ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Would you rather that there would be no new tv fom B&O?
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Hi Erik,
I have looked at the Eclipse and I have to say, in the flesh its looks much better and I can live with the design. Albeit I agree with previous comments that this is rather personal view.
I fully agree sound is great. Much better than the other brands referred too above. Although you can argue that if you use the TV in combination with other B&O speakers, you do not need it that much. But still, very compelling.
The reason to hesitate is twofold.
First of all the user interface as also mentioned by Puncher above. The Eclipse for example contains plain reference to "LG" in some of the menu's. In itself there is nothing wrong with WebOS 3.5, it works intuitive and provides the functionality needed as far as I could test at a dealer, but why is the menu not slightly adapted in wording and colouring to make it a bit more B&O?
Secondly and to be honest most importantly, is pricing. Overhere in the Netherlands I can buy the 55" C7 between the €1.880 and €2.000 pending on the shop. Excluding the wall bracket, the Eclipse cost € 8.295. I expect and have no issues paying a premium, but nearly €6.300 for a speaker and integration is quite a lot of money. Next to that I thought the manual wall bracket costs another € 750. The math for the 65" is even worser.
Puncher: What really does if for me is the complete lack of effort from B&O on the panel - premium materials? - No, better than stock video processing? - No, integrated and stylish UI? - No, past Beovision identifiers (curtains etc.)? - No. While every single other user of LG OLED panels have managed to raise the bar, even if only a little in some cases, B&O just haven't bothered at all - nothing! No one doubts the speaker and styling is subjective but to sell a stock LG TV as a Beovision knowing its picture isnt what it could be isnt what B&O used to be about.
What really does if for me is the complete lack of effort from B&O on the panel - premium materials? - No, better than stock video processing? - No, integrated and stylish UI? - No, past Beovision identifiers (curtains etc.)? - No.
While every single other user of LG OLED panels have managed to raise the bar, even if only a little in some cases, B&O just haven't bothered at all - nothing!
No one doubts the speaker and styling is subjective but to sell a stock LG TV as a Beovision knowing its picture isnt what it could be isnt what B&O used to be about.
Exactly, a good, succinct summary of the issues. B&O could have shoved this panel in a BV14 or Avant and had a much more Beovision type of set, but I think the low level of integration and fact it's a minimal design investment assembly of other people's TV with a B&O soundbar indicates there are severe issues in what B&O is even capable of doing now. Do they even still have any video engineers?
As for the Thought, er. Thread Police, the whole purpose of a forum is to allow discussion, people will wander where they will, and it takes a special kind of control freak to try and micromanage other people's posts. I bet going to, say, a Christmas party at their house is a fun experience. If anyone starts talking about say New Years or such, they come around and browbeat them until they toe the line!
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
No, but why not introduce some more options and keep costs in relation with value?
Millemissen: Would you rather that there would be no new tv fom B&O? MM
HarryP:Secondly and to be honest most importantly, is pricing. Overhere in the Netherlands I can buy the 55" C7 between the €1.880 and €2.000 pending on the shop. Excluding the wall bracket, the Eclipse cost € 8.295. I expect and have no issues paying a premium, but nearly €6.300 for a speaker and integration is quite a lot of money. Next to that I thought the manual wall bracket costs another € 750. The math for the 65" is even worser.
On that point, Initially I was convincing myself that if Eclipse were 30% lower in price, I may consider it but after buying Loewe 7 and having first hand experience with it, I am not sure I would pay any premium over Loewe.
In fact, I am grateful for Eclipse pricing which caused me to rethink the whole value proposition and I ended up with Loewe 77 inch versus Eclipse 65 inch which was just a bad value proposition in my eyes.
BTW, I also bought my Loewe when I was vacationing in Amsterdam in October. I bought it from Loewe Gallery in Amsterdam. The store manager, Cess, is truly a gentleman and excellent source of knowledge on all things B&O and Loewe.I had it shipped to USA and all worked out great in truly Dutch manner of efficiency :)
I see the biggest issue with the Eclipse is that we know that is is a C7 panel, and will compare.
But this is fair at all.
They have change the software, just watch the youtube clips, its not the same. Also B&O are not using the magic wand feature, so how could it be the same.
They have also the speaker adjustment and stand feature in the TV menu.
They also give you the BEO Remote, not just for the TV but for all products.
It also have WISA built in.
The soundcenter also do it for a music system.
The motorstand though same price as LOEWE feature 2 axle turning.
