ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
First off, I don't have any B&O product yet but heavily consider investing in them. Why I landed at B&O is actually that I was looking for a WiFi speaker that has chromecast built in since my main streaming service is Deezer. That narrowed down the selection greatly so I landed here. So what do I want and have? In short I would like one main setup and a few loose wifispeakers (i.e. Beoplay M5's). I have a Rega record player, Kef LS50 Wireless and a third party cd player. My thought was to include a Beosound Core in between the CD/Record players and the Kefs (connect the Core to the Kefs via toslink). This would mean to add a switch before the Core since that one only has one Line-in where would need 2. This seems to make it possible to stream/sync my cd's and lp's throughout the house, correct? For the purists: yes I know I would go from analogue LP to digital in the Core, to analogue on the speakers, but that is okay (worst case: for careful listening I could add a second connection from the recordplayer to the Kefs when I'm not multi-rooming).
First question is: would this make sense and work as I think it should?
Secondly: in case it would be okay to switch my CDplayer for a B&O one in order to skip the switch would it be possible to add for instance a cheap second hand Beocenter 2 and connect that to the Core via this Powerlink port?
Thirdly: If so far all answers are positive ;) Would I be able to say play/pause and skip tracks on the Beocenter 2 (via the Core?) using the Halo remote? Least important of the bunch obviously, just think that Halo is very sexy... ;)
Hi eswa and welcome here.
If you aim at connecting/using a BS Core with the Kefs, you basicly use these as a pair of active speakers.
1: The Core has one input, yes. But if you also have an M5 in the setup, you have another line input there.
The line inputs on the B&O devices - rightly set up - can be distributed over the NL network….meaning you can access both on either device.
The drawback = you can not have a CD player and the vinyl player located in the same room, if that is important to you. (Otherweise you have to use some kind of switch).
Further Deezer is an integrated source in the B&O devices (controlled from within the B&O app) and can be multiroomed to and from any B&O device…..you don’t have to rely on AP2/CC for that.
Be prepared for some potential hassle with volume regulation with the Core/Kef combination, since both have a volume control. (It would be easier just to use a pair of regular active speakers respectively a set of B&O speakers/Beolabs.
2: That won’t work. However, the BC2 has a set of AUX-out that you might use for connection to the Core/line-in.
I am not so sure that the handling will be easy….especially not if you have family members who will use the setup too. (Again two volume controls and an extra remote)
3: All sources of the BC2 must be controlled either on the device or with a Beo4 - there is no way to do this within the B&O app or with the Halo.
This said, there is an option for this to work. But that would involve a NL/ML Converter (only available second hand) and that is a rather complicated setup for someone new to B&O.
Let’s see if other members have other ideas.
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Thanks for the extensive reply! Much appreciated!
On how to connect the Core to the Kefs: I see the optical out option, but then the volume is done by the Kefs I assume since optical is only sending 1's and 0's containing the musical data and no volume, as you said. So in case I want to use something like a Halo, its functionality would be limited. That means I could better use the PowerLink output on the Core and connect that to the AUX in on the Kefs, correct? If I would then just leave the Kefs on on a medium volumelevel, any Beoremote matching the Core would be able to do some volumecontrol within the set range. Could be that eventually I might invest in B&O speakers, but for now I love my Kefs so trying to integrate them into a B&O multiroom system.
The CD and Recordplayer are in the same room, so the M5 option was a creative one but won't be my preferred one . I already have a 2-RCA-to-1 hardware switch, and since starting either a CD or a record requires one to stand next to the devices, just flipping the switch is not too bad.
Is there them a remote that does both the BC2 and the Core? Or are there alternatives for the BC2 that are not too big and do CD which communicate with the Halo? (like: is there any CD device that communicates with the Halo?). Thought about the Beosound 4 or the 5 with that CDRipper (which I assume also allows for cd playback?). Or might the Beo5 or Beo6 remotes be able to talk with both the Core and some CD playing device?
