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Hi,
I'm thinking of getting myself the new Beovision 11-55, but I've read reviews mention it has very high input lag. This is a problem for using the TV as a computer monitor and for videogames like PlayStation 3.
So, owners of Beovision 11, what are your experiences with input lag? What types of games to you play?
I really want this TV so badly, but it's useless to me if it can't play games.
Update: I bought one and the input lag is not a problem. 78 ms, according to B&O. My old Pioneer 5090H was supposedly quicker, but I can't tell a difference in games like GTA: V, The Last of Us, Far Cry 3 and Modern Warfare.
Also check out the video I made below.
Hi there, Lundmark.
I am happy to share my experience regarding playing games on the BV11. I have the 40" model and I play games frequently on Xbox 360 and laptop through HDMI. When you select game mode, I have not had any problems playing all kinds of games. I have enjoyed Tomb Raider, Crysis 2, BorderLands 2, GRID and Metro Last Light to name a few. All games were responsive to all button inputs. One thing though, it is clear that the picture quality decreases when game mode is selected, but it is still very good.
Best regards,
Frederik
BeoVision Eclipse 55, BeoPlay S8 (sub+rears), BeoPlay A9 MKII (living room), BeoVision Avant 32 DVD (retro gaming, basement), BeoLab 4000 (entertainment room, basement), BeoSound 8 (workshop), 2x BeoPlay S3 (PC), BeoPlay A1, BeoPlay H2/H3 (on the go)
Thanks for your reply.
I'm glad to hear this. It makes me curious, though, as to why the initial reviews state the BV11 to be way too slow for gaming. Do you know if there has been an update since those reviews were written?
I'm waking this tread up again since I can't find the other thread where we discussed the input lag of the BV11 (and V1 and Beosystem 4).
At first the BV11 had input lag in GAME mode of approx 100ms, which makes it practically impossible to play fast action games or racing games (COD, Battlefield, Killzone, GT5, etc).
An update came shortly thereafter reducing the input to around 70ms. It is now possible to play action games but it is very clear that you are at an disadvantage in almost all situations (since your components basically has 2-3 extra frames to aim and react). This is a critical issue for me and I guess a lot of other people (although I surely understand that not everyone uses their TV as a gaming TV) and the issue will become even more critical now that the PS4 have been released and almost every game will have 1080p/60 fps.
If you look at http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/input-lag it shows that the "best" TVs in respect of input lag has around 10-20ms, i.e. almost 3x faster than the BV11. Even Samsung LED LCD panels show such fast input lag.
If B&O could manage to further lower the input lag to at least 20-30ms it would go a long way.
I finally bought a BV11 and I do not have any lag issues with it in game mode, contrary to many of the claims I've read.
It seems to be a very subjective thing, though. I can't tell a difference between the BV11 and my previous Pioneer PDP-LX5090H, but then again I'm not exactly a hardcore gamer. I do play a lot of different games, however, I'm just not competing online etc.
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
Not everyone knows or remembers this excelent thread:
http://archivedforum2.beoworld.org/forums/t/3372.aspx?PageIndex=1
The user KMA has written a very good overview of the settings of his BV11.
It is still almost a bible for BV11 owners, imo.
It is worth it to read/reread this thread!
Greetings Millemissen
There is a tv - and there is a BV
lundmark: I can't tell a difference between the BV11 and my previous Pioneer PDP-LX5090H
I can't tell a difference between the BV11 and my previous Pioneer PDP-LX5090H
Offtopic, sorry:
I understand your statement refers to the Input lag only. But how is Picture Quality in comparison? Thanks!
Ralf
Living Room: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-2 (Center), Beolab 9 (Fronts), Beolab 8000 (Rears), no Subwoofer. Screen: Sony KD-85XH9096Dining Room: Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 4000 on stands, fed by Amazon Echo Show 8Home Cinema: Beosystem 4, Beolab 7-4 (Center), Beolab 1 (Fronts), Beolab 4000 (Rears). Projector: Sony VPL-HW55Home Office: Beosystem 3, Beolab 7-4, Beolab 5000, Screen: Sony KD-55XH9005 on Beovision 7-40 stand, ML to Beosound 9000 MK3 and Beosound 5/Beomaster 5 (1 TB SSD version)Bedroom: Sony KD-65XH9077, Beosound Essence MK II with Beolab 6002 and Beolab 11 (all white, wall-mounted)
In storage: Beolab 5000/Beomaster 5000 (1960s).
