BV Avant vs. BV 11 (or others)

Flappo:

Just because something is 'old' doesn't mean it's crap , look at the beosystem 8000

I hope you have lots of fun with your 4k tv

Let me know when you find any native 4k sources worth watching

 

Well actually in the case of older B&O TV's older does mean its crap. The Video engine in the older B&O TVs used alot of signal processing and was rather (overly) complicated. This has changed with the new Video engine introduced in the V1, BV11, BV12 and Avant.

So I'm not at all surprised that SD content looked bad on the BV7 or any other older B&O for that matter. I would be surprised however if upscaled SD content on the Avant and BV11 aren't similar in quality. Because as already mentioned the same upscaling algorithm can be used on both 1080 and 2160 as the pixel count just doubles.

I must say I'm really fed up with al these 'short-stayed' TV techniques; look at this discussion here; BV11 is considered 'old' already; the bloody thing is around for just a relatively short time.

How on earth one is willing to pay B&O amounts of money for a TV set that is growing old in a year or so?

In the good old days of CRT TV things weren't moving so fast, and to be honest; watching a good quality nature documentary on a MX for example still delivers a very nice viewing experience to me, with depth, rich colors, natural picture.

And now people say '4K won't be around for a long time'....

jc:

I must say I'm really fed up with al these 'short-stayed' TV techniques; look at this discussion here; BV11 is considered 'old' already; the bloody thing is around for just a relatively short time.

How on earth one is willing to pay B&O amounts of money for a TV set that is growing old in a year or so?

In the good old days of CRT TV things weren't moving so fast, and to be honest; watching a good quality nature documentary on a MX for example still delivers a very nice viewing experience to me, with depth, rich colors, natural picture.

And now people say '4K won't be around for a long time'....

Calm down. The BV11 is already a mark 2, things go quick. I meant that BV11 is old as in that it most probably will get a 4K screen in the next upgrade. 
I don't know how many sets B&O made in the CRT-era but I think there where quite a few then too. Even if technology was not what it is today. 

Just enjoy whatever you enjoy and lets not predict the future too much . 

MikaelHansen:

Well actually in the case of older B&O TV's older does mean its crap. The Video engine in the older B&O TVs used alot of signal processing and was rather (overly) complicated. This has changed with the new Video engine introduced in the V1, BV11, BV12 and Avant.

But why is this new powerful Video engine not capable to show 3D with 4K content??

4K wont be replaced for a long time, not because the screen technology is far away, but because the whole eco-system with respects to 8K sources is lacking. Furthermore 8K only makes sense on very large screens, just as 4K does. The 55" is the absolute minimal size for 4K, and some would argue that its pointless for the average viewing distance of a 55" TV.  

We don't even have 1080P broadcasts, and with 4K taking up 4 times the amount of broadband compared to 1080P it will take years before we have any real 4K TV channels. New video codecs will help with compression and the next standard HEVC video codec the bandwidth can be halved.

Physical media such as Bluray is also declining faster than expected, and this hint to the internet as the future method of playback. But a 4K movie in HEVC would require about 50Gb for a single movie. That roughly requires a 70mbit internet connection for 2 hour movie.

The BV11 is by no means an old TV, maybe in 2-3 years when 4K sources starts to become widely available, but not now. It isn't 4K that makes the BV11 look old, it's the new features of the Avant. The BV11 will still be an excellent TV for years to come. Only when OLED is starting to enter the mass consumer market, then will any BV that isn't OLED begin to look old. But with recent news of Samsung pausing their OLED adventure for now, the timeframe for this change in screen technology is pushed yet again. I won't expect to see any mass consumer OLEDs within the next 3-4 years.

 

Mikael:

4K wont be replaced for a long time, not because the screen technology is far away, but because the whole eco-system with respects to 8K sources is lacking. Furthermore 8K only makes sense on very large screens, just as 4K does. The 55" is the absolute minimal size for 4K, and some would argue that its pointless for the average viewing distance of a 55" TV.  