I read that Deezer is integrated in the B&O app, which is a nice addition, and the ability to have Chromecast is a bonus there as well as Spotify Connect. That is kind of why I am now researching around in the B&O world.
Thanks for the help!
The Core can natively be controlled by a Beoremote One/BT, the Essence Remote, the Halo, alternatively the Bang & Olufsen app.
You can IR-control it, when you add an external IR-receiver (not the early version of the Core).
A BC2 (or a BS4/5……) only reacts to an IR-based remote e.g. the Beo4.
If you want to integrate the old IR-based (Masterlink-based) products properly to work smoothly with the newer network-based, you will need a NL/ML Converter……..this brings the old products into a networking state (very simplified explained).
Lots of threads on this subject can be found on the forum.
@Brian Sarah: Thanks! Thought that that would be the case!
@Millemissen: Thanks for the explanation, I understand the 2 families of remotes now better. It seems the Halo or Essence are then the two that would be my preferences. I googled around a bit on this NL/ML converter in order to bring old machines back online, but still have some questions about that. So let's say I buy a second hand Beocenter 2 that I only use as a CD player. I would assume I would get an NL/ML converter that I connect to my BC2, so that one now pops up as a seperate entity on my app. Say I connect my recordplayer to the LineIn of the BC2. I then connect my Kefs with the Powerlink output. Does this kind of mean that such an NL/ML Converter would replace the use of a Core? And would I then be able to control volume and skipping tracks, choosing inputs with the essence/halo remote?
Sounds good, but then the Spotify/Deezer/Chromecast is missing. That would mean the inclusion of a Core as well somewhere. Where would that hop in? Adding in a Core for the streaming options would for CD playback (when connecting them digitally) move the volume to the Core and leaves the skipping to the BC2. That would mean change inputs when you want to change volume vs. skip track on say an Essence remote, or?
Thinking other options then. I obviously also came across a Moment and a Beosound 5 (Encore). On all those options, there is so much forumtopics about them on the integration (or lack thereoff) of Spotify and/or Deezer, let alone Chromecast.
The BS5 (Encore): Lovely design, amazing controlwheel, but I don't have any downloaded music, so if that interface would work on Deezer or Spotify, I would be happy, as well as then the option to connect my recordplayer/cdplayer (with external switch or not, that's no biggie) and control it all through the device itself (or with an IR remote) is fine. I saw that there is a CDRipper for the BS5, I assume that can also be used just as cd player? But in the end, I am a bit hessitant to buy a more than 10 year old device that is mainly focussed on modern music streaming and I would buy for the interface.
Then the Moment. Seems to be the last system they made, but where I also read mixed information about. First off, for me as a Deezer user it seems to be great. But how is the Spotify experience? Then, I found that that one has some custom made cd-player to it as well, and probably a Line-In where I can connect my recordplayer to. But also there I am a bit hessitant to buy such an old product, where the focus is the GUI (no worries about buying an old amplifier or speakers, but these are computers running some OS (I read Windows XP, oj) so then 10 years is lightyears behind).
So all in all I guess I am just sad that B&O made some amazing systems with screens back in the day, but these days I am probably "stuck" to a Core, and then have to have my interface in an app on my smartphone. Maybe the Halo would bring in some sexyness though...
Hope it makes sence, and feel free to just talk certain solutions out of my head!
Actually thereare three types of remotes….since the Halo and the Bang & Olufsen are working in the network realm.
A BC2 with no connected speakers - but connected through ML to the Converter - makes it possible to access its sources (in your case the CD part and the vinyl player connected to the BC2 Aux input) from any NL device (e.g. the Core) in your network (when properly set up).
If you connect the Core - as you have mentioned it - to the Kefs (those working only as a set of speakers), you could control the Core (inclusive the playback of the BC2/CD and the turning on the Aux port) from withing the app, using the Halo or the Essence Remote/Beoremote One/BT.
