ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hi all, attempting to get some expensive equipment working again as a present to my father. He has a fairly comprehensive B & O house system here in New Zealand which has:
From what I can tell there is no longer an NZ agent so I'm trying to troubleshoot what I can.
The setup from what I can tell is:
Room
Speakers
ML/MCL Converter
Controller
Other
Kitchen
2 inset roof speakers
Yes & NL/ML Converter
IR Receiver (cover falling off)
Lounge
2 x wall speakers 1 x subwoofer
?
Beovision 11
Front Outside
2 x square wall speakers
IR Receiver
Side Outside
Hallway
These all work with a Beo4 remote. I have previously had the Bank & Olufsen app working on my Android phone which still recognises:
The house Ipad still recognises a "Beosound essence" as a sound output option but I do not know which physical part that is.
The Beovision 11 has Apple TV integrated. Ideally I would like to set this up for him to be able to play spotify on the TV, and have sound in other rooms. As easily as possible for a tech illiterate man. In particular I would like a way to see the volume levels of every room at once. He would quite consistently turn the speakers up to max, not hearing anything, then press play on his iPad.
Where do I start troublehooting this? I have labeled each ML/MCL converter and am trying to identify which controls which room.
Wow, this is quite complicated arrangement. Never seen so many NL/ML-Converters in one installation!
I'd recommend downloading the BeoTool-app to check the status of all NL-devices. Maybe you can share some screenshots of the results of the app.
Each NL/ML-Converter has its own ip-address with which you can enter a settings page. Then some standard questions:- Has anyone changed the network after installation of the B&O equipment 5 years ago? > Are all converters on the same network? Is the physical network still intact and cabling working correctly? And the cabling from the ML/MCL-converters to the speakers?- Which app is installed on the house iPad?
That table can’t be right.
There is absolutely no use for a NL/ML Converter in a room with a set of speakers (not to speak of 5 of these).
*If so installed, the dealer has made a lot of money there 🙄 Or he somehow had to use an existing homenetwork installation instead of a ML-bus.
Are you sure that you don’t mistake these for the ML/MCL Converter aka BL Passive or the BL Active.
In that setup only one NL/ML Converter would be needed - as a bridge between the BV11 and the (assuming) ML connected rooms with the ir eyes/speakers.
You mention a ‘BS Essence’, but do not show it in the table —- ?
My guess is, that there is one NL/ML Converter and a ML-cable going to the respective ‘linkrooms’.
And it seems, that there is no ML-audiosystem involved (but probably a ML Powerbox instead)
Please clarify - it seems kind of odd to me!
(Could you post a pic of these converters?)
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Could there be a ML/NL converter with a gaming adaptor, to make wireless net? So you have wireless masterlink?I have my self also thinked of that idea.
Millemissen:That table can’t be right. There is absolutely no use for a NL/ML Converter in a room with a set of speakers (not to speak of 5 of these). *If so installed, the dealer has made a lot of money there 🙄 Or he somehow had to use an existing homenetwork installation instead of a ML-bus. Are you sure that you don’t mistake these for the ML/MCL Converter aka BL Passive or the BL Active. In that setup only one NL/ML Converter would be needed - as a bridge between the BV11 and the (assuming) ML connected rooms with the ir eyes/speakers. You mention a ‘BS Essence’, but do not show it in the table —- ? My guess is, that there is one NL/ML Converter and a ML-cable going to the respective ‘linkrooms’. And it seems, that there is no ML-audiosystem involved (but probably a ML Powerbox instead) Please clarify - it seems kind of odd to me! (Could you post a pic of these converters?) MM There is a tv - and there is a BV.
Carolpa: Millemissen: a NL/ML converter van also be used as a “BeoLink active” kind of device in a NL setup. So not strange at all
Millemissen:
So not strange at all
I know = of course!
That is the readon why I wrote”
‘If so installed, the dealer has made a lot of money there 🙄 Or he somehow had to use an existing homenetwork installation instead of a ML-bus.‘
Which means, if there is not a particular readon for it (e.g. a non-existing ML chain), it would be overkill imo.
I must say I still don't know what equipment there is - this was just based on my best guesses. All network equipment for the entire house (excluding speakers and IR receivers) seems to be stored in the lounge cabinet, under the Beovision 11.There are four black converters which I'm pretty sure said ML/MCL converter. A photo is linked. Each has:
In the next cabinet there are four silver, sleek looking boxes with no model name I could see. It looks like this one though that has a rubbish photo and ours are around 10cm high. I took these for NL converters.
