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Has anyone found a way to reduce the yellowing of the “piano keys” on a Beomaster 1000?
I’ve tried the usual grocery store cleaners: Windex with Vinegar and Fantastic which had little if any effect.
I am concerned with trying anything stronger as I do not want to remove the black ink symbols on the keys….. but open to suggestions.
Jeff
Beogram 4000, Beogram 4002, Beogram 4004, Beogram 8000, Beogram 8002, Beogram 1602. Beogram 4500 CD player, B&O CDX player, Beocord 4500, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 5000 T4716, Beocord 8004, Beocord 9000, Beomaster 1000, Beomaster 1600, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 2400.2, Beomaster 4400, Beomaster 4500, Beolab 5000, Beomaster 5000, BeoCenter 9000. BeoSound Century, S-45.2, S-45.2, S-75, S-75, M-75, M-100, MC 120.2 speakers; B&O Illuminated Sign (with crown & red logo). B&O grey & black Illuminated Sign, B&O black Plexiglas dealer sign, B&O ash tray, B&O (Orrefors) dealer award vase, B&O Beotime Clock. Navy blue B&O baseball cap, B&O T-shirt X2, B&O black ball point pen, B&O Retail Management Binder
I don't know about the symbol prints, but this method seems to work well with computer keyboards: http://www.exisle.net/mb/index.php?/topic/59657-de-yellowing-plastic-the-stain-isnt-permanent-after-all/
Vinyl records, cassettes, open reel, valve amplifiers and film photography.
Thanks Søren. I checked out the article but I don’t know if I am ready to take this Beomaster apart in order to soak the piano keys. Perhaps there is some other method that is less intrusive.
It's nicotine or at least related to heavy smokers Beomasters (you'll know if you look inside a couple of them) andunfortunately not just on the surface.What Søren links to may work on some types of plastics but this is an older type, quite far from the ABS types usedin the 1980s.I've found no other option than replacing the keys but try it and let us know.
Looking inside smokers units I don't like the thought that humans were breathing in that very same room...
Martin
Hello Martin,
That makes sense, and how unfortunate.
So I won't try scrubbing these piano keys any further. I'll bet the smoking didn't do the electronics any good either.
Piaf: Hello Martin, That makes sense, and how unfortunate. So I won't try scrubbing these piano keys any further. I'll bet the smoking didn't do the electronics any good either. Jeff
Try carefully with Magic Eraser, moistened with a little water, I have used ME on nearly everything and in some cases it is just amazing what it can do.
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
Good idea and I have tried that too. Magic Eraser is a really nice product but it's a bit hardon the lettering on the BM1000 keys and gives no color change.
Hi Martin and Søren,
I am game for anything, but if as Martin says it won’t change the colour, what is the point? The keys are not marked-up, just really yellow.
One other thing, although the sunlight here in British Columbia is nothing compared to my native Florida, I do know that sunlight can and does yellow plastics….. dries plastic out too. So this maybe sunlight induced yellowing rather than smoking related….. if that makes any difference.
As Martin already mentioned, early white plastics (and cheap newer ones) gets yellow with age,more so if exposed to direct sunlight, this happens homogeneous and you can do nothing about it. If it is smoke related its normally at the surface only.
Hello both Sørens and Martin,
No luck with the Magic Eraser. I gave it the old college try and managed to dull the plastic while removing some of the lettering….. make that lightening the lettering, but not what I was hoping to do.
I then tried my favourite trick, that is use automobile cleaners/polishes on the plastic. That helped ever so slightly and the Meguiar’s plastic protection just brought the plastic appearance back to what it was before I used the ME on it.
Hey, it didn’t work, but we tried and I appreciate the tip.
As for the Beomaster 1000 residing in a smoker’s household, I rather doubt it as the insides look quite respectable.
Sunlight can do strange things, that's for sure but if you look inside, I'm sure you'll find that thekeys have also yellowed on the underside.
I was inside this Beomaster 1000 expecting to find an ungodly amount of dust after so many years, which wasn’t the case. However I have a vague memory that the keys were fairly evenly yellowed.
I just made an exepriment with one of the side dummy keys, that has no lettering and left it in clorine over night.Pros. it got lighter., not to orginal colour but obvious differencecons - the clorine ate up the shiny surface, from a difference Its not noticable but if you look close you can see it and you can feel the difference with your finger.Havent tried with one of the keys with lettering, guess there is a chance the black colour will disapear, or also change colourC
My re-capped M75 are my precious diamonds.
more..If I look very very closely on on of the yellowing keys, I can see patterned cracks on the yellowing surface, which I suspect is an already started chemical process of combination of age, light, smoke, and whatever, so the surface is already going through some kind detoriation, that most likely will just get worse and worse over timeThe clorine reacts only this detoriated surface, not att all on the side or the back part of the key.So from a specualtive point of view, for those that wants to experiement, maybe clorine could be part of a method combined with fine sanding and re-lettering and lacquer.Lots of work though ...
I found a link on plastics and the aging process, it is more informative maybe than helpful but interesting none the less.
http://www.plastiquarian.com/index.php?id=7&subid=127
John
Read a bit there, but as we dont know the material used in the keys, we seems to lost in the fog...The white border benith the scale seems to be in a different plastic , as it is soft and bendable
Just remember, the keys were never really white, but very light cream colored
Interesting link, depressing, but informative.