And you get DOLBY VISION with this tv, which is said is very important to get the best HDR, Philips and others dont have this.
BEOVISION 65" is no steal, but the 55" is rather well prices. I had the C7 for a week, returned it and saving up for a B&O tv.
But also Eclipse is there first try with LG, I think there will come a lot more, and I think the future is bright.
Beovision Harmony 77" 2nd Gen, Beolab 5, Beolab 17, Beosound 1, Beoplay M3, Beoplay Portal, Beoplay Earset, Beoliving Intelligence
It would have been much, much better received if they avoided any pretence of it being a Beovision and sold the speaker/stand for use with the C7 TV (or better still, any LG OLED panel). As it stands I still maintain the TV part of the package isn't from B&O anyhow.
Ban boring signatures!
Emil Jensen: I see the biggest issue with the Eclipse is that we know that is is a C7 panel, and will compare. But this is fair at all. They have change the software, just watch the youtube clips, its not the same. Also B&O are not using the magic wand feature, so how could it be the same. They have also the speaker adjustment and stand feature in the TV menu. They also give you the BEO Remote, not just for the TV but for all products. It also have WISA built in. The soundcenter also do it for a music system. The motorstand though same price as LOEWE feature 2 axle turning. And you get DOLBY VISION with this tv, which is said is very important to get the best HDR, Philips and others dont have this. BEOVISION 65" is no steal, but the 55" is rather well prices. I had the C7 for a week, returned it and saving up for a B&O tv. But also Eclipse is there first try with LG, I think there will come a lot more, and I think the future is bright.
Most if not all of the stuff you mention could be fitted in the speaker.
Millemissen:Would you rather that there would be no new tv fom B&O? MM There is a tv - and there is a BV.
KMA
B&O product history since 1991: Ridiculously long to list in a signature.
Puncher how would you integrate all the things in a external box, and still have seamless stable userinterface?
Also I think that it is a very short term thinking you have.
My guess will be that in the future we will se an BV10/11/14 design with OLED, and then it will no be plug and play.
Emil Jensen: Puncher how would you integrate all the things in a external box, and still have seamless stable userinterface? Also I think that it is a very short term thinking you have. My guess will be that in the future we will se an BV10/11/14 design with OLED, and then it will no be plug and play.
Firstly I wouldn't describe the Eclipse as having a "seamless user interface"!
I don't think my thinking is in anyway short term, they have released a product under the Beovision "brand" and it should therefore be judged as such.
I truly hope the future is as you say, with real B&O designs including B&O picture processing etc
They seemed to do pretty well at that back in the BV12/BS4 days.
Eclipse landed!
BS A1 2nd gen, BS 1, Beo 1, BL 2, BeoCom 2, 2x LC 2, Form 2, BS 2, Beosound 2, Beplay M3, 2x BS 3, BS 4, 2x Beo 4, BS 5 + CD rip, BM 5, BL 5, BL 6000, Beo 6, BS 6, H6, BL 8000, 2x A8, BV 8-40, H9, 3x A9 Keyring, BL 12 - 3, Serenata, BeoTime, BeoTalk 400, B&O Bottle Opener, BV Eclipse 55 My LEGO
The design is very individual as it is with every Beo product. But for me, I like it. I think the design of the BV14 is still the most beautiful and elegant looking Beovision. Also liked my old Avant 55" very much. Very much of a geeky show of gadget, but the floor stand circle was to big and for a modern flat screen, it wasn't that flat. I like that the Sound centre sticks out a little bit (not the first Beovision that does that). It stand out.
For those who argue that such good sound on a TV is a waste due to you have other speakers connected. Well, often when I watch normal TV I don't want to fire up the BL5's to hear the news reporter. Or when watching something at night time when other family members have gone to bed, it is also good not the fire up the BL5's.
I hear what many of you have to say about the lack of effort by Beo. I can understand this. And for me that had a two year old Avant 55 mk1 was that the Eclipse was so much better in picture quality. Side by side the Avant looks grey and faded. And when you consider it only has One HDMI that supports 4K without HDR. The menus was kind of slow due to not two way Bluetooth. The cinematic curtains didn't bother me and wasn't a classic Beo feature for me. My old MX didn't have it so. And now the tv starts faster and like the new start up with a total black screen and just says Bang & Olufsen. Just miss it a little when turning it of when it just goes POFF and dark.
