ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Dillen: Well, in short, Beoworld is no longer what it once was and the world of B&O has changed too.That's how I see and feel it.For me, the main reasons for the drastic changes are posting problems, the dreadful new look and navigationof the forum (the worst I've ever seen on the net), lack of new content, new products heading off in adifferent direction, general forum section flooded daily with Apple discussions, less interestin vintage B&O items and I'm getting old and grumpy.I'm sure, that others feel the same. Well, more or less, and maybe not as much the latter. When some high posters turn away, the discussion base and general feeling disappears and other "key members" follow.New members quietly, and sometimes inadvertently, fill in the empty seats and, eventually, will become thenew hard core to take the forum off in a new direction.The old hard core members, may they be highly respected and/or awarded, will go into oblivion (if it wasn't for a thread like this). I can sit with tons of experience into vintage B&O, it's of no value here since right now Beoworld needsan Apple or whatever brand specialist to comment on threads and to tell you why your digital piece of Apple won't synchronizewith your digital other brand vacuum cleaner and your wireless thingamabob connected to your Beowhatever sw version 4.07 option 3.What happened last year is history.Needless to say, the hard core guy to answer this mustn't be a guy with more than a yearsexperience, obviously that would be ridiculously outdated info. No, it must be someone who just happened tohave solved the given issue on the same day and who can set the time off to pop in and guide othersbefore next week when it would be too late anyways. I miss the good old days but there's a time and a place for everything. Martin
Well, in short, Beoworld is no longer what it once was and the world of B&O has changed too.That's how I see and feel it.For me, the main reasons for the drastic changes are posting problems, the dreadful new look and navigationof the forum (the worst I've ever seen on the net), lack of new content, new products heading off in adifferent direction, general forum section flooded daily with Apple discussions, less interestin vintage B&O items and I'm getting old and grumpy.I'm sure, that others feel the same. Well, more or less, and maybe not as much the latter.
When some high posters turn away, the discussion base and general feeling disappears and other "key members" follow.New members quietly, and sometimes inadvertently, fill in the empty seats and, eventually, will become thenew hard core to take the forum off in a new direction.The old hard core members, may they be highly respected and/or awarded, will go into oblivion (if it wasn't for a thread like this).
I can sit with tons of experience into vintage B&O, it's of no value here since right now Beoworld needsan Apple or whatever brand specialist to comment on threads and to tell you why your digital piece of Apple won't synchronizewith your digital other brand vacuum cleaner and your wireless thingamabob connected to your Beowhatever sw version 4.07 option 3.What happened last year is history.Needless to say, the hard core guy to answer this mustn't be a guy with more than a yearsexperience, obviously that would be ridiculously outdated info. No, it must be someone who just happened tohave solved the given issue on the same day and who can set the time off to pop in and guide othersbefore next week when it would be too late anyways.
I miss the good old days but there's a time and a place for everything.
Martin
It seems like I've been drawn back into the fold, but I agree with many of your reasons, Dillen. The new forum layout is not as inviting as older versions. Revealing only a small number of posts seems like an odd way to go about things.
I also don't think it's possible to avoid discussions about Apple. It would be like discussing the BeoSound 9000 and never mentioning CDs. Apple is the fundamental force governing media distribution and consumption. That probably won't last forever, but we saw what happened when B&O abstained from participation and made their own MP3 players and music management software.
Tue's read on our role in the market has been pretty spot on. People still want great speakers, great video screens, and great integration and to the extent that we can cooperate with Apple and make those values integrate we will succeed.
Whether its using an iPad for control, to stream music to a BeoPlay product or a PlayMaker, or watching a movie on an AppleTV on your BeoVision that you control with your B&O remote, the Apple experience usually enhances and is enhanced by the B&O equipment.
I've personally been flirting in the windows world and while there are a lot of things I like about current MS offerings, they're still generally installed on clunky machinery and measured in how easy it is to figure something out rather than how easy it is to use.
Hopefully I can continue to contribute to the discussions and renew a little of that old trip feeling. (-;
Puncher: Dillen:..............general forum section flooded daily with Apple discussions,..................... Several of my most recent posts have been about the level af Appleness on the general forum - at least if it's in a thread of an apple related product (A8, Beolit12) I can avoid it but there is an incessant wave of comparing every single thing to some Apple product or other (or in a more recent case the packaging)!!!, it has become very wearing or even, as in my case, deeply irritting. I'm not sure if it's even possible to prevent it, but as you say, one of the effects is to chase at least some of the long term members away from the general forum or even from the site itself!
