ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Can somebody please tell me what grease to use for the rails for horizontal movement on these turntables. I have heard about some silicone-grease - is there a specific brand/type? And where can I buy it?
No grease Steffan, I use a teflon lube, the delivery fluid of which evaporates so as not to trap dust etc. I should imagine silicon would also be fine.
Olly
I'm using an of the rack silicone grease (Steren), I found this one in DK, dont buy Lithium greases they may destroy polymer materials.
Ball bearing in rotating airport beacons, heater fans, electric clocks, watt hour meters and recording meters are principal applications of this grease. This grease is also used to lubricate anti-friction bearing in oven-fans, timer motors, textile slashers and driers, drier motors, induction draft units, plastic gears and cones in small appliances, ball and socket disconnect switches, swivel-joint packing, valve stems, continuous weighing equipment & automotive distributor pad joints. In all of these applications, the grease ensures long life and trouble free service with a minimum of maintenance and re-lubrication.
Collecting Vintage B&O is not a hobby, its a lifestyle.
Hello Steffen:
I've done quite a bit of research on this issue as I have far too many of the later tangential BeoGrams.
The service manuals for these units (I refer to them as the TX2's and later) call for Barrierta L5512 for use on the polished slide rails and other lubrication points . Interestingly, I've concluded that there is a slight typo here as there is not available a L5512 but rather a Barrierta L55/2 which is part of the Barrierta L55 series 1 through 3. It appears that the slash (/) was misrepresented as a 1 in the service manual.
Nonetheless, Barrierta L55/2 is known as a Polyfluoropolyether (PFPE) PTFE synthetic Grease.
Unfortunately, I was unable to source any Barrierta L55/2 in affordable quantities if at all. However, in comparing all of the many specifications for the Barrierta L55 series greases, I found an almost identical product in Dupont's Krytox GPL series greases - most importantly, the plastic friendly aspect and a PFPE PTFE lightweight synthetic grease. A thorough specifications comparison of the many available variations brought me to the Dupont Krytox GPL 203 or GPL 204.
These are available in as little as 2 ounce quantities and sell here in the USA for approximately $45.00 per 2 ounce tube.
And then there is eBay. As one would expect, there are many grades of Krytox GPL series greases available for sale on eBay in accessible quantities. I see GPL 205 but no GPL 203 or GPL 204 as of late. The GPL 205 may be fine but I would not want to put anything too "heavy" on these rails for fear of slowing things down a bit.
I did find this Krytox GPL 203 comparable on eBay under a Krytox search and purchased some. I can say conclusively, that I do believe it is as good as Krytox and is manufactured by a very reputable manufacturer and is available by the seller "worldwide" and for a great price. It is described in the posting as "BEL-RAY Brand PFPE #2 - PTFE Thickened Perfluoropolyether Grease (Similar to Dupont Krytox GPL-203". Here is the link:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Perfluoropolyether-PFPE-PTFE-Grease-Oxygen-400-F-Krytox-/280637585839?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item41574db9af
I used this recently on a TX2 and it is perfect and very slick. I also used it on my BeoGram CD5500 on both the cylindrical slide rails and the tray pin (plastic to metal) contact point. Again, it worked great and smoothed the tray action beautifully. I apply it with a small brush.
Good luck and I hope this helps.
Michael - USA
Thank You all for your replies. Now I have something to choose from...
Steffen
I'm using standard acid-free sewing machine oil for my spindles
Vinyl records, cassettes, open reel, valve amplifiers and film photography.
For the rails, I use silicone grease, not unlike the product Søren Mexico links to (only mine is clear rather than white).For the threaded shafts (Beogram 400x/6006/800x) I have started using a product sold on Ebay.comas "liquid bearing". It's a 100% synthetic lubricant, mainly teflon, no oil or grease and no solvents.It neither evaporates nor dries, it doesn't attack plastics, has a nice low friction and it doesn't tend to holdon to quite as much dust and dirt as the conventional products.It lubricates both metal and plastic parts as well as any combination.I have used acid-free oil previously with great results. I used a type meant for aviation instruments.Sewing machine oil may work too, the important thing is to get a product that doesn't evaporate as quickly assome of the cheap "everyman", household products tend to do.
Martin
Very old thread, but since a few years has passed I thought to ask again about preferred lube for the beogram parts; do you guys in general make use of silicon great/spray, teflon spray, etc.?
Also, if we look at a wider aspect to re-grease other parts in a beosystem (thinking the cassette deck) would silicon grease be the preferred to be used?
I would also be interested in an update on this.
