 14 issues and the BV Avant Not Good, we now have the BV DEBACLE.

Will try to see it tomorrow with my own eyes !

Michael:

Went to see it.

 

 

1. Stand menu now requires list - stand (ok) - manual move (ok) then arrows.

 

On my Avant it's list (stand shows up first as on the new one but I don't have to press ok even once - just arrows.

 

Now more cumbersome I think.

 

 

2. Speaker bar too wide. Just estethics I guess, too bad because it's now wider than Avant and that was wide.

 

 

3. It is very flimsy. Moving the tv by hand makes it bend.

 

 

4. The finish is so-so. Even the sound bar. Sad to say. A lot of plastic and gaps.

 

 

5. No contrast glass! Only on the plate below the speaker. 🤷‍♂️. I love contrast glass on B&O screens but now it's history at least on this model.

 

 

6. No metal frame on the tv. Bye nice aluminum and genuine craftsmanship.

 

 

7. Dodgy interface - shows a big HDMI2 logo while waiting for the sources connected to the soundbar to show up. However it boots instantly and with a B&O logo. Audio fades in/out but not the video. I miss the magic. There's a lot of glitches in the interface with different GUI and stuff blinking by in operation changes and turning on.

 

 

8. The GUI is all over the place. Several different designs. The settings app is clearly B&O custom and is really not too bad but since it has several styles I don't like it. Not even the right fonts used.

 

The Lg interface also looks very out of place. Huge, enormous font for channel and source and volume which looks nothing like the webOs startbar that it also has. Very annoying. I prefer elegance and a dark discrete interface. Get used to big white, or blue or whatever kind of text in all kinds of sizes and fonts - all over the screen without any kind of real idea behind it.

 

 

9. Speaker fret/grille pokes out in the center as on Beosound 35 almost. Looks like a nice touch but also a bit like the designer grasped for help. We will never know.

 

 

10. Netflix and amazon buttons on the remote? I know this was aa necessity but come on. I don't want them.

 

 

11. The colors pop, the black is great. Sound is great I think but didn't listen that much.

 

 

12. Stand is smaller than the Avant stand and the pipe is thinner too. Looks cheaper and won't extend from the wall as much of course.

 

 

13. The aluminum grille looks much better than the dark red cover. It was ugly I think.

 

 

14. The 65" I saw was labeled OLED65C7BOZ which turns up as a LG tv license for webos. Guess it means it's the C7 model of LG.

 

 

15. There's a lot of plastic on the back. Not very well oriented but I guess people don't usually connect pheriperals all the time.

 

 

The Avant and Bv11 was more cleverly designed with easy access ports. The plastic is flimsier than I've ever seen with B&O.

 

 

16. The back seems to be fake metal or very thin. Differs from the metal that's nice (on the sound bar). When you look at the set from behind the finishes differs a lot and you can see that much thought went into the soundbar but not to the rest. It's really nicer on the back than on the front! (The speaker bar that is).

 

 

 

All in all these are my first impressions. I was hoping to be ecstatic and I can't say I am. I think the partnership is good but they didn't work on the interface and it's a huge fail. Huge fail. I can't accept an interface that badly designed. It goes totally away from what I believe in. If the interface was designed to fit the tv I would like it much better.

 

 

The different materials and unevenness makes me struggle to like it. And the width of the speaker bar makes it hard to love. A bad design choose. Not only does it make it turn less since the speaker will hit the speaker bar sooner than the rest. It also makes it unnecessary wide. Strange choice when everything else is thinner than ANY other B&O Tv.

 

 

Not sure what they want really..

 

 

I would buy the soundbar alone if it was available. And preferably less wide. I would then buy any TV to use with it and just have the TV be a panel that turns on by HDMI - CEC. That's what they should have released at the same time. Would give B&O a lot of money.

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. A shame for the "stand" trick + go !

 

Interesting design bit making the speaker bigger than the tv does not work for me, and it looks like to me S if they have looked to the last bvis7 ? That worked as the speaker was separate but being part of tv. I personal don't like that aspect, and as other people have said price, well people will decide that one

moxxey:

Sal:

Kudos to B&O for potentially allowing the panel to be updated for future-proofing as best they can.