Dillen:..............general forum section flooded daily with Apple discussions,.....................
Several of my most recent posts have been about the level af Appleness on the general forum - at least if it's in a thread of an apple related product (A8, Beolit12) I can avoid it but there is an incessant wave of comparing every single thing to some Apple product or other (or in a more recent case the packaging)!!!, it has become very wearing or even, as in my case, deeply irritting.
I'm not sure if it's even possible to prevent it, but as you say, one of the effects is to chase at least some of the long term members away from the general forum or even from the site itself!
Packaging...........
Strangely enough both B&O and Apple have very characteristic and recognisable packaging that buyers tend to hold onto.
Much of Apple's appeal apart from ease of use etc (and ignoring lack of Flash on iPads etc) is the look and feel of the product, particularly for handheld devices. Steve Jobs did own B&O music centres so maybe some B&O design rubbed off on Apple.
Apple stole from B&O (wheel) Xerox (mouse & icons & windows) Microsoft stole latter from Apple, Microsoft saved Apple (and avoided a monopoly situation)...... . In the end I like niche products and Apple, once niche, are moving back into the mainstream. If B&O were to have their success then I suspect there would be as many disheartened contributors here as there might be happy members.
Now, back to the subject of this thread. How long is it since we heard from an Apple Exec on this site.......
Graham
moxxey: Until that situation changes, moaning about "Apple discussion" is fruitless.
Until that situation changes, moaning about "Apple discussion" is fruitless.
Best. Pun. EVAR.
Rich: moxxey: Until that situation changes, moaning about "Apple discussion" is fruitless. Best. Pun. EVAR.
+1
Vähintään yhdeksänkymmentä prosenttia suomalainen!
You'll probably find most of them have given up on bno and bought elsewhere.
Simple as that.
Beolab 28s Beolab 9s Beolab 12-3s Beolab 1s Beolab 6000s 2 pairs Beolab 4000s Beovision 7-55 Beovision 10-40 Beoplay V1 32 inch Beovision Avant 32 inch Beosound 1 (CD player) Beosound 3000 Beosound 5 Core Essence MKII Beoplay M5
I'm not making this up, but due to the new forum structure, I've "successfully" posted English comments in a German Beoworld discussion, twice :)
Problem is, the non-English threads also appear at the top of the forum homepage and, with Google translate running in Chrome, you don't see the German. It does such a good job at instant translation, you see English. I think it's an English question, so I post an answer.
Razlaw:I agree with some of the sentiments expressed here. In particular the forum. I do not like it as well as the old one, less user friendly and as a result I spend less time here and post much less. I much preferred the old format.
Me too, the old forum I browsed several times a day. This I'm only visit maybe once a month. I thinks it's had to get a overview and to follow the discussions.
Actually I started a thread like this on the old forum when it started. I missed several members from the previous forum, like the Swede "Sudden" who went out to buy a normal car but came home with a Murcielago and had a BL 3500 in the garage.
Well I guess it's the faith of Internet forum, old members fade away, and new members participate. Actually, if a member suddenly die we often never get the sad news.
I see Mr10Percent has returned in the last 24 hours or so
BeoNut since '75
The comments here, as well as my own, about diminished use of the forum caused me to get curious and look at a couple threads old verses new.
In the new forum, there are a total of 11 threads in the BeoMac section and 12 in the Beosound 5 section. Comparing the old forum for the same amount of time, there are around 36-37 threads in each section, or more than three times as many.
I am sure many people have moved on for reasons unrelated to the forum, but enough to cause a 2/3 reduction in threads? For me, just navigating to the Beosound 5 forum was so frustrating, I do not bother looking at it.
In the old forum, if I remember correctly, it was three steps to get to the Beosound 5 forum, 1. open forum, 2 scroll down to Beosound 5 forum, 3. click on forum.
In the new forum it is 1. open forums 2.scroll down to listing of forum sections, 3. click on products related forums (as Beosound 5 forum does not appear initially) 4. Scroll down past recent posts to browse discussions 5. Click on Beosound 5 forum.
