ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hi...
Just stumbled onto Bang & Olufsen Create.
Nothing special on their website: http://create.bang-olufsen.com
But the Instagram account show some interesting concepts! https://www.instagram.com/beocreate/
Karel.
"You think we can slap some oak on this thing?"
This probably also has something to do with the coming 'Innovation Lab' in the old Fabrik 4, where the product assembly formerly was located.
http://www.tvmidtvest.dk/artikel/bo-investerer-i-nyt-stort-innovationscenter
On the pictures on the linked instagram page, you can spot Lyle Clarke, the mastermind behind the BS Moment concept.
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Millemissen: This probably also has something to do with the coming 'Innovation Lab' in the old Fabrik 4, where the product assembly formerly was located. http://www.tvmidtvest.dk/artikel/bo-investerer-i-nyt-stort-innovationscenter On the pictures on the linked instagram page, you can spot Lyle Clarke, the mastermind behind the BS Moment concept. MM
That's very good news!
Jean
leosgonewild:Aalto university has had some design concept thing inspired by B&O. Check out Beohelsinki on instagram for more pictures. https://www.instagram.com/beohelsinki/
Check out Beohelsinki on instagram for more pictures.
https://www.instagram.com/beohelsinki/
We worked on these for quite some time this year and most of them are functional. They've been on display at Galleria Esplanad shopping centre for some weeks now – if anyone's in Helsinki this week, go check them out! Next week they're moving to Espoo :)
— Tuomas | Bang & Olufsen | Bang & Olufsen Create
Hi Tuomas, nice work! ...just out of curiosity, are they being displayed somewhere in Espoo?
Aegnor: Hi Tuomas, nice work! ...just out of curiosity, are they being displayed somewhere in Espoo?
Thanks! Yes, they will be in Beta Space, at Aalto University main building (the exhibition will probably appear on the website once it begins next Tuesday) until 11. December.
Meanwhile, you can find all of the projects with short descriptions here
Nice, that'll give me an excuse to visit the ol' Helsinki University of Technology again (I'll never get used to the new name... )
--mika
kuyttendaele: Just stumbled onto Bang & Olufsen Create. Nothing special on their website: http://create.bang-olufsen.com But the Instagram account show some interesting concepts! https://www.instagram.com/beocreate/
Keep an eye out at http://www.beocreate.com going live with a full web site within the next 2 weeks. Currently, the beocreate.com domain just forwards to the create sub-domain listed above by Karel.
You are going to hear a lot more from this B&O team in the next few months...
Regards Keith....
Just couldn't resist...
Keith Saunders: You are going to hear a lot more from this B&O team in the next few months... Regards Keith....
BeoNut since '75
elephant:I wonder if this complementary ... or a separate initiative ?
Pretty sure it's not directly related.
The new website is now live!
tph:The new website is now live!
Hi, just want to bump, as interesting things are happening.
https://www.hifiberry.com/beocreate
http://www.beocreate.com/
https://www.instagram.com/hifiberry/h
https//www.instagram.com/beocreate/
As I personally use one CX100 as center in a 3.1 setup I have a spare CX100 that could fit for this project, so waiting for the 4-channel amp with DSP to release :)
/Goran
Eclipse 65V1-32Beosound M5Essence MK2BLI
Perhaps I can tell you more about this – I'm one of the team members at B&O Create.
What the BeoCreate 4-Channel Amplifier allows you to do is to convert your classic Bang & Olufsen passive speakers into fully active systems. This means we don't just connect a passive speaker with its passive crossover to an amplifier, but instead the idea is to bypass the original crossover entirely and power each driver (a woofer and a tweeter in case of a CX50, for example) separately, like in BeoLabs of today. Crossover is handled by an onboard Analog Devices DSP that's fully user-programmable, wirelessly. DSP also allows us to tune the speakers for a better-than-original sound performance. For example, the CX50 was measured in the Cube in Struer and filters were designed for it by our acoustical magicians. I can tell you it sounds unlike any CX50 you've ever heard.