BeoGreg: I watch them play, I can't see any lag and it´s never in game mode.
I watch them play, I can't see any lag and it´s never in game mode.
I have a hard time believing this. There's a huge input lag when the TV is set to adaptive or film mode, not to mention the stuttering caused by the image processing (which I believe has to do with the unpredictable frame rates coming from a video game). GTA V is totally unusable in adaptive/film mode.
kallasr: Offtopic, sorry: I understand your statement refers to the Input lag only. But how is Picture Quality in comparison? Thanks! Ralf
It's great.
I hadn't expected that, actually, but the blacks are on par with the Pioneer, if not better (the exception being pitch black images with bright spots where the dynamic backlight can't compensate for the LCD panel's shortcomings). The image is sharper and brighter, with more vivid colors. The only downside is viewing angles, which are good on the BV11 but much better on the Pio. The BV11 makes up for that by having its motorized stand.
lundmark:I have a hard time believing this. There's a huge input lag when the TV is set to adaptive or film mode, not to mention the stuttering caused by the image processing (which I believe has to do with the unpredictable frame rates coming from a video game). GTA V is totally unusable in adaptive/film mode.
I have to put all games on my PS3 in Game Mode (set to default on the input) otherwise I have lag and stuttering issues all over the place. This is on a V1-40 (same chassis as 11). Once in Game mode I never notice any lag or stuttering.
Ah, you know... A little B&O here, a little there
I suppose I should add that I used to have a receiver sandwiched between the Pioneer TV and the PS3, which might have increased the input lag in that setup, so the BV11 seems more competitive than it really is.
But I think the more likelier explanation is that I'm not a skilled pro gamer. :-)
BeoGreg, Have you turned off judder canceling in the image settings of the BV11? The random stuttering caused by it is by far the worst offender in terms of playability. It is always off in game mode, but on by default in the other modes.
And what about when you do switch to game mode? Have you noticed any difference in gameplay?
BeoGreg, Have you turned off judder canceling in the image settings of the BV11? The random stuttering caused by it is by far the worst offender in terms of playability. It is always off in game mode, but on by default in the other modes. And what about when you do switch to game mode? Have you noticed any difference in gameplay?
I guess that is not the problem of input lag.
As fas as I understand, input lag is the problem where the picture is simply shown too late. It may very well be fluent, but simply e.g. half a second late.This is problematic when playing games: you aim at a target and press 'fire', however, the thing you see at that moment is the picture frame of half a second ago and the target has moved since. You should have pressed your xbox controller earlier, but couldn't because your tv was simply too late to show the 'current' picture frame (because it was processing it). That is input lag. Selecting 'game mode' should reduce this processing time, but apparently, on the V1 and BV11, this reduced time is still (too) long.
Same for a connected computer, you move you mouse, but the pointer on the screen moves only half a second later.
This makes the tv unfit for playing responsive games.
Beolit 12 - Beolab 4 pc (dead now) - Beoplay H5 - Beolab 9 - BeoRemote One BT - Beoplay M3
crossbytje:I guess that is not the problem of input lag. As fas as I understand, input lag is the problem where the picture is simply shown too late. It may very well be fluent, but simply e.g. half a second late. This is problematic when playing games: you aim at a target and press 'fire', however, the thing you see at that moment is the picture frame of half a second ago and the target has moved since. You should have pressed your xbox controller earlier, but couldn't because your tv was simply too late to show the 'current' picture frame (because it was processing it). That is input lag. Selecting 'game mode' should reduce this processing time, but apparently, on the V1 and BV11, this reduced time is still (too) long. Same for a connected computer, you move you mouse, but the pointer on the screen moves only half a second later. This makes the tv unfit for playing responsive games.
BeoGreg: That´s what I experienced. When I say the picture freeze is that for half a second it stops. You have someone in front of you and the time you shoot him is allready gone.