I say BeoSound Essence as that is the name of the wifi speaker accessible on the ipad. I don't know if this represents another network device.
I will look to get screenshots from that Beolook app in a few hours
Thanks for looking
Tom
Sounds like an MCL setup updated to Masterlink, then updated to NL. With BV11 and Essence as av sources, an NL-ML converter connected to to 4 BL passives connected to passive wall- and ceiling speakers.
Stefan
Forgot the MCL extra speaker kits....
stefan: Sounds like an MCL setup updated to Masterlink, then updated to NL. With BV11 and Essence as av sources, an NL-ML converter connected to to 4 BL passives connected to passive wall- and ceiling speakers. Stefan
Which comes close to my assumption:
‘...Or he somehow had to use an existing homenetwork installation instead of a ML-bus.‘
To keep the clues coming it was a brand new house and a full new installation in 2014. I found the installation invoice but there is literally no detail:
Did you try to turn everything off and then on again?
A friend has a complex, MCL, ML and NL system. On Christmas Eve years ago it all went haywire. Most of the converters were inaccessible in roof cavities. As a last resort I suggested he turn off the circuit breakers and then bring them back on and wait 20 mins. It worked !!
So perhaps worth a try.
Good luck, Beoaus.
stefan: Forgot the MCL extra speaker kits.... Stefan
That would be an interesting setup! A question: Would these MCL extra speaker kits (assuming that they exist!) then allow independent volume control in each of the 'zones'?
I say this because the Powerlink inputs to the passives are variable (usually with volume). Do the xtra speaker kits allow the passives to vary their amplification of an already variable signal input?
The boxes in the linked photo appear to be Beolink Passives. There are cables with analogue DIN sockets connected. Strangely enough there are no Masterlink connected, but there is something connected into the Powerlink socket. Could that be the IR eye in the wrong place?
Livingroom: BL3, BL11, BV11-46 Kitchen: Beosound 1 GVA, Beocom 2 Bathroom: M3 Homeoffice: M3, Beocom 2 Library: Beosound Emerge, Beocom 6000 Bedroom: M5, Essence remote Travel: Beoplay E8 2.0, Beoplay EQ, Beoplay Earset
Hiort: The boxes in the linked photo appear to be Beolink Passives. There are cables with analogue DIN sockets connected. Strangely enough there are no Masterlink connected, but there is something connected into the Powerlink socket. Could that be the IR eye in the wrong place?
In this instance the Passive's Powerlink sockets are being used as their only inputs (instead of masterlink). In this configuration they are merely acting as amplifiers (and data pass-through), and connection of the 'hockey puck' IR eye would have no effect (as far as I am aware).
Hence 'data' is passing via the extra connections in the speaker sockets (extra pins that are part of the MCL system). Thus MCL cable (or a home made version) is going from those speaker sockets to Xtra Speaker kits for each zone. These 'extra speaker kits' should then each have a old style rectangular 'MCL' IR sensor attached, for local control.
It's all a bit of guesswork, but seems logical! My question to Stefan above was about the 'usability' of such a system.
EDIT: It's a bit like this, but with something other than a 'Beosystem' supplying the Powerlink input to the passive:
Tarch: There are four black converters which I'm pretty sure said ML/MCL converter. A photo is linked. Each has: Two grey cables. Each grey cable has a large strand (power?) and a smaller strand (signal?) A power input A black cable I think is signal input In the next cabinet there are four silver, sleek looking boxes with no model name I could see. It looks like this one though that has a rubbish photo and ours are around 10cm high. I took these for NL converters. Tom
There are four black converters which I'm pretty sure said ML/MCL converter. A photo is linked. Each has:
How is the/what kind of cabling is going away from these cabinets to the mentioned rooms in the house?
Carolpa: Looking at the pictures I presume BLC were used as “active speaker kits” and the MCL/ML or BeoLink Passive as amplifiers.
Looking at the pictures I presume BLC were used as “active speaker kits” and the MCL/ML or BeoLink Passive as amplifiers.
Agree. If there are really 4 (!?) NL/ML converters, they all should appear in the Beolink app...
BL passives work as amplifiers (like MCL2P) connected to Powerlink outputs of the 4 converters, and IR receivers also connected to NL/ML converters.
Tom, can you take a photo of the connection panel of one of the converters?
And first I would check:
- do all converters hve a green light on on the backside?