The board is designed to work with a Raspberry Pi (or similar) single-board computer. This is our streaming engine, enabling Wi-Fi and Bluetooth connectivity. The amplifier board also has Toslink in and out, so you can use the Pi for just programming if you don't care about streaming features.
Programming is where the Bang & Olufsen app comes in. It will talk to the Raspberry Pi that's seated on the amplifier board and allows you to select which of the supported B&O models you have placed the board into. The app will then download the appropriate settings for that particular model and program the DSP with Bang & Olufsen-designed filters. We're working on this.
At release time we will likely just provide preinstalled Bluetooth support, but the great thing about this being Raspberry Pi-based is that you can install and run any software you want – we won't lock it down in any way. We're currently showcasing six upcycled Beovox speakers at TechBBQ (2x CX50, 2x CX100, RL45.2, RL6000) and we have installed AirPlay for the demo. NL support is in the plans – nothing else to announce there yet.
The amplifier board will soon enter limited beta testing. Release is projected before the end of the year.
If you have questions, I'll try to answer them the best I can!
Hi Tuomas,
Thanks for the informative post.
I do differ between powered and active speakers :) but still appreciate that you elaborate on the topic.
It all sounds very cool and even helpfull for us mixing old and new B&O as well as old and new technology.
I do have some questions:
1: would 3 channels be used in the case of CX100 implementation?
2: in which application or user case is the digital out (toslink) being used?
3: for sure a separate question, but would it be possible to get multi channel pcm decoded and amplified by the raspberry and your board?
Thanks in advance
BR
Goran
Try #3
tph:I'm one of the team members at B&O Create
Thank you Tuomas for sharing these information
BeoLignage: Hi Tuomas, Thanks for the informative post. - I do differ between powered and active speakers :) but still appreciate that you elaborate on the topic. - It all sounds very cool and even helpfull for us mixing old and new B&O as well as old and new technology. - I have some more questions as well: 1: would 3 channels be used in the case of CX100 implementation? 2: in which application or user case is the digital out (toslink) being used? 3: for sure a separate question, but would it be possible to get multi channel pcm decoded and amplified by the raspberry and your board? - Thanks in advance BR Goran
Thanks! 😊 To answer some of your questions:
1: Yes, for CX100 you use three channels. The woofers plug to the 60W channels and the tweeter to a 30W channel.
2: Most obvious case for digital out is to daisy-chain multiple boards together if you need more amplifier channels – a lot like how amplifiers connect together in BeoSound Shape. This is not really defined that clearly by us at the moment. Toslink is connected directly to the DSP, so it can be repurposed to route audio as needed.
3: I'll have to ask about this, off the top of my head I can't say.
This sounds like a great initiative! Will 3 way speakers like the S45/S45.2 be accommodated?
Graham
tph: Perhaps I can tell you more about this – I'm one of the team members at B&O Create. What the BeoCreate 4-Channel Amplifier allows you to do is to convert your classic Bang & Olufsen passive speakers into fully active systems. This means we don't just connect a passive speaker with its passive crossover to an amplifier, but instead the idea is to bypass the original crossover entirely and power each driver (a woofer and a tweeter in case of a CX50, for example) separately, like in BeoLabs of today. Crossover is handled by an onboard Analog Devices DSP that's fully user-programmable, wirelessly. DSP also allows us to tune the speakers for a better-than-original sound performance. For example, the CX50 was measured in the Cube in Struer and filters were designed for it by our acoustical magicians. I can tell you it sounds unlike any CX50 you've ever heard. The board is designed to work with a Raspberry Pi (or similar) single-board computer. This is our streaming engine, enabling Wi-Fi and Bluetooth connectivity. The amplifier board also has Toslink in and out, so you can use the Pi for just programming if you don't care about streaming features. Programming is where the Bang & Olufsen app comes in. It will talk to the Raspberry Pi that's seated on the amplifier board and allows you to select which of the supported B&O models you have placed the board into. The app will then download the appropriate settings for that particular model and program the DSP with Bang & Olufsen-designed filters. We're working on this. At release time we will likely just provide preinstalled Bluetooth support, but the great thing about this being Raspberry Pi-based is that you can install and run any software you want – we won't lock it down in any way. We're currently showcasing six upcycled Beovox speakers at TechBBQ (2x CX50, 2x CX100, RL45.2, RL6000) and we have installed AirPlay for the demo. NL support is in the plans – nothing else to announce there yet. The amplifier board will soon enter limited beta testing. Release is projected before the end of the year. If you have questions, I'll try to answer them the best I can!