While it may only be two more steps to get to the forum, if one wants to look at multiple forums those extra steps become very tiring and it is the main reason I do not read or post as much here. I check out the general forum occasionally but that is about it. I miss the old forum.
Have to agree with Dillen on this one. Based on the feedback I have received from some of the old timers, the GUI will have to be improved and perhaps then the old "warm and friendly" atmosphere will return, too?
Roger
Dillen! My sentiments too, only you put it so eloquently (as usual)
Dillen:Beoworld is no longer what it once was
Dillen:dreadful new look and navigationof the forum (the worst I've ever seen on the net),
Dillen:Beoworld needsan Apple specialist to comment on threads
Dillen: I miss the good old days but there's a time and a place for everything.
Dillen:What happened last year is history.
Hear, hear!
jandyt: Dillen! My sentiments too, only you put it so eloquently (as usual) Dillen:Beoworld is no longer what it once was Dillen:dreadful new look and navigationof the forum (the worst I've ever seen on the net), Dillen:Beoworld needsan Apple specialist to comment on threads Dillen: I miss the good old days but there's a time and a place for everything. Dillen:What happened last year is history. Hear, hear!
Oh No!!........... He's back!!!
Ban boring signatures!
Seems to be developing into a 'Whatever happened to the forum' thread!
My personal view is that there were a lot of enthusiasts really backing the previous forum. With the change to the new forum several enthusiasts seem to have backed-away. This may have always been an intention as a forum needs to reach a critical mass of contributors to keep it going. I think that Beoworld did not quite have enough critical mass to allow it to simultaneously allow previous main contributors to take a back seat, whilst at the same time introducing a new platform with navigation quirks.
It is also a fact that some previous contributors have simply sold their B&O collections.
vikinger: With the change to the new forum several enthusiasts seem to have backed-away.
With the change to the new forum several enthusiasts seem to have backed-away.
I think trying to create a modern discussion forum based around "enthusiasts" will only ever be a short-medium term solution, much like creating a forum and attracting vinyl record collectors. The interest will diminish with few new users to replace them.
But it does show the struggle B&O have to attract new customers. On one hand they are still clinging on to the old-school customers who walk in and buy a B&O TV, with the intention to keep it for a few years. On the other hand, they are trying to reach out to the much younger digital generation who are more care-free and flippant with their spending. Ironically though, it's these guys who are driving down the prices of technology (as they want to pay less and less...). It's a bit of a catch-22 knowing and finding your future market.
My 2p woth from someone who has been away a while.
There were some good people on the old forum, there are (I am sure) some good people on the new one. Change is part of life.
Simon
One month on ...... and it seems that several of those who reappeared in response to this thread have gone again.
[EDIT it has taken several attempts to get this post posted!]
Whatever happened to soundproof ?
vikinger: One month on ...... and it seems that several of those who reappeared in response to this thread have gone again.
I was going to post the same thing! I did wonder if it was one of the mods creating accounts spoofing as the users we all love and miss, to keep us happy :)
moxxey: vikinger: One month on ...... and it seems that several of those who reappeared in response to this thread have gone again. I was going to post the same thing! I did wonder if it was one of the mods creating accounts spoofing as the users we all love and miss, to keep us happy :)
Oh, come on, Martin would never do something like that.
Mika, on the other hand......
Rich: Oh, come on, Martin would never do something like that. Mika, on the other hand......
Oh no, not me. I don't care that much whether you are happy
But soundproof for example has been posting this summer. And even Trip, but I haven't heard from my chicken farmer friend since last year.
--mika
I suppose lives is changing and so are peoples demands and needs, perhaps trying to accommodating to suit would do good job....
How about starting Apple section of the forum?
I agree with Martin in many things (probably because I'm "hardcore" old and grumpy (no offence Martin, I'm just few years younger but much grumpier)) , and have to admit that new B&O and Vintage are 1000's miles away (these days everything is more software issues anyway) and to extend I'm uncertain if I pad, I phone and Hi-Fi should even be used in same sentence ...