So you will need a Core, yes! Otherweise there is no Deezer, Spotify Connect, Netradio, AP2, CC……. in the mix.
Shortly put - forget the BS5/Encore….those will not bring anything that you ask for.
(Yes there is a CD-ripper for the BS5, but those are rare and the BS5 instead of a BC2 would only complicate things).
The BS Moment for most people is too buggy - you don’t need it, since Deezer already is a part of the Core (and it has no opttion for Spotify Connect, AP2, CC) and you already have netradio in a Core.
IMO as of today there really is no need for a ‘music system with it’s own GUI’ - and things are moving fast.
Something like the Core and a dedicated iPad accompanied by a Halo, Essence Remote, Beoremote One/BT works well and has future potential.
Thanks for another extensive reply
So if I read you correctly, you would go for the solution which includes a Core as main unit, connect a BC2 to that for CD playback, and add in the record player to the Core via some hardware switch or maybe even via de aux-in of the BC2. That would result in that eventually (with everything set up correctly) I could control the Core with say a Halo out of the box, but additionally I would also be able to control the BC2 with a Halo which allows input-switching (CD or AUX (LP)), play-pause-skip cd playback.
Eventhough the Halo and Essence use different techniques, the Halo is quite pricy and the Essence might do the trick as well, so does it? Would the Essence be able to talk to the Core, BC2 and on a stretch there: I see the Essence does have the option to use IR for legacy products. Would it theoretically be possible to also use an Essence to control the volume of my Kefs which have an IR remote (and I found a PDF giving the codes the Kefs need to do things)?
On another note, I asked this question also on Reddit and there someone said that I should avoid using the M5 (or 3) in this system, since it does not allow for roomsyncing if one plays via Chromecast. Is that right? I would love to listen to something on Deezer on my headphones, click the chromecast button on my phone, and send what I am listening to my whole house. This is not possible? Would that mean that I have to open the B&O app, find the same playlist, and send it to all speakers through that app so it pulls it straight from Deezer to Beolink, without using Chromecast?
Would an investment in say a newer Beoplay Emerge solve this issue? (like: is that one possible to group in Google Home, so I can send my musicstream from my Deezer android app via Chromecast directly to the whole house?)
You won’t be able to control a BC2 via the app or via the Halo unless this is connected via a NL/ML Converter to you network of the B&O NL/networked devices.
In case it is connected via the converter, you can not use the Essence Remote in similar way as the Halo can be used - that remote is a point to point device (and you can not mix bt and ir control there - it is either or).
I can not say what that ‘someone on Reddit’ is talking about.
There is Chromecast support on the M3/M5 (as well as on the Emerge) - you can make a group (in the Home app) and adress that/cast to it from the native Deezer app, when you want to switch from headphone listening (on the phone) to listening to the devices in the group, you made. No need to involve the B&O app for that…..it is a pure Chromecast feature.
Ok, I think I get it then. Will first try to find a Core for a nice price, and picking up 2 M5's today. When I got those, I will look for a nicely prices BC2 and try to connect it to the Core and into my system. The Halo might be a very late addition, but who knows
Thanks for all the help!
Millemissen: I can not say what that ‘someone on Reddit’ is talking about. There is Chromecast support on the M3/M5 (as well as on the Emerge) - you can make a group (in the Home app) and adress that/cast to it from the native Deezer app, when you want to switch from headphone listening (on the phone) to listening to the devices in the group, you made. No need to involve the B&O app for that…..it is a pure Chromecast feature.
Are you sure about the M5?