Good to hear from you, this sounds like a very interesting project - perfect to help us fans of classic B&O products keep up to date with the latest technology...... If you want any help with beta testing the new product, please let me know!
Are Christian and Anders still working with the Create team? I had some good discussions with them earlier in the year, but I haven't heard from either of them for a few months.
Look forward to hearing more about your projects!
Kind regards, Steve.
Steve.
www.soundsheavenly.com
Founder of Sounds Heavenly Cables and Brand Ambassador for Bang & Olufsen
Sounds Heavenly are proud to sponsor BeoWorld!
Please check out my YouTube channel at https://youtube.com/soundsheavenlycables
Thanks for all the enthusiasm and questions so far. I'm glad you're excited, because we are too!
vikinger: This sounds like a great initiative! Will 3 way speakers like the S45/S45.2 be accommodated? Graham
Steve at Sounds Heavenly: Good to hear from you, this sounds like a very interesting project - perfect to help us fans of classic B&O products keep up to date with the latest technology...... If you want any help with beta testing the new product, please let me know! Are Christian and Anders still working with the Create team? I had some good discussions with them earlier in the year, but I haven't heard from either of them for a few months. Look forward to hearing more about your projects! Kind regards, Steve.
lonfred:Please try do it as basic as possible. The best soulution would be that BO Create would supply their clients with Speakers that is already upgraded. I belive it would be an success. Even upgraded speakers like Beolab 8000, Beolab 4000, BL5 etc. Would be fantastic to connect them wireless and use the Bang Olufsen Multi room app.....
Thanks Tuomas,
I have signed up!
I guess rhe Penta-guys would go mad, if there were boards for these speaker ;-)))))
Millemissen:I guess rhe Penta-guys would go mad, if there were boards for these speaker ;-))))) MM There is a tv - and there is a BV.
This initiative has the potential to solve so many problems. Removal of capacitor crossovers in speakers and improved speaker tuning/ performance.
Direct streaming to the speakers.
Retiring of old inefficient Beomasters.... no need to replace capacitors every few years.... they can just be kept as artistic statements/ discussion pieces.. and the end of Class A/B room heating amplification.
vikinger: ..and the end of Class A/B room heating amplification. Graham
..and the end of Class A/B room heating amplification.
Some of us in colder climates reply on our Class A/B power amps for warmth through the winter months!
tph: BeoLignage: ..... 3: for sure a separate question, but would it be possible to get multi channel pcm decoded and amplified by the raspberry and your board? ..... Thanks! 😊 To answer some of your questions: ..... 3: I'll have to ask about this, off the top of my head I can't say.
BeoLignage: ..... 3: for sure a separate question, but would it be possible to get multi channel pcm decoded and amplified by the raspberry and your board? .....
.....
Sorry but last night, from nowhere, I remembered that there is no multichannel PCM capability over Toslink. So that’s a trick question at best. The band width is too small on optical for uncompressed 5.1, so it would in that case be a Dolby or DTS stream, but then you would end up with licensing issues etc. so I guess the answer is NO.