We don't even have 1080P broadcasts, and with 4K taking up 4 times the amount of broadband compared to 1080P it will take years before we have any real 4K TV channels. New video codecs will help with compression and the next standard HEVC video codec the bandwidth can be halved.

Physical media such as Bluray is also declining faster than expected, and this hint to the internet as the future method of playback. But a 4K movie in HEVC would require about 50Gb for a single movie. That roughly requires a 70mbit internet connection for 2 hour movie.

The BV11 is by no means an old TV, maybe in 2-3 years when 4K sources starts to become widely available, but not now. It isn't 4K that makes the BV11 look old, it's the new features of the Avant. The BV11 will still be an excellent TV for years to come. Only when OLED is starting to enter the mass consumer market, then will any BV that isn't OLED begin to look old. But with recent news of Samsung pausing their OLED adventure for now, the timeframe for this change in screen technology is pushed yet again. I won't expect to see any mass consumer OLEDs within the next 3-4 years.

 

Very good message. And I think Sony paused their OLED development also. 

@ Miikael

so true - I'd agree with you.

Which features do you think of, when you write "....it's the new features of the Avant..."?

MM

I've just come back from our local dealer, as I wanted to sit down on my own watching and listening to familiar material. I also watched the 4K demo B&O supplied, and to be frank if somebody had said it was a good Bluray , I'd of believed them. The so called 4K material on YouTube looked much better, but again I'm afraid to say I've seen better. I'm not convinced this TV has a better picture than the 11, and definitely not better than the 7-55 which I admit is a different beast.

When the TV is turned off, to me it just becomes any other TV in a black plastic frame. With the speaker extended it seems to be more balanced and individual. More familiar I guess.

The sound compared to the 10 is somewhat better, and in parts the 11. More capable bass reproduction, and much clearer vocals.

Compared to the 11-55 it's very good value for money, and offers very clever storage options with the new stand. I'd like to see it on the table stand which for my taste I think would be better, and give the extending speaker a purpose ie to tuck itself away when the stand sits down.

Love the remote! Hope you sell loads anyway

Chris Townsend:

I

The sound compared to the 10 is somewhat better, and in parts the 11. More capable bass reproduction, and much clearer vocals.

I thought the sound was very '7.4' and sounded very centre-speaker to me. No way near as good as my BV11/BL11 combination, which has a much wider sound. I couldn't listen to the Avant alone.

I agree the design is very formal looking, but it has a certain appeal. The BV7-55 looks huge, heavy and getting a bit dated now, whereas this Avant looks light. Would be ideal as a wall-mounted TV, I think, like the BV12.

I also still believe a lot of recent B&O TV purchasers go to their dealer with a slight negative air, aiming to prove the new TV isn't much better than their existing TV and, due to that air, come out thinking sightly more negatively anyhow. That's just human nature :)

Millemissen:

@ Miikael

so true - I'd agree with you.

Which features do you think of, when you write "....it's the new features of the Avant..."?

MM

Mainly the new BeoRemote One (the three custom buttons), but also the upgraded motorized stand and better factory calibration of the screen. The ability to record on an external HDD is also much appreciated as it comes as standard. 

I properly prefer the design of BV11 but miss the B&O moving magic of the Avant.

Steffen:

Sal:

We'd like to get the most bang for our buck, but with more information coming out about the Avant's price points, it seems like the Avant + stand would break our budget for both a television and external speakers. Yet the BV-11 may still fit the bill.

 

If you're talking about the same sizes (55") - then the new Avant with floorstand is still cheaper than a BV 11...

Prices at my local dealer: 55.000 DKKr for the new 55" Avant + 11.000 DKKr for the floorstand = 66.000 DKKr

- while the price sign on the 55" BV 11 said: 79.995 DKKr

That's a very good point, thanks for bringing that up. Currently, our living room has a 50" plasma, which seems just right for the size, it is located on a table stand on top of a medium height cabinet. I should have been more clear about the size of the BV11 I was considering when I asked my comparison questions. I was considering the 46" model + stand. 