Note that @Dillen mentioned "liquid bearing" - if this is the same as being sold on eBay currently, it is claimed that this is not what it says it is, but simply motor oil re-packaged (see http://www.slotcartalk.com/slotcartalk/showthread.php?27028-Liquid-Bearings for the whole sorry story)
Adding then as well a bit more to the question, would standard silicon grease sold be Biltema work out?
White lithium grease for the rails.That's what I have been using for the last many years.It's good for slow moving parts, metal against plastics.
Silicone grease comes in all "shapes and sizes".Some harden over a period of time - from days to decades - others turn liquid and starts running away.
I am not familiar with the stuff from Biltema. Perhaps it'll be fine. You can test it and see if it still works fine ten years from now.
Michael Sean:Unfortunately, I was unable to source any Barrierta L55/2 in affordable quantities if at all. However, in comparing all of the many specifications for the Barrierta L55 series greases, I found an almost identical product in Dupont's Krytox GPL series greases - most importantly, the plastic friendly aspect and a PFPE PTFE lightweight synthetic grease. A thorough specifications comparison of the many available variations brought me to the Dupont Krytox GPL 203 or GPL 204.
Michael, so guess that this PFPE - PTFE Teflon Fluor Grease should similar do the Krytox GPL grease also; any insight on this product?
Nasty stuff! Don't get it on your fingers.
Martin what products do you currently use then in terms of brands?
The one I have been using for the rails for the last couple of years is the TF2 from Weldtite.It's a (mostly) green 40oz tube.Fairly cheap, but I'm sure other brands will work just as fine.A good cleaning off of the old grease is just as important.
Hi All,
I need to refurb the tonearm lower8ng mechanism on my 4002...there’s an excellent video from Beolover on youtube detailing how to go about this. I wanted to check the right grease to use for the solenoid, piston and the pivot point on the lower arm. Martin, would ordinary lithium white grease be ok, like they use in RC model cars, or do I need to find a PTFE grease? Also, what are your thoughts on using sewing machine oil for the lower arm pivot instead of grease?
And then while I have it open, I’ll use some sewing machine oil in the top bearing of the dc motor (can’t hurt I figure...I think the bottom bearing is inaccessible so will leave that alone) and then some sewing machine oil in the platter bearing as well. Or should I use white lithium grease in platter bearing as well?
Please let me know if you think I’m making any mistakes?
Thanks in advance for the help!
Ryan
For the pivot points I use the same sinter oil (spindle oil) that I use for infusing bronze bearings.
It evaporates slowly.
Sewing machine oil works fine too, but most evaporate fast, days rather than months or years.
DC motors - bearings are sinter bronze and must be infused (vacuum) with the right spindle oil.
No sewing machine oil here - and don't just add a drop - it must be infused into the bearing metal material.
Refer to how Beolover does it.
The platter bearing is also sinter bronze, but there the oil cannot escape as easily, so adding a drop of spindle oil will do here.
No grease for the solenoid!
Preferably nothing at all.
Just clean.
If it binds and you MUST do something, you can add a small amount of spindle oil - only a very thin film (distribute a drop by wiping a finger around inside the cylinder).
The white lithium grease is only for the carriage rails. - And mainly for both of the newer tangential series decks, where metal and plastics work together.
Where bronze works with metal use spindle oil (as in the bearings)
In decks where the carriage is close to vibrating when moving, you can use a little white lithium grease or silicone grease to dampen it, but
in these cases the ideal repair would usually be to replace the carriage bushings.
@Dillen, you wrote:
"In decks where the carriage is close to vibrating when moving, you can use a little white lithium grease or silicone grease to dampen it, but
in these cases the ideal repair would usually be to replace the carriage bushings."
This is exactly what happens with my Beogram 4500. It vibrates and creates a noise every time it returns to the starting position. I have tried to clean the rods and applied some white grease but it does not completely remedy the problem unfortunately.
Can you describe what these "carriage bushings" are and how to replace them? Is it the entire white plastic part that holds the arm assembly as it moves along the rods you mean? Has this part become worn where it rests on the two metal rods?
Your deck has no carriage bushings. It was BG4002 etc.
Is the small hook at the carriage "foot" for the string and spring about to break off?Has the position of the main circuitboard been adjusted correctly?
The small hook is fine. No loose parts.
Regarding position, do you mean the "Positioning of PCB 1" in the service manual? What do these related switches actually do?
When I slide the arm along the rail, it does not feel perfectly smooth but it is difficult to tell if it is the plastic gears and wires that creates a slightly uneven resistance when it moves sideways.
Maybe I need to clean everything more thoroughly and see if it makes any difference. Not sure that I dare to actually remove the carriage though but that would make it easier to clean and see if anything is stuck somewhere.
Anyway, thanks for your suggestions!