I personally lack in new B&O product line something to impress me. I'm very happy that there was lots and lots of Vintage B&O products, which are quiet reasonably obtainable and don't even mind to get up and switch on/off etc
Yes I grow up with rotary phones, hand washing machines, and generally product build with pride and to last, no internet, mobile phones (and the need with it; to constantly updating status via sms, mms, tweeter, Fb and all that, about any insignificant life event, nobody really cares about, but its to polite to say so)
People seem be more concerned about getting bargain (but in fairness would know it if it hits them in face) , and generally consume every resource there is, world has changed and it's more about ownership and consumption rather than appreciation and patience, and so on.
Long story short - there be never universal solution or and forum to suit all, it'll be good enough just to appreciate "togetherness" with other B&O enthusiasts even if they haven't got clue about the "hard core" and undoubtedly hard-working moderators and creators of this living place, what doesn't mean it isn't appreciated - I'm sure (at least I can say that for myself ;)
moxxey: vikinger: With the change to the new forum several enthusiasts seem to have backed-away. I think trying to create a modern discussion forum based around "enthusiasts" will only ever be a short-medium term solution, much like creating a forum and attracting vinyl record collectors. The interest will diminish with few new users to replace them. But it does show the struggle B&O have to attract new customers. On one hand they are still clinging on to the old-school customers who walk in and buy a B&O TV, with the intention to keep it for a few years. On the other hand, they are trying to reach out to the much younger digital generation who are more care-free and flippant with their spending. Ironically though, it's these guys who are driving down the prices of technology (as they want to pay less and less...). It's a bit of a catch-22 knowing and finding your future market.
Don't worry - be Happy
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
I'll have my say here, In the old forum you could almost guarantee a reply and it would be odd if no-one replies to your post. On here a post can just disappear into oblivion without a single reply!
That means either, the posts are getting harder to answer or the experts have vanished? I do feel sad as I could say that i have met some great friends
for some reason the new site has lost some of that magic it once had!!
Cheers Nick
From reading this - I wish I could travel back in time ;)
saying that - many posts are being read and sometime happens that (I'm sure lots is due to format and interface), that there isn't any answer, and its probably down to time and patience span issues these days....
As Nick said it may benefit from easier structure and access
Prices of anything are derived fro thin air and desire to get rich and in fact have no connection with ordinary day-to-day life, just some brands may continue to take pride in delivering or keeping its name in general instead of cutting corners to maximize profit, but anyhow its irrelevant to anything having different perception for every single individual ....
Keep on "trucking"
Nick: I'll have my say here, In the old forum you could almost guarantee a reply and it would be odd if no-one replies to your post. On here a post can just disappear into oblivion without a single reply! That means either, the posts are getting harder to answer or the experts have vanished? I do feel sad as I could say that i have met some great friends for some reason the new site has lost some of that magic it once had!! Cheers Nick
elephant: I see Mr10Percent has returned in the last 24 hours or so
To be honest, just a fleeting visit - like now.
I can only amplify what many others have said - too much Apple, too much of a clique etc... This has been going on for a long time where the forum no longer offers me in particular the enjoyment it once did in terms of friendship, banter, exchange of views or knowledge. I am not too keen on the new forum layout either.
I have subsequently moved over to another forum where my interests are more in-line than that of Beoworld. I still have my B&O equipment and I am very satisfied in my own way that an Apple product or the lastest tech gizmo or standard wont actually enrich my life at all and that there is no need for a regular placebo to overcome any Tech Attention Deficit Syndrome that infects so many people these days.
I wish you all well and hope you continue to enjoy your forum.
Regards
Not claiming to be expert on anything and already stated that despite being quiet geeky, I also find the navigation and layout quiet confusing, but shall the forum not evolve it would die - people as in every aspect in life will come, form relations and eventually move on as their needs changed meanwhile as well. B&O did changed as everything around us.