So should one by an Avant or BV14 that Beo has put some effort in to but with buggy OS and tech that is not up to date our do you get a new TV with amazing picture quality that is easy to control. For me it was easy.
Just to bad that the only TV Beo sells at the moment is the Eclipse. I would had hoped that the LG partnership should have done it easier to update exciting models like Avant and BV14 (need a much better name).
What do you think will happen in the future to the Eclipse and the partnership? Will there be a >70" soon to mount?
//EA
Beo in white is my thing
Currently own: BeoVision Avant 55", BeoLab 5, BeoLab 18, BeoRemoteOne, BeoPlay V1-32", BeoRemote4, BeoSound 3200, BeoGram 6500 (MMC-1), BeoLit 15, BeoPlay A1, LC2, BeoVision MX7000 and BeoLab 3
Jeff: Emil Jensen: Puncher how would you integrate all the things in a external box, and still have seamless stable userinterface? Also I think that it is a very short term thinking you have. My guess will be that in the future we will se an BV10/11/14 design with OLED, and then it will no be plug and play. They seemed to do pretty well at that back in the BV12/BS4 days.
Puncher is talking about making a B&O sounder and any tv can be mounted(Sorry if I have misunderstood) That was not the case with BV12. BV 12 is in many ways the same as B&O Eclipse when talking about connection.
Puncher: Emil Jensen: Puncher how would you integrate all the things in a external box, and still have seamless stable userinterface? Also I think that it is a very short term thinking you have. My guess will be that in the future we will se an BV10/11/14 design with OLED, and then it will no be plug and play. Firstly I wouldn't describe the Eclipse as having a "seamless user interface"! I don't think my thinking is in anyway short term, they have released a product under the Beovision "brand" and it should therefore be judged as such. I truly hope the future is as you say, with real B&O designs including B&O picture processing etc
You will never see B&O picture processing again, but instead you will get panels that are up to date, and not 1 years old when release as before.
Also I think Eclipse truly is a B&O design. a truly unique design.
Alen: Eclipse landed!
Looking forward to see more pictures, and hear what you think in daily use :D
I agree it is a B&O design in itself until you switch is on, than it is a hybrid. I do not condemn them, and agree with your posting that it will help to get stuff out much faster. I also can understand why people like it and buying it. For me, it is still under discussion, but I am definitely not abandoning the brand.
For example, my loudspeaker purchase next year will be the Beosound Shape for in my home office :-)
Congratulations! The Eclipse is such a beautiful tv. Lookimg forward to more pictures.
Beolab 28s Beolab 9s Beolab 12-3s Beolab 1s Beolab 6000s 2 pairs Beolab 4000s Beovision 7-55 Beovision 10-40 Beoplay V1 32 inch Beovision Avant 32 inch Beosound 1 (CD player) Beosound 3000 Beosound 5 Core Essence MKII Beoplay M5
You wont see B&O video processing again, in the old sense anyway, i agree.
I have heard that a Beosystem 5 is in the works though, with the video processing provided by a third party. Quite what the form factor etc would be, my dealer did not know, though his best (though speculative) guess was that Oppo is the third party providing the video processing. While i believe BS5 was being considered a while ago, it seems from what i am told this is more serious now, especially as a third party may have been chosen for the video processing part.
And on an unrelated note, it seems as if that B&O has mapped out voice integration / assistants as the primary interface for some / many of its products. Whether this is a good idea, others can decide for themselves, though given recent software issues, i am hesitant as to whether to hope for a good implementation.
Anyway, something to perhaps look forward to.
Sandyb: And on an unrelated note, it seems as if that B&O has mapped out voice integration / assistants as the primary interface for some / many of its products. Whether this is a good idea, others can decide for themselves, though given recent software issues, i am hesitant as to whether to hope for a good implementation.
Forgive me for focusing on a non video / Eclipse-related subject, but B&O should refine and stabilize their current software offerings before venturing into what for them is very uncharted territory.
Agree in theory.
In practice though, the Android based TV's will receive limited feature upgrades, and just get maintenance support. The LG BV's will get software supported largely via LG. So in the minds of B&O, they are probably free to move on.
Anyway, early stages if at all for voice integration, just passing on what i was told.
Sandyb: Agree in theory. In practice though, the Android based TV's will receive limited feature upgrades, and just get maintenance support. The LG BV's will get software supported largely via LG. So in the minds of B&O, they are probably free to move on. Anyway, early stages if at all for voice integration, just passing on what i was told.