Hold on. We're just assuming they are offering updates as it's detachable. Has it been confirmed? At a guess, the reason it's modular is that it's not a B&O component and, as it's not a B&O component, I'm assuming this part is serviced/updated by LG.

I'd be very surprised if B&O decide to produce an update panel in the future to drop into your old Eclipse.

I would love to see a BeoVision with a panel than could be upgraded every few years. However, I doubt that will be the case. Let's remember how B&O would not even sell us the brushed aluminum BeoVision 4 bezel unless we traded in the old bezel! So tight they were on keeping us from making other panels have the "look" of a BeoVision. I view tv panels in a very different way than I view other B&O purchases. I will spend the (often 10x) premium for B&O loudspeakers, music system, and telephones because I know that they will last me for easily a decade or 2. However, I view the TV market as one that is so fast-paced that TV's are much more "disposable." It's not that costly to replace a TV screen every few years to keep up with technology-- that is, unless it is a BeoVision!

I've had high hopes in the past for B&O taking a modular approach and have been sorely disappointed. For example, do we remember how exciting it was when B&O announced they would be offering a DVD2 and HDR2 in brushed aluminum to match the BeoSystem 3 in a modular system? This concept quickly died. Also, we were excited by the concept of having a BeoCenter 2 that had a separate socket unit. There were high hopes that the socket unit could be replaced with future connections, such as HDMI. Now, my BeoCenter 2 just sits collecting dust.

I am _actually_ kind of relieved. For many years now, I have had this obsession with B&O due to their design and philosophy -- and with the LG partnership and the outcome of that, I do feel the B&O-DNA has been completely lost at last (with the Avant still having a certain style). This is not to say the Eclipse may not be a great TV, it may very well be - but so are many other options.

Lee got out just at the right time. Will look into Sony and Loewe now (since my Beovision 9 is starting to show its age), but definitely will not go for the Eclipse. Thanks, new B&O team, for saving me from spending way too much money on a TV!! ;-)

kai:

Interesting design bit making the speaker bigger than the tv does not work for me, and it looks like to me S if they have looked to the last bvis7 ? That worked as the speaker was separate but being part of tv. I personal don't like that aspect, and as other people have said price, well people will decide that one

I agree. Actually I think it's too fat (high) too. Since it's so high and wide it to me looks more like a undersized BeoLab 7.1 on a BV7-40. Some people bought that setup and then the speaker was less wide than the screen which looks puzzled. I get the same feeling of the proportions and size of the eclipse sound bar.

For now I'm considering if I should keep my Avant &a speakers or sell all B&O and get something else. Honestly the real LG tv looks way better and cleaned. There's no GUI reason to get the B&O.

Considering all that's in the sound center I strongly recommend B&O to start selling the bar itself. I think they would earn more that way and make clients happier.

That way you could keep your powerlink speakers, BeoRemote and integration options.

Not really sure what's going on but it's confusing.

Somehow I get the feeling they will sell the sound bar on it's own. On B&O manchesters video it's easy to spot the label on the speaker saying the name SoundCentre as it would be its own device. On a Bv11/14 it would say Beovision on the same spot.

Not sure what B&O are playing at.  April 1st has been and gone.

Michael:

For now I'm considering if I should keep my Avant &a speakers or sell all B&O and get something else.

Regrettably Michael I very much agree with your sentiments. I sold all my remaining B&O including a BeoSound 9000, BeoVision 9, BeoLab 9s, BeoSound 8, H5 headphones, BeoSound 3 (constant problems) and a load of BeoComs including 6000s and 2s. I had other B&O products before these but they were with me for many years so not included in my 'relatively short-term' ownership. Looking back I think the 2 products that bought me the most happiness every time I looked at them or used them were the BeoSound 2300 (that lovely sliding glass magic with lights) and of course the iconic BeoSound 9000. I lived with the great BeoLab 8000s for many years too and they were fantastic with an older Avant 32" RF DVD. The 80s and 90s were pure B&O magic for me.

I really don't think I am going to end up buying the Eclipse. I'll be looking at Loewe, Sony or LG now I think, which is a shame in many ways. I agree with a previous poster who suggested that this partnership serves LG much better than it does B&O. I imagine LG are laughing all the way to the bank.