I personally believe that the forum should reflect on those changes and create adequate categories or re due the structure to give home to Apple and gizmos the space (they apparently need and deserve), but as everything else - one have chance to switch it off and "work with what is closets to his/hers heart). And I'm yet to find better B&O forum (hint hint) ;)
regards Mr 10Percent
Mr 10Percent: elephant: I see Mr10Percent has returned in the last 24 hours or so To be honest, just a fleeting visit - like now. I can only amplify what many others have said - too much Apple, too much of a clique etc... This has been going on for a long time where the forum no longer offers me in particular the enjoyment it once did in terms of friendship, banter, exchange of views or knowledge. I am not too keen on the new forum layout either. I have subsequently moved over to another forum where my interests are more in-line than that of Beoworld. I still have my B&O equipment and I am very satisfied in my own way that an Apple product or the lastest tech gizmo or standard wont actually enrich my life at all and that there is no need for a regular placebo to overcome any Tech Attention Deficit Syndrome that infects so many people these days. I wish you all well and hope you continue to enjoy your forum. Regards
nickyg63:I'll have my say here, In the old forum you could almost guarantee a reply and it would be odd if no-one replies to your post. On here a post can just disappear into oblivion without a single reply! That means either, the posts are getting harder to answer or the experts have vanished? I do feel sad as I could say that i have met some great friends for some reason the new site has lost some of that magic it once had!! Cheers Nick
Razlaw: nickyg63: I'll have my say here, In the old forum you could almost guarantee a reply and it would be odd if no-one replies to your post. On here a post can just disappear into oblivion without a single reply! That means either, the posts are getting harder to answer or the experts have vanished? I do feel sad as I could say that i have met some great friends for some reason the new site has lost some of that magic it once had!! Cheers Nick I agree. My use of the forum has dropped in part due to the lack of responses and the new format. It was much easier with the old format to due a quick scan of multiple topics and see threads that might be of interest.
nickyg63: I'll have my say here, In the old forum you could almost guarantee a reply and it would be odd if no-one replies to your post. On here a post can just disappear into oblivion without a single reply! That means either, the posts are getting harder to answer or the experts have vanished? I do feel sad as I could say that i have met some great friends for some reason the new site has lost some of that magic it once had!! Cheers Nick
I agree.
My use of the forum has dropped in part due to the lack of responses and the new format.
It was much easier with the old format to due a quick scan of multiple topics and see threads that might be of interest.
I TOTALLY agree. See HERE
Dimitris-
Hello :)
I also agree with Martin.I was absent for a while as well.
Above all other things Martin mentioned earlier, my lack of interest came after decision of BW authorities to put @WED thread on "the back door".Firs of all wed thread become great place to hang out with people, excuse not to go to the Pub, drinking with chaps in front of the screen, beginning of nice friendship, tease Pounch , making phothoshop photos with Andy .... and above all meet with new people.In the past new people was coming in to the @Wed, because we were on the general forum and others was able to see posts, and come there out of curiosity. Some of the people stayed with us others not, but we were transparent, open. I end up with @wed like that. IMHO those days forum was more vibrant.Now we are in small room that you can enter only from a small back door around the building, and no one new is coming.
Sorry but this is sad ...
Best,
NIKO
nmartin771: Hello :) I also agree with Martin.I was absent for a while as well. Above all other things Martin mentioned earlier, my lack of interest came after decision of BW authorities to put @WED thread on "the back door".Firs of all wed thread become great place to hang out with people, excuse not to go to the Pub, drinking with chaps in front of the screen, beginning of nice friendship, tease Pounch , making phothoshop photos with Andy .... and above all meat with new people.In the past new people was coming in to the @Wed, because we were on the general forum and others was able to see posts, and come there out of curiosity. Some of the people stayed with us others not, but we were transparent, open. I end up with @wed like that. IMHO those days forum was more vibrant.Now we are in small room that you can enter only from a small back door around the building, and no one new is coming. Sorry but this is sad ... Best, NIKO
Above all other things Martin mentioned earlier, my lack of interest came after decision of BW authorities to put @WED thread on "the back door".Firs of all wed thread become great place to hang out with people, excuse not to go to the Pub, drinking with chaps in front of the screen, beginning of nice friendship, tease Pounch , making phothoshop photos with Andy .... and above all meat with new people.In the past new people was coming in to the @Wed, because we were on the general forum and others was able to see posts, and come there out of curiosity. Some of the people stayed with us others not, but we were transparent, open. I end up with @wed like that. IMHO those days forum was more vibrant.Now we are in small room that you can enter only from a small back door around the building, and no one new is coming.
I agree Niko, I used to drop into the WED thread when I could and I relied on the post pointing to that week's thread to trigger my memory and my interest -- sometimes the announced topic was enough to delay me going to work that morning -- naughty naughty !!