Still many variables to consider as this will be a long term purchase. I'll be starting a few more threads as I value all of your opinions and making an educated decision for a long term investment is the best way to go.

Besides, I don't believe the dealers have the TV in yet around here.

Won't a more conventional design allow for more television sales?

Please just let sell more TV's already! 

I don't care if the Avant is more conventional, but if it allows better connectivity and more placement options for "real" people, then let it be said; and let it be so.  Ages ago, B&O were saying how their products will always have a certain magic and the Avant delivers on that, like the 3200 with moving glass, this has moving speakers - who has ever heard of that - awesomeeeee

I love the BV11, and although some don't think that "oh we don't have the sources" - but remember when there wasn't enough 1080p sources, and now their are. But the Avant is a new product for an audience to bring them back / and to B&O. 

For me, although through a bad product experience with B&O has actually bought me back to the brand, and really thinking that my lovely Sony TV will be replaced and with some BL18 speakers (if the boyfriend lets me).  Alot of you talk of the WAF (wife acceptance factor), but be whether your WAF is female / male / yellow or polka dot, convincing the other in your life, that your desire and love for B&O and if you have had a bad experience, that the brand you've been banging on for a long time comes up with a product that makes you want to talk and experience it, can only be a good thing for the continuity for the brand.

But that now makes me think if the Avant will look good on my wall (even with manual wall bracket) or the BV11 can't exactly be a bad thing.

As someone once said to Bill Hislop "You can't stop progress" :-)

If OLED/ 8K is in the future, so what - go with what is right for you. 

Michael:

Won't a more conventional design allow for more television sales?

Please just let sell more TV's already! 

I don't care if the Avant is more conventional, but if it allows better connectivity and more placement options for "real" people, then let it be said; and let it be so.  Ages ago, B&O were saying how their products will always have a certain magic and the Avant delivers on that, like the 3200 with moving glass, this has moving speakers - who has ever heard of that - awesomeeeee

I love the BV11, and although some don't think that "oh we don't have the sources" - but remember when there wasn't enough 1080p sources, and now their are. But the Avant is a new product for an audience to bring them back / and to B&O. 

For me, although through a bad product experience with B&O has actually bought me back to the brand, and really thinking that my lovely Sony TV will be replaced and with some BL18 speakers (if the boyfriend lets me).  Alot of you talk of the WAF (wife acceptance factor), but be whether your WAF is female / male / yellow or polka dot, convincing the other in your life, that your desire and love for B&O and if you have had a bad experience, that the brand you've been banging on for a long time comes up with a product that makes you want to talk and experience it, can only be a good thing for the continuity for the brand.

But that now makes me think if the Avant will look good on my wall (even with manual wall bracket) or the BV11 can't exactly be a bad thing.

As someone once said to Bill Hislop "You can't stop progress" :-)

If OLED/ 8K is in the future, so what - go with what is right for you. 

Great message Michael! I agree completely with you on the Avant. I love it, its magic and its thrilling. It´s not a BV11 that looks good but does nothing to impress further. I don't care too much about the "WAF" but for me it is also "BAF" instead :) but I live alone and decorate as I like .

Regards Michael

 

 

 

Michael:

Great message Michael! I agree completely with you on the Avant. I love it, its magic and its thrilling. It´s not a BV11 that looks good but does nothing to impress further. I don't care too much about the "WAF" but for me it is also "BAF" instead :) but I live alone and decorate as I like .

Regards Michael

And it also may go with a certain Lumitron that you received :-) 

Bring on the future B&O products. 

Michael:

And it also may go with a certain Lumitron that you received :-) 

Bring on the future B&O products. 

YES! Thanks :) I use it every day! It´s in my bedroom and I control it with my V1 remote :). I don't think the Avant will get a place there however :D.