John Francis: I found a link on plastics and the aging process, it is more informative maybe than helpful but interesting none the less. http://www.plastiquarian.com/index.php?id=7&subid=127 John
"bonewhite" as we say here...yep suspected that based on how the keys looks like under
Christian,
I would be very careful in using chlorine on plastic as it will literally eat it. The lost shinny surface was just the beginning.
I read the piece provided by John Francis and the bottom line is plastics deteriorate, some far more than others and once you notice it, it is too late to do anything about it. (I am sure this is entirely correct.)
The piano keys in the BM 1000 yellow with time, but it is nothing, I repeat NOTHING like the plastic Tandberg used in the seventies, which literally falls apart in front of your eyes.
Personally I like to use the “plastic care” products associated with automobiles on my plastic items. Rumor has it that these products actually destroy the plastics, but I have been doing this since the late sixties so if Meguiar's or any of the other readily available plastic care products is bad for plastics, evidence certainly hasn’t shown up at my house.
Aside from giving a more lustrous appearance with deeper colours; like wood care products which do nothing for the wood BUT do provide protection from abrasion, so it is with these plastic care products.
They look better and feel better, what is not to like?
Of course none of the above is going to get rid of the yellowing.
I am anyway taking another chance on clorine, just for sharing the experience.Have put the white border and one lettering keys in clorine now for a overnighter.we will see...
OK, good luck. Let us know how things turn out!
I would advice not to use any chemicals on old plastic as it may dry out the plastic and make it brittle.
//Bo.A long list...
Bo,
Strong chemicals will definitely dry out plastics, old or new, and make them brittle.
While I wished Christian luck, that was not to imply that I thought using chlorine on plastic was a good idea. It isn’t.
Point of fact when I once attempted to maintain my own swimming pool I witnessed first hand how stored chorine damaged anything near it, causing corrosion on metal and God help you if you got it on your skin, as it will begin eat skin on contact.
However I do like some of the “chemicals” specifically marketed to preserve and care for plastic like Armor All and Maguire’s.
Clorine is dangerous in many aspects, the steam from it is dangerous., so I plastic cover the treat.They say it is cancer triggering...damn me, i have cleaned stuff with clorine on my fingers and hands thousands of times during my life., sometimes for hours without glowsMy fingers are still on my hands, but admit I havent always been careful .
More Chlorine experiments.
My agenda was to try what people not have tried, anbd share my experience.
My orginal purpose of restoring B&O products are less visual and more of a getting functionality of the machines to be in order, so I am not much of an experimentor when it comes to finish.
But here is my thoughts and experiences with pros and cons, not to advice you but to just share.
This overnighter in chlorine was with the key that already had a detoriation of the lettering.The filled ring was already partly detoriated of usage, but the lines ring was not.
Interesting is that the lined ring was not affected at all by the chlorine at all, but the , already partly worned out lettering, the filled ring was abit affected by the chlorine ( I should have taken a picture before )
Pros -from a distance the plastic have bleeched quiet close to bonewhite in my eyes., difference is more obvious in real. From a distance it get an overall better look and the un even yellowing is replaced with a more equal colour
Cons, -the chlorine eats the plastic that is affected by light. and the tiny cracks made by age , smoke, light, fat, dust become a bit more obvious - if you look very close.
So treating with chlorine can get an overall betterlook from a distance, I have no doubt, but with risks.
On the other side - looking very close on a yellowing key seeing how cracks and the surface has started to crimp, how will the keys look in 10, 20 , 30 years , compared to a chlorine treated kay 2014 ?.
I would guess that an untreated key will be even more yellow by time...and how will these cracks on the surface develop over time ?, like a huge cracked pattern on the keys, where the cracks will crimp and emerge the bonewhite background like a puzzel pattern bettween the very yellow pattern parts ?
Time will tell, we can olny speculate.........
Hi Christian,
Well you have indeed done something few people have dared to try and thank you for sharing.
The results were far better than I ever, but ever expected!
Still don’t know if it was a good idea, but it was effective!
Your efforts are appreciated!
Hi,
I used chlorine too, only to realize a few months later that the yellowing had worsened...
STOP!
Jacques
chartz: Hi, I used chlorine too, only to realize a few months later that the yellowing had worsened... STOP!
Hi Jacques,
I avoid using chlorine on anything, especially plastic, as I believe it dries out the plastic, for lack of a better technical description.
I am genuinely surprised that the yellowing worsened as I would have expected the colour to remain stable, just the plastic showing new stress lines and being entirely more brittle.
Piaf: chartz: Hi, I used chlorine too, only to realize a few months later that the yellowing had worsened... STOP! I am genuinely surprised that the yellowing worsened as I would have expected the colour to remain stable, just the plastic showing new stress lines and being entirely more brittle.
And yet it is a fact!
Interesting.
In any case I certainly would not question you….. if you say it got worse, I am sure it did.
Although I had no plans to try to recreate Christian’s experiment, I definitely won’t try it now!
Piaf: Although I had no plans to try to recreate Christian’s experiment, I definitely won’t try it now!
What a relief, I was afraid you'd do that. I guess that chlorine being one of the ingredients of plastic, some sort of chemical reaction takes place here. But I'm no chemist, and I might as well be completely wrong Jeff.
There was never the slightest chance that I would try bleach on plastic.
That Christian tried it sans any terrible effect was interesting, but just because I saw an athlete leap over a thousand foot drop ravine, doesn’t mean I would feel so inclined to try it myself.
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