ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hello Boeworld members,
I saw this MMC 20E cartridge for sale for 90€ on e-Bay.
http://cgi.ebay.fr/B-O-MMC-20E-Cartridge-Bang-Olufsen-/290848850416?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Turntables&hash=item43b7f141f0#ht_500wt_1048
I have the same one on my Beogram 4002, but the sound isn't very good, could come from my cartridge.
Is it worth buying ?
frederic.
Many of these cartridges has hardened suspensions which induces some distortion. It is age related, the cartridge on eBay is likely to sound as bad as your current example. I would advise to get your cartridge retipped by Axel Schürholz in Germany, it will make your cartridge perform like a new one; I have had 6 cartridges retipped by him so far, and I am very pleased by the result.
Vinyl records, cassettes, open reel, valve amplifiers and film photography.
Hello Soren;
I looked at Axel Schürholz site.
I'm not sure what retipping actually means.
Does he reshape the existing diamond, or does he change it with a new one or will he change the whole diamond/cantilever assembly and suspension ?
Frederic
Søren Hammer: Many of these cartridges has hardened suspensions which induces some distortion. It is age related, the cartridge on eBay is likely to sound as bad as your current example. I would advise to get your cartridge retipped by Axel Schürholz in Germany, it will make your cartridge perform like a new one; I have had 6 cartridges retipped by him so far, and I am very pleased by the result.
As far as I know, Axel does not replace the suspension material on the MMC20 type cartridges. He only replaces the diamond and cantilever, which is where the improvement in sound quality comes from.
I believe the hardened suspension story should be treated with a liberal coating of snake oil. I have had a good many MMC20 variant cartridges in my time but I cant think of any that have had hardened suspension.
I do agree that an Axel refurb sounds superb and I recommend that course of action rather than the eBay purchase which is an unknown quantity and has a good chance of ending in tears.
Regards Graham
I know he does replace the suspension - at least he did on my MMC6000 and SP15 (both technically identical to any MMC20 inside). Why shouldn't a hardened suspension be a issue? The function of the suspension is to keep the cantilever in place, while not impeding motion of the cantilever. The rubber material used hardens; it has been proven before and is a very known issue with the newer MMCx series (it hardens faster because of the smaller dimensions, just like glue dries faster when in smaller concentrations.) Hard suspension means some impedance to the cantilever which induces distortion. The cantilever may fall off as well, which I have encountered at least four times (two of them belonged to BeoWorld users.)
I don't know yet whether the poor sound quality coming from the Phono is due to the stylus or something else. Tape and FM are much better.
Here's a picture of my MMC 20E cartridge. can one tell if the stylus is still good.
MMC 20E stylus
freddy63:can one tell if the stylus is still good.
Looks fine to me from that angle - but a perfect stylus won't sound good if the suspension is bad. Take a look at how the cantilever exits the opening in the cartridge. It should be centered (off a record). Also, while a record is playing, it should remain straight when looking at it from above.
I agree with Graham's experience that the MMC1-5 series is much more prone to the suspension actually failing. But I have come across some MMC20 cartridges that simply sounded bad even though the stylus looked OK - I can't think of other reasons than a hardened suspension that won't allow the cantilever to move as it is supposed to.
Of course, first experiment with different stylus weight settings. The dial on the record deck might not be correct, and a worn stylus / cartridge might also sound better with a bit more weight than originally specified.
And finally, it's possible that the phono preamp in your Beomaster needs attention.
--mika
Hello Tournedos,
i checked the suspension as best as i could using a stamp magnifying glass, it looks just fine, and stays straight when playing a record.
I added 1/4 of a gram to the 1 gram setting, made things much better.
I can hear a humm/buzz coming through the speakers when Phono or Tape is selected before putting a record or tape on. When listening to music, it covers the humm/buzz. So i guess i'll have to do some work on Beomaster but what will need changing ?
Thank you for your advice.
Søren Hammer: I know he does replace the suspension - at least he did on my MMC6000 and SP15 (both technically identical to any MMC20 inside). Why shouldn't a hardened suspension be a issue? The function of the suspension is to keep the cantilever in place, while not impeding motion of the cantilever. The rubber material used hardens; it has been proven before and is a very known issue with the newer MMCx series (it hardens faster because of the smaller dimensions, just like glue dries faster when in smaller concentrations.) Hard suspension means some impedance to the cantilever which induces distortion. The cantilever may fall off as well, which I have encountered at least four times (two of them belonged to BeoWorld users.)
Here is his reply to a question I asked him back in 2011
I have also had some MMC20xx that tracked fine and looked fine under a microscope but just didn't sound right.Haven't had any of them re-suspension'ed though.I have also had a couple of failed suspension cases of MMC20xx, one of them happening right beforemy eyes here in my own livingroom while playing a record so it does happen though I must agree, that the MMC1-5 seriesseem far more prone.
Martin