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FM issues, recap (?) Beomaster 2000 2801

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Janklep
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Janklep Posted: Fri, Dec 27 2019 4:25 PM

Hi Everyone,

After doing numerous fixes on my Beomaster 2000 2801 before, I now face a slightly more vague problem. The FM reception seems to be not too great. In principle it works, but most stations are impossible to properly tune (without lots of static). 

A few years ago I already replaced all electrolytic caps in the Beomaster plus the film ones that were cracked, but none of the others.

My first guess for the FM-issues was to replace all the potentiometer trimmers (they look horrible) and then check some of the test voltages.

While the machine is open, I was wondering whether you guys advice to also replace some of the other capacitors? I would guess the ceramic ones should still be good, as well as the film ones that are not visually bad, but I'm not sure about the polystyrene ones and the tantals. Especially the latter ones usually go bad at some point, but I'm wondering what your advice/practice is with this.

Any advice?

Thanks!

fkatze
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fkatze replied on Sat, Dec 28 2019 1:02 AM

I don't know the answer, but I do have this list that might help.  I scanned the Service Manual with OCR, then went through and compiled a list of all the capacitors and their values.  There may be some minor errors that I missed, so let me know and I'll update it.  The number at the end of each line is the count of that value capacitor.

Aside from that, if you don't have the service manual, then I'd recommend you get a copy.  Oh, and if any of your plastics are broken then let me know.  If you look in the What are you working on now thread, you can see what I've been working on.

 

Beomaster 2000 2801
Capacitor Value Number


0,1 μF 10% 250V 4
0,1 μF 20% 250V 12
0,1 μF 35V 3
0,22 μF 10% 250V 1
0,47 μF 10% 100V 1
0,47 μF 35V 8
1 μF 35V 19
1 9 pF Cer 1
1 nF 10% 100V 11
1 nF -20 + 50% 400V 1
1 nF -20 +50% 400V 8
1 nF 250V 3
1,5 nF 5% 160V 1
1,6 μF 5% 25V 1
10 μF 10V 5
10 μF 16V 3
10 nF 10% 250V 2
10 nF 20% 250V 1
10 nF -20+ 100% 40V 7
10 nF 5% 63V 2
10 nF-20+ 100% 40V 1
10 pF 2% 63V 1
100 μF 3V 1
100 μF 40V 3
100 pF 5% 100V 1
100 pF 5% 63V 1
15 nF 10% 250V 4
150 pF 2,5% 63V 1
180 pF 5% 63V 1
1-9 pF Cer 3
2,2 μF 35V 11
2,2 nF 10% 63V 2
2,2 nF 5% 63V 3
20 pF foil 2
22 μF 6V 2
22 nF -20 +100% 40V 1
22 nF 20% 250V 4
22 nF -20+ 100% 40V 6
22 pF 2% 63V 1
22 pF 5% 250V 1
220 μF 25V 1
220 pF 10% 100V 1
220 pF 5% 63V 2
270 pF 5% 63V 2
2t2 nF 5% 63V 1
3,3 μF 5% 63V 1
3,3 nF 10% 100V 3
3,3 nF 10% 250V 1
3,3 nF 5% 63V 1
3,3 pF 0,25 pF 400V 1
3.3 nF 10% 100V 1
33 pF 2% 63V 2
390 pF 10% 100V 1
390 pF 100V 1
4,7 μF 25V 2
4,7 nF 10% 63V 1
4,7 nF 5% 63V 1
4.7 μF 25V 1
440 pF 1% 63V 1
47 nF 10% 250V 1
47 pF 2% 63V 2
470 μF 40V 1
470 pF 5% 63V 6
5000 μF 35V 2
560 pF 5% 63V 2
60 pF foil 3
68 pF 5% 63V 2
680 pF 10% 100V 1
680 pF 5% 63V 2
8,2 pF 0,5 pF 250V 2
8,2 pF 0,5 pF 400 1
Total Number194

 

 

Janklep
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Janklep replied on Sat, Dec 28 2019 11:09 AM

Thank you for your reply, I think that list is very useful for anyone working on these! I do have a service manual, which is essential indeed!

I'm just not sure whether all of these need replacing. Especially in the tuner-section I'd prefer to keep the old caps if possible, to prevent having to retune everything completely (I also don't have the equipment for this).

fkatze
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fkatze replied on Sat, Dec 28 2019 11:22 AM

No it is probably not necessary to replace all - would be expensive too!  I think a good rule is do as little as necessary.

I'm not having too many issues, but I'm replacing the main electrolytics:

  • 470/40 X 1
  • 47/16 X 2
  • 1/63 X 2
  • 100/40 X 2
  • 220/25 X 1
  • 5000/35 X 2
Some of the voltage ratings were a bit hard to come by so getting an exact match wasn't possible, but I went over so should be ok.  I also couldn't find any 5000's but not really a big deal - you should be able to use either 4800 or 6800uF.  I went with 6800's.  After all that I'll see how it goes, though I'm not really having any particular issue with the radio tuner, beside the board being broken.  Gluing up my final (? I hope!!) prototype before I get a commercial grade print done.

 

Janklep
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Janklep replied on Sat, Dec 28 2019 11:30 AM

Agreed, those I did replace already a few years back, together with the bias trimpots (can for sure recommend those as well). Will now start with the trimpots in the tuner section, hopefully that resolves my FM tuner issues...

I sent you a personal message about the plastics, thanks for your efforts!

fkatze
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fkatze replied on Sat, Dec 28 2019 11:35 AM

No problem.  I'll reply by email to your message. Big Smile

Janklep
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Janklep replied on Sun, Jan 5 2020 5:21 PM

So, I did recap the tantalums in the beomaster this weekend. I also changed the trimpots in the FM-section.

I also took some measurements and noted very asymetric voltages on the collectors of 2TR10 and 2TR11 in the stereomodulator (6 and 7.4 V). I replaced those with a Hfe matched pair of BC546B's. This symmetrised the behaviour of R and L channels. Furthermore, I replaced the diode bridge generating the 26V supply since I read quite some people have experience with it dying.

Tuned all the trimpots up according to the service manual, except for the Level control and the crosstalk ones. Does anyone know what the procedure for these is (it's not mentioned in the service manual). Level control tunes the necessary IF strength to have the TCA420 switch to stereo mode. Only thing mentioned in the service manual is that for Aerial signal > 5uV, 2TP7 is 5.4V and for Aerial signal < 5uV, 2TP7 is 0V. This seems to suggest that 5uV Aerial should be the threshold for switching?

The cross talk pot I just kept fairly centered for now, does anyone know about this one?

I just hooked the BM up again and it works wonderfully again! The sound also significantly improved, I guess some of the tantals weren't what they used to be anymore... FM works as well. I cannot say what the culprit was, either bad caps, bad trimmers or aged semiconductors, but now it works perfectly again.

fkatze
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fkatze replied on Wed, Jan 8 2020 6:44 AM

Nice!

Is cross talk about separation between left and right channels?  I'm not finding much about it either.

How many tantalums did you end up replacing?  They're the little red ones right?

 

edit...

Page 139 says something about crosstalk that may be relevant:

https://www.americanradiohistory.com/BOOKSHELF-ARH/Technology/Stereo-FM-Radio-Handbook.pdf

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