Michael:

Somehow I get the feeling they will sell the sound bar on it's own. On B&O manchesters video it's easy to spot the label on the speaker saying the name SoundCentre as it would be its own device. On a Bv11/14 it would say Beovision on the same spot.

But if they did that, surely the bar wound have to have a retail of £3000 - and who on earth would buy that? I know someone who went to buy the Bose soundbar at £599 and was shocked at that price.

Also, I very much doubt you can just drop in any old TV in to the bar and connect it up and it works seamlessly.

Agreed, and what interface would you use?

Something (a remote? and app?) to control the Beosystem 5.

And then a separate remote to control the TV and its UI.

Possible i guess, can't quite get my head around it though - anyway, unless it happens i won't lose sleep over the question.

 

I wonder, if there is no B&O in the Eclipse aside from the speaker, does this mean the TV has no pin code protection either? Curious.

moxxey:

But if they did that, surely the bar wound have to have a retail of £3000 - and who on earth would buy that? I know someone who went to buy the Bose soundbar at £599 and was shocked at that price.

Also, I very much doubt you can just drop in any old TV in to the bar and connect it up and it works seamlessly.

It probably would be something like that, with the aluminum grille at least. If one buys the eclipse that's bundled in the cost. I don't remember what the BeoLab 7.4 cost but I'm sure it was quite a lot too and still without any other electronics than amps.

I think a SoundCentre could be a great idea for B&O because it makes their expensive speakers useable for more people without making them buy a B&O TV.

The Centre probably mainly consists of a HDMI switch, audio processor and puc controller. It can drive both cabled and wireless speakers.

It has what's necessary to control external devices, connect B&O speakers and switch sources. It probably lacks video processing and it's own GUI but a separate edition could have this as well and just rely on a dumb tv or projector for video output.

It does not contain Netflix or those things though and they are sent back from the connected tv (audio over hdmi arc). Most TVs can do this.

I guess the BeoRemote could be though to tackle but a combination of HDMI-CEC, Bluetooth and puc would make it possible I believe.

Truly the price is high but if you buy BeoLabs I don't think it's horribly high.

As the eclipse has dolby vision,has it also hdr10/hi log gammer hlg ?

moxxey:

Also, I very much doubt you can just drop in any old TV in to the bar and connect it up and it works seamlessly.

But why wouldn't it be possible to put the PUC control into a sound bar to control a separate panel of any make  above?

I agree on the pricing issue though.

How long will Bentley and Rolls Royce be able to differentiate themselves from their bread and butter owners as standard components creep in? At some point they will have just the same issues to address. It's all a question of scale. I remember a colleague driving an 1970's Aston Martin that had door handles from an Austin Allegro and lights from a Vauxhall. Acceptable, but acceptable if the Aston Martin was, say, 50% Austin/Vauxhall?

Once the video engine has just become the standard panel manufacturer's product, there's only the sound bar left to call B&O. Not enough!

Graham

Given that all this years LGs support all 4 HDR formats, i see no reason why the Eclipse would be different.....I know the Panasonic is more limited and won't get Dolby Vision, but they've gone down a different path.

Just turned on my bedroom V1-40 that also has a metal grille. And subwoofer.

It turns on with a nice animated logo. Fades in picture with curtain and turns on my IPTV box without any graphics. No distractions. I can change sources with just a small animated black row on top that fades in and out with the white Bang & olufsen font.

It does everything discretely and elegant. I navigate it with a satin finish BeoRemote one without any logos except their own.

It has a floor stand, a table stand, a wall mount of excessive quality (as the other stands) and even a roof hanging mount. The entire Tv cost a fraction of the other Beovision models but is truly a gem.

If they can produce something this elegant and brought together for the new price of around 3000 usd then why not with Lg?

Sure Oled is awesome but the interface is what you notice every day. I turned off my Avant before going to bed and just seeing the curtains move in, no extra annoying graphics or anything is just the perfect touch after a long day at work.

I find it very worrisome that they didn't work more with LG on the interface. I do not think it is unobtrusive enough.

By statements in the various articles of the B&O/LG partnership, they are looking to deepen and improve it.

BeoVision Eclipse is their first love-child (some have called it the Frankenstein). By all indications, there will be other BeoVisions B&O and LG will collaborate on.