Will probably only work if you speak Danish.
Razlaw: http://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/bang-olufsen-bo-beovision-eclipse
http://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/bang-olufsen-bo-beovision-eclipse
That's actually a pretty fantastic review. Thanks for posting. I still don't like the design, and continue to think that if it's got the B&O badge, it should have the full B&O treatment (i.e. not "jarring" menus, etc.).
Double Post.
"For most people, not even a bravura built-in sound system and some gorgeous motorised stand options could justify such prices. The thing about B&O products, though, is that if you have to ask how much one costs, they’re probably not for you. And whether you can afford one or not, the Eclipse effortlessly combines B&O’s traditional build quality and design prowess with the best all-round performance the brand has ever delivered in a TV."
Taken from the review posted earlier which is what I've always said. If you going to buy with your mind and not your heart then B&O isn't for you. Another point I want to make is that we are used to the motorised stand, we used to the gorgeous remote....its old hat to us but to someone who has never owned a Beovision it will wow them completely. For us aficionados its just the usual B&O offering.
Even with these 'good points' the reviewer still awards the Eclipse 4/5 but it's direct competitors (Sony A1 and Loewe Bild 7) both 4.5/5 so to say that this is the best TV yet from this particular brand is not saying much in my opinion. Especially as 'this particular brand' should be, and traditionally has been, more luxurious and offered far more than mainstream rivals. The mainstream brands are now scoring higher, offering more and costing less. Of course, if you love the brand then buy the Eclipse! I always used to!!! Simon.
B&O products are V1-32, BS2, H95, E8 and an Essence remote.11-46 now replaced with Sony A90J 65”, Sony HT-A9, Sony UBP-X800M2 and Sony SRS-NS7.
I've gone back and forth with the purchase decision for all of the reasons everyone has raised here.
Eventually decided to bite the bullet and go for the 65" Eclipse.
Not to rehash everything that has been said but in person, the "design" of the television really is quite striking. There is something about the integration of the speaker and television that does not come across well in pictures (to me anyway) but seems perfectly natural in person.
Primary reason for purchasing the television for me was full integration with the rest of the B&O ecosystem. I have a pair of BL50s and being able to have the television and speakers work seamlessly together (with calibration, etc.) was a critical factor. I know that I could do this with a third party box and other television manufacturers but I place value on simplicity and having everything work seamlessly together.
If I did not have the BL50s, my television choice would very likely have been different but as it stands, I am very happy with the purchase.
Now I just need to wait for delivery....
BAND'OH!:Even with these 'good points' the reviewer still awards the Eclipse 4/5 but it's direct competitors (Sony A1 and Loewe Bild 7) both 4.5/5 so to say that this is the best TV yet from this particular brand is not saying much in my opinion.
BeoVision Eclipse 55”, Beolab 18s, Beolab 19s, Beosound 1, Beoplay P2, H3, BeoRemote One IR, BeoRemote One BT, Beoplay S8, Beosound Essence MkII, BeoTime
As if does have Bluetooth and all the AV audio processing built in, what’s stopoing B&O integrating the M5s as satellites?
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
Chris Townsend:As if does have Bluetooth and all the AV audio processing built in, what’s stopoing B&O integrating the M5s as satellites? Beovision 7-55 Mk2, Avant RF 28, Beolab 5, Beolit 15, Beoplay A1/A2, Beocom 2, Beotime, H3 ANC/H8/H6/H2, Form 2, Beoplay A3, Beovision 5-42 connected to a DVD1
Livingroom: BL3, BL11, BV11-46 Kitchen: Beosound 1 GVA, Beocom 2 Bathroom: M3 Homeoffice: M3, Beocom 2 Library: Beosound Emerge, Beocom 6000 Bedroom: M5, Essence remote Travel: Beoplay E8 2.0, Beoplay EQ, Beoplay Earset
Duels:From the summary in the article that is purely down to the cost/value proposition of the Eclipse which B&O is rarely going to get 5/5 on.
Yes, that is a fair point.
Bang & Olufsen Copenhagen is offering the Eclipse with a 25% discount on Black Friday. Feels kinda stupid towards us that just bought it for full price.
tigerisak: Bang & Olufsen Copenhagen is offering the Eclipse with a 25% discount on Black Friday. Feels kinda stupid towards us that just bought it for full price.
It may be a measure of just how much they're overcharging for it!
Puncher:It may be a measure of just how much they're overcharging for it! Ban boring signatures!