- Do all BL passives have a red light?
- Do all IR receivers have a red light (standby mode)
- check if there is a Powerlink cable connected between each converter (RJ45 output) and BL passive (8 PIN DIN plug)
- check if there is an IR cable (white, thin, RJ45) connected between each converter and one IR receiver.
Guy: stefan: Sounds like an MCL setup updated to Masterlink, then updated to NL. With BV11 and Essence as av sources, an NL-ML converter connected to to 4 BL passives connected to passive wall- and ceiling speakers. Stefan stefan: Forgot the MCL extra speaker kits.... Stefan That would be an interesting setup! A question: Would these MCL extra speaker kits (assuming that they exist!) then allow independent volume control in each of the 'zones'? I say this because the Powerlink inputs to the passives are variable (usually with volume). Do the xtra speaker kits allow the passives to vary their amplification of an already variable signal input?
Independant volume control should be possible with Masterlink connected, but via Powerlink it should just act as an amplifier.
I didn`t see the empty ML socket...
And I thought the mentioned "silver converters" were grey MCL boxes....
And maybe I couldn`t believe that 4 NL/ML converters (!) are built into that setup ..:)
stefan:Agree. If there are really 4 (!?) NL/ML converters, they all should appear in the Beolink app...
agree with the checks
additional check the switch if the indicators of the LAN connected cables also blink
Some success!! I found the beotool app and did a diagnostic report. I have stored it with some photos in a google drive folder
I attempted to use other apps. One called "Bang & Olufsen" listed each room (except kitchen) and asked me to sign up for Deezer to play music. I did, then it says "device not compatible with Deezer". It also says that the SoundEssence is not compatible with Link Room
The "Bang & Olufsen Remote" app did get some music from the Side Outside and Hallway rooms! I:
My questions and next steps:
Tarch:Some success!! I found the beotool app and did a diagnostic report. I have stored it with some photos in a google drive folder I attempted to use other apps. One called "Bang & Olufsen" listed each room (except kitchen) and asked me to sign up for Deezer to play music. I did, then it says "device not compatible with Deezer". It also says that the SoundEssence is not compatible with Link Room The "Bang & Olufsen Remote" app did get some music from the Side Outside and Hallway rooms! I: Used Spotify played on the iPad Connected via Airplay to the BeoSoundEssence (at this point the TV would have sound from the "Link Line-In" source). When I say "Link Line-in" I mean the one with the chain link symbol in front of it, as opposed to the Line in without the symbol. Connected the Kitchen to Line In. The Kitchen has no "Link Line-In" Source option. This leads me to believe it is a master? Or the Sound Essence is connected to the Kitchen? There is no sound in the kitchen THEN connected the Side Outside to the "Link Line-in Source". Turned volume up and had sound. This also worked for Hallway, but not for Front Outside My questions and next steps: I note the Front Outside NL/ML converter has older software version - how do I update this? Is it possible to view the current volume levels of rooms. e.g - what is the current volume setting for the Kitchen?
in de B&o app did you add all the NL products?
BLC are not compatible with Deezer
Do you mean "link line-in source", you joined a product playing from another source?
note in a NL setup there are no masters and slaves
do you know the type version of the Essence?
Further updates after another night of work. I have sound in all speakers now. I updated the software on the Essence (via B & O app) and suddenly all NL speakers worked. One passive dropped out after 15mins but after restart it works again.
What is the best app for controlling these multiple NL 'Rooms'? I would like to set up a profile or hotkey where I press one button and all NL converters switch their input to "Link Line-in" then their volume to say 20%.
Hey,
There's no real easy way to help you via forum posts. IF you'd like, I can help you via Skype this Sunday, since we have no BeoTalk podcast this weekend.
If you consider this offer, please have Skype and latest version of TeamViewer installed on your computer that is on the same network as all your BeoGear. We can get it sorted in few hours, I'm sure.
Looks to me that all the Converters lost their proper configuration. From the system you describing, there can't be that much wrong with it, unless the installers did a messy job.
PM me if you'd like the help....
Willie
Sorry my post duplicated and I cant delete this one.
Tarch:All NL products are visible in the B & O app (passives not)
note: these passives are used as amplifiers for the passive speakers and NOT as ML Beolink devices.
Just an idea: To make the system more accessibel/easier to understand, replace the kitchen BLC and Essence mkI (BLC=ML/NL converter) with a Essence mkII or Beosound Core.