I think – and hope – that they are committed to a steep learning curve, taking in both the good and especially the critical feedback they are receiving for the Eclipse. This thread alone has a lot of input, and ideas for improvement, for B&O to consider:

- build quality (consistency of the materials in the joint audio and picture elements), pointed very well out in Michael's post.

- designing a B&O skin for the WebOS user interface (I was actually expecting at least some rework on this), asked for in a lot of posts.

- ensuring that the day-to-day operation has a consistent B&O feel to it, including the hallmark electronic curtains, i.e. getting it all together with the B&O dna, honoring their heritage.

It is disheartening that the video department at B&O is dead. Their sensors and the Vision Clear processing were superb on the BV11, and to great extent on the pre-Android Avant (I think UHD and HDR threw them off their game somewhat, and choosing TP Vision as a supplier was a gigantic mis-step). I wish they would carry on the best of their Video Engine – the knowhow that B&O developed for decades – over to LG. Or is the knowhow gone with people that were let go?

I still like the Eclipse's design (I may be in the minority), but the mix&match of skimmed B&O and raw LG makes me wonder if the whole is greater than, or even equal to, the sum of its parts – also in terms of price.

I am undecided.

KMA:

By statements in the various articles of the B&O/LG partnership, they are looking to deepen and improve it.

 

 

BeoVision Eclipse is their first love-child (some have called it the Frankenstein). By all indications, there will be other BeoVisions B&O and LG will collaborate on.

 

 

I think – and hope – that they are committed to a steep learning curve, taking in both the good and especially the critical feedback they are receiving for the Eclipse. This thread alone has a lot of input, and ideas for improvement, for B&O to consider:

 

 

- build quality (consistency of the materials in the joint audio and picture elements), pointed very well out in Michael's post.

 

 

- designing a B&O skin for the WebOS user interface (I was actually expecting at least some rework on this), asked for in a lot of posts.

 

 

- ensuring that the day-to-day operation has a consistent B&O feel to it, including the hallmark electronic curtains, i.e. getting it all together with the B&O dna, honoring their heritage.

 

 

It is disheartening that the video department at B&O is dead. Their sensors and the Vision Clear processing were superb on the BV11, and to great extent on the pre-Android Avant (I think UHD and HDR threw them off their game somewhat, and choosing TP Vision as a supplier was a gigantic mis-step). I wish they would carry on the best of their Video Engine – the knowhow that B&O developed for decades – over to LG. Or is the knowhow gone with people that were let go?

 

 

I still like the Eclipse's design (I may be in the minority), but the mix&match of skimmed B&O and raw LG makes me wonder if the whole is greater than, or even equal to, the sum of its parts – also in terms of price.

 

 

I am undecided.

 

 

I agree with what you are saying. Multiple voices stating this is the first TV, I assume there will be more at different price points like Loewe. Also, the LG V30 launches today and as per the leaks will have B&O play audio features and branding on the back. It looks like this is very much a strategic partnership with both parties trying to gain from other. 

I -love- the fact that the panel gives us 4K HDR and a host of 'proper' top end features.

I hate the fact that it's max of 65" and the price relative to the LG 77

vikinger:

moxxey:

Also, I very much doubt you can just drop in any old TV in to the bar and connect it up and it works seamlessly.

But why wouldn't it be possible to put the PUC control into a sound bar to control a separate panel of any make  above?

I wrote that rather late, so perhaps wasn't being clear. I mean, the SoundCenter is a fixed size. You'd have to find a TV with exactly the same fit as the LG, for it to "sit" in the bar base. What are the chances of those aligning correctly?

ie. who is going to pay £3000 for a sound bar that might not fit their television? A fudge and then some. And if it was £3000, then you might as well just buy the Eclipse if you're dropping in a regular LG OLED.

Exactly, I'm sceptical for those reasons.

I'd only be confident if there was an official line on this aspect

Yeah - for those who haven't yet spent any time, be interesting what the standout impression is, once you actually go and see / play with it.

For me it was the GUI - that's where the lack of B&O feeling came across most strongly.

Just behind that was the slight uneasy feeling over its two piece nature - felt less a collaboration than a division of responsibility ("you do this bit, I'll do that bit"). What's the saying about seeing how a sausage is made? Prefer not to know it's genesis...