After the Sonos lawsuit changes to how Google Chromecast works, my M5 (which indeed is not updated to Cast firmware 1.52) can't play as part of Chromecast groups anymore.
https://www.googlenestcommunity.com/t5/Blog/Upcoming-Speaker-Group-changes/ba-p/77811
Most Speaker Groups should continue functioning as expected unless you have a speaker group containing other brands of Cast-based devices, like JBL or Lenovo, they need to be on 1.52.272222 or higher Cast firmware version. Check out this article on how to find your device’s firmware version or contact your device maker. M5 is on Cast version 1.28. B&O has confirmed to me they have no intention to update it to 1.52. (M3 and later models have been updated to 1.52 at the beginning of the year) eswa: On another note, I asked this question also on Reddit and there someone said that I should avoid using the M5 (or 3) in this system, since it does not allow for roomsyncing if one plays via Chromecast. Is that right? I would love to listen to something on Deezer on my headphones, click the chromecast button on my phone, and send what I am listening to my whole house. This is not possible? Would that mean that I have to open the B&O app, find the same playlist, and send it to all speakers through that app so it pulls it straight from Deezer to Beolink, without using Chromecast? I am that person on Reddit Chromecast does support the feature you're talking about in your example, IF the device has Cast firmware 1.52 or higher. So if you purchase any currently supporte B&O connected speakers, such as M3, Beosound 1/2, or the new ones based on Mozart (Emerge/Level/Balance), that will work perfectly. With M5 however it won't, and yes if you want to have M5 and use Deezer in a multiroom set-up, you'll have to rely on the Deezer integration within the B&O app, hence performing the "extension" of the sound from one speaker to another or to more speakers via Beolink (instead of using the native Deezer app and managing that via Chromecast and Google Home app). I love the sound (and sound/price ratio) of my M5, but I would strongly recommend against buying it if you want to use it in a Chromecast-based set-up. All good if instead you want to use AirPlay2 or B&O app/Beolink. What I was saying on Reddit and that was misunderstood is that you cannot extend Chromecast (as an input source) via Beolink. And I didn't say anything about M3, by the way
eswa: On another note, I asked this question also on Reddit and there someone said that I should avoid using the M5 (or 3) in this system, since it does not allow for roomsyncing if one plays via Chromecast. Is that right? I would love to listen to something on Deezer on my headphones, click the chromecast button on my phone, and send what I am listening to my whole house. This is not possible? Would that mean that I have to open the B&O app, find the same playlist, and send it to all speakers through that app so it pulls it straight from Deezer to Beolink, without using Chromecast?
@matteventu
Thanks for correcting
I was simply assuming that B&O would upgrade the CC firmware on all product - why shouldn’t they.
But it is important to know that this - as of now - is not so with the M5.
So yes, your advice not to buy the M5 - if someone relies on CC/Google, which I understand that eswa does - is very relevant.
He might instead begin his (B&O) journey with the M3 - a couple of maybe.
Aha, okay, thanks for the clarification! I am leaning to the M5 for sound and price, but this seems then a dumb buy as you said. If I get it correctly, an M5 won't be able to join in a Google cast group at all then? Eventhough the other products in the group can (Core, M3)? Just to be sure: the Core can be in a Google cast group?
Gonna go hunting for an M3 then...since these Mozart speakers are quite expensive...maybe later!
It does seem weird that 2 products of the same series don't get the same update...Is there any way of pushing B&O to fix this? Seems like a minor thing since they already got it to work properly on the M3...
matteventu: M5 is on Cast version 1.28. B&O has confirmed to me they have no intention to update it to 1.52. (M3 and later models have been updated to 1.52 at the beginning of the year) ———- Chromecast does support the feature you're talking about in your example, IF the device has Cast firmware 1.52 or higher. So if you purchase any currently supporte B&O connected speakers, such as M3, Beosound 1/2, or the new ones based on Mozart (Emerge/Level/Balance), that will work perfectly. With M5 however it won't…..
———-
Thiss rather funny….in the sense of peculiar
I am not a Chromecast user, by far.
I certainly don’t use CC for multiroom - however, once in a while for casting video/YT.
I am a Beolink user - beolinking Spotify Connect and AP, when in need of multiroom.
But I did some tests with CC and grouping/multiroom a while back, so I know how to do it.
