ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hi,
My Beogram 2000 type 5240 is missing the small wire spring which is located at the end of the start relay. The spring hooks into the armature as well as the relay housing. I'm not quite sure of the purpose of this spring.
The joint service manual for the Beogram 1203 & 2000 shows the spring on page 5-6, with a label number of 87 and part number of 2819073. It appears both the 1203 and 2000 decks use the same spring.
Does anyone have this spring that they no longer need - perhaps from a dead relay?
Many thanks, Carl
It is just a thought, and only in anticipation of not being able to find the spring I need - would it be possible to make my own spring, has anyone done this?
I'm sure I could obtain some thin 'sprung' wire. But what I don't have is an original spring to use as a template.
I have a photo of this spring in situ courtesy of Martin, but does anyone have a photo of this spring on its own, i.e. NOT in situ, so that I may observe it in its entirety and attempt to copy its various kinks and bends as accurately as possible?
Obviously I'd prefer to find an original, particularly because I appreciate this is a precision made component that has the correct compression rate, but making my own is 'possibly' my only chance of being able to complete the renovation of my Beogram.
Is this a silly idea? Any thoughts?
Thank you, Carl
The spring simply provides the return bias to one of the red lever's.The lever is forced by the action of the cam lifting wheel to keep the contacts closed once the relay has initiated the operating cycle.The spring then ensures that the contacts open at the end of the play cycle,switching off the motor.
They are as rare as hens teeth,these day's,but I imagine that you could fabricate something to achieve the desired action.
I'll look through my own stock of treasure as I may have a salvaged relay that still has it's spring in place,but it's along shot!
Nick
Hi Nick,
Thank you for that explanation on purpose. I can now fully understand why my turntable, without this spring, is behaving so erratically. Thankfully Martin (Dillen) diagnosed this spring was missing else I would never have known of its existence. Goodness knows when and where this spring was lost, but I'm reasonably certain is wasn't in situ when I started my renovation a few weeks ago. An extremely thorough search without success adds to my feeling that it was probably lost long ago, maybe during a house move etc? (just guessing). I keep looking every day though - it's become an obsession to try and find it.
I agree that it could probably be fabricated and maybe that will be my only option. Hoping a stand alone photo to use as a guide may turn up, unlikely though.
My relay levers are black as opposed to red. I only mention this because the colour may signal a spec change, which in turn may mean there could be minor differences in designs of relay housing and spring - I very much doubt it though.
Thank you for looking through your treasure for me - it is much appreciated.
Rgds, Carl
And Alexs photo in the thread I linked to in your other thread isn't good enough?
https://archivedforum2.beoworld.org/forums/t/18165.aspx
(Click the photo).
Martin
Hello Martin,
Yes the link you provided was extremely helpful and I replied thanking you. I missed the link pointing to Alex's photos that you provided first time around. Not sure if the link was late arriving in the message but for some reason I missed it. You pointed me back to it and I did see the photos and the missing spring - which was extremely helpful and I replied accordingly. I apologised to you for missing the link. I wasn't sure however what this spring actually did but thanks to you I knew it was necessary.
Subsequently I posted a request for a photo of the whole spring, i.e. as it would appear when not attached to the relay. I only wanted to see how easy or how difficult making one would be. It felt wrong to keep going directly to yourself, only because I can understand how busy you must be with the help you provide others.
I try to reply as courteously as possible to members who offer me help or insight. However, your expertise and experience is evident throughout this site. I have already benefitted a great deal from your input for which I am and remain extremely grateful.
I 'appear' to annoy you and that certainly is not my intention - I hope I am wrong. I am a newbie to this site and to repairing B&O. I appreciate dealing with newbies like me can be frustrating but I have made great progress over the last few weeks. That is thanks to you and other members of this site.
Always my best intentions. Rgds, Carl
Carl:I 'appear' to annoy you
What?- Not at all!If my answers are short and "to the point" or email answers are delayed for a couple of days, it's because I usually havesome 60-80 B&O-related emails in my inbox to answer every day - outside of my 8-16 job, family, housekeeping etc.When I asked you if Alexs photo wasn't good enough, it was because I would see if I could take a spring from a Beogram and take a better photo if it wasn't.
I already spent more than two hours last night digging through boxes in the dungeons, looking for this spring and about a handful or two of other parts for others.It's not an easy part to find. It's small and easily overlooked, I don't have everything in the same physical location, and far from all boxes are marked with their contents.But I am not known to give up.
Hi Martin,
I'm very relieved to hear you're not annoyed. I'm not usually a sensitive sole but the brevity of your replies made me wonder. I always suspected you had a lot on your plate and with hindsight I can now see you were querying if you could provide better photos. Please accept my sincere apologies for my misunderstanding. I won't misinterpret again so be as short and to the point as you want.
Thank you for the effort you've put in looking for this spring. I know from my own search how hard it must be, particularly when it is so small and there is no certainty of finding one.
Your help in restoring my B&O is very much appreciated (truly).
I have a completely broken Beogram 2000 but still this spring is there 😉
Hello Schletti82,
Thank you for getting in touch, welcome news indeed. Would you consider selling the relay spring to me?
Regards, Carl
Sure, but I think the shipping costs will be higher than the price for the spring.
i life in Munich (Germany) but of course I will send it to you
Thank you. I’m planning to visit Munich next year but we won’t wait till then (smile). Yes shipping costs can be high but I didn't want to be presumptuous on how much you wanted for the spring, plus I’m not sure what the shipping costs would be to the UK. I’ve noticed most people prefer to discuss these matters directly so would you be happy to do that. If yes then my email is cralt@me.com.
Rgds Carl
Hi all, quick update - unfortunately the spring offered above was from a different deck with different internals.
So I will proceed with trying to make a spring.
If in the meantime an original spring is found and offered then great.
Finally!!!!
Hi All,
Well done!
"does it matter what the wattage of the bulb is?"No. But the type of bulb matters. Use a conventional bulb if possible.
Found a conventional bulb (surprised I still had one). Checked platter speed again and was able to adjust to the correct speed via the side wheel.
Neat job Carl!
I'll know where to come the next time one of these springs fly's past my ear and disappears?
You were lucky with the motor too,usually these need some tlc as the bearings dry out causing low t/t speed.
Load's of threads here of course relating to that,if you need to do it at some stage!
Thank you, yes it was fiddly to do but I'm happy with the end result. Sods law says I will now find the original spring, but it hasn't shown itself yet.
I have plenty of surplus sprung wire which I will keep in case someone here needs any.
I did do the motor bearings for the reasons you give. I was a complete newbie and it was my first job. I was fortunate in receiving lots of help from Martin (Dillen) and others. In fact I took the motor apart twice and feel I could now do it in my sleep lol.
I also added a new belt and LIFT button assembly courtesy of Martin (my belt had stretched and my assembly had broken).
It's been an interesting and enjoyable project, especially being able to overcome problems which at first seemed beyond my capabilities.
It's also been a very time consuming project (learning as you go always is), and quite costly in terms of materials/items needed, but I'm never one to give up - plus the Beogram deserved it! It really is in wonderful condition, cosmetically and now, mechanically.
Thanks again for your help Nick, regards, Carl