Really really wish they just send over a few guys to LG, and insist on some B&O input into the GUI

Sandyb:

Really really wish they just send over a few guys to LG, and insist on some B&O input into the GUI

I must admit, that's confused me too. I understand they didn't add anything to the video processing, but you'd think they could have worked with LG on some custom B&O menus?

Maybe the numbers B&O committed to, didn't make that viable? Eclipse production must be in the 100s not 1000s.

Come on folks, before the Eclipse there were a lot of complains about the missing HDR, Dolby Vision etc in the Beovisions, and also a lot of complaints about issues with the software. Now that we finally get the best available OLED panel combined with a robust WebOS software in a stylish Beovision which lets us easily connect and control our BS9k, BL5, BL8k etc - that is still not enough? Be realistic: LG, Samsung and the likes are in a different league when it comes to R&D budgets, and can deliver incremental improvements each year to their panels. If you are in for a "Upgrade the TV each 2-3 years" approach, then a Beovision might not be the preferred choice for you.  But if you're more into buying a timeless furniture/sculpture TV set makes you happy for many years, Beovision should be an option. And if it would be possible to change the panel to a newer model after - lets say - 5 years, this makes this set even more future proof. If not, the picture and sound quality should still be remarkable even 5 years from now.

I must agree that I would have preferred to have the usability of the B&O menus and touches (curtain, efficient use of the remote), and maybe also to have a thin aluminum frame around the panel (made it less "floppy"), but I think the overall Eclipse design is timeless and balanced. I think we'll go for the 65" Eclipse!

moxxey:

vikinger:

moxxey:

Also, I very much doubt you can just drop in any old TV in to the bar and connect it up and it works seamlessly.

But why wouldn't it be possible to put the PUC control into a sound bar to control a separate panel of any make  above?

I wrote that rather late, so perhaps wasn't being clear. I mean, the SoundCenter is a fixed size. You'd have to find a TV with exactly the same fit as the LG, for it to "sit" in the bar base. What are the chances of those aligning correctly?

ie. who is going to pay £3000 for a sound bar that might not fit their television? A fudge and then some. And if it was £3000, then you might as well just buy the Eclipse if you're dropping in a regular LG OLED.

Maybe I wasn't being too clear either!

I was really suggesting that you could design a sound bar to link to and control any panel above. I wasn't suggesting that this had been done with the Eclipse which, from its design, may well only be suitable for one particular panel.

Graham

BeoET:

I must agree that I would have preferred to have the usability of the B&O menus and touches (curtain, efficient use of the remote), and maybe also to have a thin aluminum frame around the panel (made it less "flappy"), but I think the overall Eclipse design is timeless and balanced. I think we'll go for the 65" Eclipse!

No-one disagrees, but it's not the best looker and it's very expensive - £13K for a 65" LG panel. If you think it's timeless, plus you have a spare £13K, buy it 👍🏼

Now close yours eyes and think of pop-up speakers "a la AV5" coming out with the electronic curtain, a complete thin anti-reflection glass with a tiny alu frame, alu grill as standard with choice of anodized colors, a no logo RemoteOne and B&O interface pre-NG tv's.

That's my Eclipse 55" for 10k €.

Sounds great - though the Netflix / Amazon logos are not their choice....Netflix insist on it...if you want some certainty that Netflix certification will be there, the button is something we have to live with. Or no button and just use Netflix on a connected box.....one or the other.....

BeoET:

Come on folks, before the Eclipse there were a lot of complains about the missing HDR, Dolby Vision etc in the Beovisions, and also a lot of complaints about issues with the software. Now that we finally get the best available OLED panel combined with a robust WebOS software in a stylish Beovision which lets us easily connect and control our BS9k, BL5, BL8k etc - that is still not enough? Be realistic: LG, Samsung and the likes are in a different league when it comes to R&D budgets, and can deliver incremental improvements each year to their panels. If you are in for a "Upgrade the TV each 2-3 years" approach, then a Beovision might not be the preferred choice for you. But if you're more into buying a timeless furniture/sculpture TV set makes you happy for many years, Beovision should be an option. And if it would be possible to change the panel to a newer model after - lets say - 5 years, this makes this set even more future proof. If not, the picture and sound quality should still be remarkable even 5 years from now.