Here comes the funny part:
Because I was curious I did a test this afternoon.
I made a group of one of my Essences (MK2) and an M3 in the Home app…..and I can adress that, it plays fine from both devices.
The M3 is - of course - on CC version 1.52 as should be. However my Essence is on 1.28.102057….so it should not work, but it does!
Have you - or anyone else - tried to CC-group an M5 with an M3 (or another of the updated devices)?
We need some light shed on this!
eswa: It does seem weird that 2 products of the same series don't get the same update...Is there any way of pushing B&O to fix this? Seems like a minor thing since they already got it to work properly on the M3...
The reason for that is pretty simple actually: M5 is built on an older hardware platform, while M3 shares the same base hardware as (if I remember correctly) the Beosound 1/2 2nd Gen.
Millemissen: Thiss rather funny….in the sense of peculiar I am not a Chromecast user, by far. I certainly don’t use CC for multiroom - however, once in a while for casting video/YT. I am a Beolink user - beolinking Spotify Connect and AP, when in need of multiroom. But I did some tests with CC and grouping/multiroom a while back, so I know how to do it. Here comes the funny part: Because I was curious I did a test this afternoon. I made a group of one of my Essences (MK2) and an M3 in the Home app…..and I can adress that, it plays fine from both devices. The M3 is - of course - on CC version 1.52 as should be. However my Essence is on 1.28.102057….so it should not work, but it does! Have you - or anyone else - tried to CC-group an M5 with an M3 (or another of the updated devices)? We need some light shed on this! MM
It is indeed!
I've got my M5 in a group with 2x Google Home speakers and 1x Lenovo smart speaker and it no longer plays when the group is selected (while the other speakers of the group play perfectly fine).
Funny about the Essence!
I may do some other testing this weekend.
Eager to hear your test results! Just got one M3 that I'll be setting up tomorrow, but I am looking for something a little bigger as well. My eye fell on a second hand Beosound 1 for €700ish. Seems like an awful lot of money but it looks stunning!. Just checking here if you guys know if that one shares the M3's platform/firmware and therefore my desired Chromecast's features? Or is it more like an M5?
(Just double checking, since I think you named the BS1 somewhere above here)
A BS1 should be fine!
[Underlying reason for @MM's answer: Because the M5 with current firmware is reported to work, see above.]
For your future reference, here are the models and their audio system "engines", as reported by B&O when announcing that they *all* now support AirPlay2; accordingly, each group's firmware "should" all be the same feature set:
ASE 1: BeoPlay A6, BeoPlay A9 MKII, BeoSound 35, BeoSound Essence MKII
ASE TK: BeoSound 1, BeoSound 2, BeoPlay M5
ASE 2: BeoSound Core, BeoSound Shape, BeoVision Eclipse SoundCenter, BeoPlay M3, BeoSound Edge, BeoPlay A9 3rd gen, BeoSound 1 - 2nd gen (+ Google Assistant), BeoSound 2 - 2nd gen (+ Google Assistant)
Aha okay, so if I read the above correctly, a BeoSound 1 (gen1) is in the same ballpark as the M5, right? So if one can add an M5 to a Google casting group, then the BS1 would also work. Awaiting more proof that the M5 is capable of this Or put better: since the M5 isn't fully functional in a Chromecast house group, the Beosound 1 won't be either?
Little update: I bought two M3's now and have a Chromecast-Audio hanging on the back of my third party stereo amplifier, and have set up rooms and such in my Google Home app. So when listening to a playlist on the go on my android phone, I can immediately stream it to the whole house when entering through the front door by just tapping 2x in my Deezer-app (or podcast-app for that matter). Lovely! (to be complete: yes the third-party amplifier has to be turned on in order to work, CA doesn't allow it to wake up automatically).