That´s what I experienced. When I say the picture freeze is that for half a second it stops. You have someone in front of you and the time you shoot him is allready gone.
Well, the freezing is unrelated to the input lag. Freezing is a different problem and is annoying in any case.The input lag is just constantly there, it is the delay in showing the stuff. The tv takes too much time between receiving the signal and showing it on the screen (due to processing). The result can be perfectly smooth, it is just late, but everything is late, so you don't really notice unless you're playing games where timing is crucial.
Dom
2x BeoSystem 3, BeoSystem 5000, BeoSystem 6500, 2x BeoMaster 7000, 2 pair of BeoLab Penta mk2, AV 7000, Beolab 4000, BeoSound 4000, Playmaker, BeoLab 2500, S-45, S-45.2, RL-140, CX-50, C-75, 3x CX-100, 3x MCL2 link rooms, 3x Beolab 2000, M3, P2, Earset, A8 earphones, A3, 2x 4001 relay, H3, H3 ANC, H6, 2014 Audi S5 with B&O sound, and ambio
That would be impossible.
The game system would have to know in advance what is going to happen. Say, you want to shoot a target, but the target is shown half a second too late. At the time you physically pull the trigger/push the button, everything that will appear on the screen in the next half a second has already been sent to the tv (and is 'being processed' there). The game system can not know in advance what frames to send, i.e. whether you will actually hit or miss the target.
The only solution is a 'game mode', but as I've read, this mode on the BV11 is still too slow.
crossbytje: The only solution is a 'game mode', but as I've read, this mode on the BV11 is still too slow.
For some users, apparently. I don't think it is. For me, gaming in game mode works just as well as it did on my previous Pioneer plasma.
True, could have been improved through a software update. It is just hard to find more details about this.
If, or when, I decide to get me a BV11, I'd have to be testing one to see how 'bad' it really is.
I am currently playing Donkey Kong Country Tropical Freeze on the Wii U. Incredible timing and precession in jumps is required to make it through the levels. Everything is super responsive and accurate on the BV11. Do not have any worries with gaming on this display!
double post
I made this video hoping that it will provide some useful information regarding input lag on the BV11.
It consists of two tests:
Judder cancellation is off.
Here's the video: http://youtu.be/-DGTNlZ44mM
Very helpful vid , thx !
This is indeed a very helpful video!
I bet the number of views will increase quickly.
Especially the first part using your macbook is enlightening. I'm now convinced that playing games will not be an issue.
It is just a matter of waiting until my old LG dies now... (and waiting to see what happens to Loewe, as it is currently going between a BV11 and a Reference ID, but that's another story)
Heh, awesome!
Thanks for sharing that video.
You now have 36 views
If you have an ATV in the setup (?) - did you try to use the BV11 as a monitor/second display for your Mac through it?
If yes - how was the result regards input lag?
MM
Yes, when the TV is set to game mode and using AirPlay Mirroring from my MacBook, the lag is something in between game mode and adaptive mode as shown in the video. I.e. it's not as quick as game mode on HDMI, but it's quicker than adaptive mode on HDMI.
Thanks!
Just made an input lag test after the new update. The input lag is now only 30 ms in both game-mode and monitor mode. Well done B&O!
If anyone wants to try it out on your own BeoVision, FlatpanelsHD made this very clever programme to test it at home. Requires a laptop with HDMI out and of course a camera :)
http://www.flatpanels.dk/monitortest_inputlag_dk.php
Great news! Hadn't realized the update was out. Thanks for your time testing it. I really haven't had any issues whatsoever with input lag on my BV11 prior to the update.
Really like the blue speaker cover. I have the white one, but thinking of replacing it with the blue.
Frederik Beoberg:Just made an input lag test after the new update. The input lag is now only 30 ms in both game-mode and monitor mode. Well done B&O! If anyone wants to try it out on your own BeoVision, FlatpanelsHD made this very clever programme to test it at home. Requires a laptop with HDMI out and of course a camera :) http://www.flatpanels.dk/monitortest_inputlag_dk.php BeoVision 11 - 40, BeoLab 9, BeoCenter 2, ML/NL converter, BeoLit 12, BeoPlay H3
excellent news