So yes, I would like to see the return of the WED thread to the main forum, or the weekly reminder and announcement of the topic du jour
elephant: I agree Niko, I used to drop into the WED thread when I could and I relied on the post pointing to that week's thread to trigger my memory and my interest -- sometimes the announced topic was enough to delay me going to work that morning -- naughty naughty !! So yes, I would like to see the return of the WED thread to the main forum, or the weekly reminder and announcement of the topic du jour
To be fair, the missing weekly link is my fault, partly because there is a permanent link to the Wed© forum down the right handle panel of the general forum and secondly, the number of new contributers seemed to have fallen to zero - I didn't realise there were "sleeping" readers!
I shall add the weekly reminder to the main forum from this week - you will be warmly welcomed on your return!
I don't have a problem with the supposed pro-Apple bias nowadays , in fact it's probably the most positive thing that's happened to this forum and indeed bang&olufsen in years.
Puncher:partly because there is a permanent link to the Wed© forum down the right handle panel of the general forum
I think it is not enough.
Let me put it this way. Imagine to enter in to the large very pleasant Pub full of people, and on one corner cheerful group of nice chaps having nice time, chating, laughing, without disturbing others. Maybe you will come close, listen a bit what they are talking about and see whether you want to join or not, and if yo see someone that you know you will feel better and more relaxed...
Now imagine table with pointing arrow at the entrance in the Pub saying "cheerful group of nice chaps having great time! Go out, around the corner you will see black door go trough that door and you will see them" What are the chances to go there ?
cheers
Can't disagree with the Wednesday thread thoughts. I think it was originally separated when we had space issues and we were having to delete the thread simply to try to prevent the server from crashing. This was clearly not a sensible state of affairs and it also allowed us to use the Wednesday crowd as a test bed for the new system.
I think that the wednesday thread has now completely disappeared from my consciousness - I suppose I guessed it was still on but thought no more about it. What do you think we should do about it? Is a link each Wednesday enough? I am aware it is not really about B&O so where should it be? I suppose as an outsider to this group, I would comment that is a bit like a secret society in that there are in jokes and rules that a newcomer would be unaware of. I do understand that this is all part of the group though but maybe you need a glossary of terms and guidelines for the unitiated to read!
On the Apple threads, I do feel that at times I might be on MacRumours!! We do have a section for Mac users but it is tricky as B&O are providing increasing amounts of products dedicated to Apple devices. I have no idea what the answer to this is!!
Peter
Peter: I suppose as an outsider to this group, I would comment that is a bit like a secret society in that there are in jokes and rules that a newcomer would be unaware of. I do understand that this is all part of the group though but maybe you need a glossary of terms and guidelines for the unitiated to read!
I suppose as an outsider to this group, I would comment that is a bit like a secret society in that there are in jokes and rules that a newcomer would be unaware of. I do understand that this is all part of the group though but maybe you need a glossary of terms and guidelines for the unitiated to read!
Well, I'm an "insider" of the WedThread, and probably the resident n00b (if you can still be a n00b after more than a year).
We're harmless. Come join the fun!
Possibly the fact that you are the n00b after a year makes my point more relevant. Strange surrounding or customs always make newcomers nervous - one of the reasons I think the B1 stores by B&O are an odd idea - far rather the store in store concept where a stranger can observe easily at first before committing.
Peter: Possibly the fact that you are the n00b after a year makes my point more relevant. Strange surrounding or customs always make newcomers nervous - one of the reasons I think the B1 stores by B&O are an odd idea - far rather the store in store concept where a stranger can observe easily at first before committing.
Re-integrating the Wedthred with the main forum would be a good idea. Niko's criticisms are quite valid. This would also expose the fact that posters like "Jandyt" are still around
On the original 'Whatever happened to' question, has any thought been given to sending a reminder to all old contributors that they would be welcome back on the relaunched forum, with a quick guide or link to resurrecting old Avatars, post counts etc?
HNE!!!
[][][][]
I agree with you and went so far as trying that in the old forum using the "Groups." It never took off...
Also...
Never thought that the limited access to the WedThred© was a problem.
That said, some of my comrades are the ones suggesting it might help.
All I can say is that the room is open, friendly and always excited to see new posters!