So far for the Chromecast experience. No complaints! Now the B&O app and the multiroom linking and such. Experience so far is fairly limited since there is no real need for the app yet due to mainly Chromecasting. There is a Core on the way to replace the Chromecast Audio in the living room, so all nodes are B&O and it allows me to plug my cd and LP into the multiroom experience. That will increase the use of the B&O app. But for now: It seems really nice, clean and fairly intuitive. All the settings that one need are right there, and the sound tweaks you can do to your M3 is a nice bonus. The room linking was easy to find. Updated both my M3's to version 2.0.47944, and since it doesn't want to update any further, I assume it's the latest and greatest.
However, one thing I did find is the following: When I Chromecast a Deezer playlist to one speaker, and I want to sync in the second M3, I go into the B&O app, go to the Now Playing, click the multiroom icon in the bottom of the screen, and then it says that "This source does not support Multiroom"...Is this what we talked about above here in this topic? Or does the M5 not even allow playing in a Google Grouped multiroom setup at all? So far seems not a big issue for me, just restreaming it to the group I want solves it, otherwise the Deezer integration in the B&O app will be the way to go in the future for that behaviour, but...I can't login to Deezer through the B&O app! I am 100% putting in the correct credentials, but it keeps on saying "Incorrect email or password". Anyone got an idea?
Hi eswa
A chromecasted stream can not be distributed using Beolink….due to limitations of Chromecast - you have to use Google Home/grouping.
However, you can (if you are/were an iOS user) distribute an Airplay stream via Beolink.
Deezer is no problem at all, since it is an integrated service of the B&O devices.
To your login problem I can’t say anything - I do not use Deezer
(I am a Spotify user - Spotify Connect can be distributed over Beolink as well).
eswa: Little update: I bought two M3's now and have a Chromecast-Audio hanging on the back of my third party stereo amplifier, and have set up rooms and such in my Google Home app. So when listening to a playlist on the go on my android phone, I can immediately stream it to the whole house when entering through the front door by just tapping 2x in my Deezer-app (or podcast-app for that matter). Lovely! (to be complete: yes the third-party amplifier has to be turned on in order to work, CA doesn't allow it to wake up automatically). So far for the Chromecast experience. No complaints! Now the B&O app and the multiroom linking and such. Experience so far is fairly limited since there is no real need for the app yet due to mainly Chromecasting. There is a Core on the way to replace the Chromecast Audio in the living room, so all nodes are B&O and it allows me to plug my cd and LP into the multiroom experience. That will increase the use of the B&O app. But for now: It seems really nice, clean and fairly intuitive. All the settings that one need are right there, and the sound tweaks you can do to your M3 is a nice bonus. The room linking was easy to find. Updated both my M3's to version 2.0.47944, and since it doesn't want to update any further, I assume it's the latest and greatest. However, one thing I did find is the following: When I Chromecast a Deezer playlist to one speaker, and I want to sync in the second M3, I go into the B&O app, go to the Now Playing, click the multiroom icon in the bottom of the screen, and then it says that "This source does not support Multiroom"...Is this what we talked about above here in this topic? Or does the M5 not even allow playing in a Google Grouped multiroom setup at all? So far seems not a big issue for me, just restreaming it to the group I want solves it, otherwise the Deezer integration in the B&O app will be the way to go in the future for that behaviour, but...I can't login to Deezer through the B&O app! I am 100% putting in the correct credentials, but it keeps on saying "Incorrect email or password". Anyone got an idea?
Correct, that's what I wasy saying when I mentioned that Chromecast as source cannot be distributed via Beolink.
I had the same issue with the Deezer integration in the B&O app, so I changed my password and it then it worked - a bit odd as I'm sure the credentials were correct as I was using them with the Deezer app and site. Anyway, changing the password solved it.
Exactly, and the added limitation of an M5 is that that one won't play in a group?
And a Beosound 1gen1 is like an M5, and a gen2 is like an M3? (softwarewise)
Just checking since the M3 is rather small, and a Beosound 1 is quite expensive.