I must agree that I would have preferred to have the usability of the B&O menus and touches (curtain, efficient use of the remote), and maybe also to have a thin aluminum frame around the panel (made it less "floppy"), but I think the overall Eclipse design is timeless and balanced. I think we'll go for the 65" Eclipse!

Look, it's like Bentley took a Tesla Model S and slapped a logo on the front of the car and sold it three times more expensive. I bought my B&O sets mainly because of the way they work and how you interact with it. It is so different from ANY other TV.

The looks is important too but handling is key. Would you like a Bentley Tesla without any of the common Bentley styles, solutions and feeling? I believe not. Even though that car is superb in many ways. It's just ... not.

vikinger:

I was really suggesting that you could design a sound bar to link to and control any panel above. I wasn't suggesting that this had been done with the Eclipse which, from its design, may well only be suitable for one particular panel.

Sure, but the chances of that happening are almost zero, primary as a) TV shapes change way too frequently and b) there's no easy way for B&O to produce a bar like the SoundCenter to wrap a TV in this manner - so it would just be a separate bar you'd sit on a cabinet or something.

Also, as I said before, do we *really* need a bar of such high quality? I'm perfectly happy with the BV12-65 centre speaker (which is primarily only good enough for voice) flanked by BL3s and a BL11. I'd rather have a flush speaker than something sticking out on each side, just for an improved sound experience.

All can say is imagine a b&0 oled with visionclear picture optimisation and their automatic picture control mixed alongside the black depth of an oled, would have really been something to behold.

The design of the eclispe still throws me off. I think if they done it more in keeping of the design of the bv-12 but with a greatly reduced bezel and upgraded speaker at the bottom within the screen with an aluminium strip going around the bezel  would have looked incredibly sleek.

But these are just my thoughts.

I do agree with you on this. I would have thought they brought something like this. Or a mixture of BV12 and BV11 somehow.

Actually, thinking more about Eclipse, it's not a true BeoVision – at least not in the sense of what the name infers and has always inferred.

There is nothing Beo in the Vision part of the TV, contrary to all previous BeoVisions. BeoVision used to stand for something proprietary & special found in B&O televisions only, in the picture – the VisionClear processing & elements.

Eclipse is a B&O SoundCenter paired to a LG OLED C7 (as the type no. in the TV's menu indicates) with some extra plastic back covers.

55C7 retails for €2.500.

Is the sound center, with a fabric cloth & wall bracket, plus a BeoRemote One, worth €6.620?

When BeoVision 10 came out, we had this: https://youtu.be/JSbSvjQtbsg

What's the craftmanship in every Eclipse?

Its almost seems to me that they should've gone a bit more of the loewe bild 7 65"/55" route. The screen moves up on start up and many more motorised stand options... Iam not sure but i think it even has the curtains.

I would deffinately pay a premium for easy b&o speaker connections and remote and such.

I like the look of the eclipse, iam just not that sure of the b&o magic or lack there off

All very true - though the C7 isn't picture on glass, so the E7 might be a better comparison

But your broader point remains correct

KMA:

What's the craftmanship in every Eclipse?

Ironically, I remember people saying that B&O TVs were "rebadged Phillips" in the 90s, which made a few people laugh about the pricing (as they were much more expensive than a Phillips television). False as that was, as they weren't rebranded Philips TVs, B&O is realistically rebadging a LG and hoping most people don't notice the regular 65" LG is only £2999: http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and-home-entertainment/televisions/televisions/lg-oled65c7v-65-smart-4k-ultra-hd-hdr-oled-tv-10160558-pdt.html

So, if one can buy the LG panel right now for £2999, assuming I go for the basic wall mount, what do I get for the extra £8500?

Wow.

Sandyb:

All very true - though the C7 isn't picture on glass, so the E7 might be a better comparison

Ah, in that case: http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and-home-entertainment/televisions/televisions/lg-oled65e7v-65-smart-4k-ultra-hd-oled-tv-10160580-pdt.html

Just the £7591 difference between the LG E7 65" and Eclipse 65" on a basic wall mount. Much better!