So I like to ask a different question instead:
If you make a nice board with amplifiers and DSP that makes e.g. a CX100 active, and it sounds way better than any CX100 ever has, then I would like to use it in a home cinema setup (or even as a stereo pair), but that would then require an analogue input (or the option to set it to “left” or “right” in the stereo case).
Would that even be remotely possible with your board? And don’t get me wrong, I don’t try to diminish the work you’re doing and I’m super exited already at the single CX100 streaming speaker, but also have to ask for more :)
//Goran
BeoLignage: Sorry but last night, from nowhere, I remembered that there is no multichannel PCM capability over Toslink. So that’s a trick question at best. The band width is too small on optical for uncompressed 5.1, so it would in that case be a Dolby or DTS stream, but then you would end up with licensing issues etc. so I guess the answer is NO. So I like to ask a different question instead: If you make a nice board with amplifiers and DSP that makes e.g. a CX100 active, and it sounds way better than any CX100 ever has, then I would like to use it in a home cinema setup (or even as a stereo pair), but that would then require an analogue input (or the option to set it to “left” or “right” in the stereo case). Would that even be remotely possible with your board? And don’t get me wrong, I don’t try to diminish the work you’re doing and I’m super exited already at the single CX100 streaming speaker, but also have to ask for more :) //Goran
Thanks for following up! I just remembered that I explained this same thing about Toslink limitations a while ago in the BeoSound Shape thread (the reason why stereo audio is sent to the amplifier tiles and processing is done there and not on the Core). I think the more powerful SHARC DSPs from Analog Devices have the possibility to decode Dolby Digital / DTS, but even then, that is as far as I know only available with a licence, as you suggested. This board uses the ADAU1451, if you're curious.
Adding an analogue input is something I'm also interested in. There's no onboard ADC, that's for sure, so it would have to be some kind of an add-on for sure. I've reached out to HiFiBerry to ask what kind of options we would have for that.
If your source provides digital output, creating a stereo pair is already possible. We can daisy-chain as many boards as we want using the Toslink connectors, effectively routing the same stereo signal to all of them. We will then instruct the DSP to just use either L or R channel of that signal. I can't promise that creating this kind of setup will be supported directly through the Bang & Olufsen app, but it's very easy to program this behaviour to the DSP manually through SigmaStudio running on a Windows PC (or if you're a Mac user like us, run it in a virtual machine).
I want to assure you we do not see asking about these features as "diminishing our work" – in fact, part of the fun with this project is trying to imagine all kinds of possible use cases for this board
I would upgrade my CX100 speakers with two boards, for use in a stereo system.
1) Would you please provide information about the daisy-chain link between right and left speaker?
2) Is it possible to use the fourth channel of the board to drive a Cona subwoofer? How?
Thank you.
Kind regards.
Marco
mevangel: I would upgrade my CX100 speakers with two boards, for use in a stereo system. 1) Would you please provide information about the daisy-chain link between right and left speaker? 2) Is it possible to use the fourth channel of the board to drive a Cona subwoofer? How? Thank you. Kind regards. Marco
Hi Marco and thanks for the interesting question.
For creating a CX100 pair, there are a couple of ways to approach it. Both of them come with tradeoffs, so I’ll detail both and you can decide which one you like best.
First is to upcycle both CX100s as usual, placing the boards inside the cabinets of the loudspeakers. For the pairing, the optical inputs and outputs of the boards would be used, which means that in addition to the connector that supplies power to the board (this replaces the original DIN connector in our guides), you will need to make another opening to the back panel for the optical cable.
The issue with this is that optical cables are very rigid and can’t be bent, so the opening would have to be exactly where the connector is located on the board. This would then have to be sealed to maintain the air-tightness of the speaker.
The second method is to instead locate the boards outside of the speakers, in a central location. For this, you would bypass the original crossover just as in the first method, but instead of fitting the CX100s with a power plug, you would run a 6-core (2 cores for each driver) cable from the speaker (however long you need for your setup). At the other end of these cables, you connect the 6 leads of each cable to each of the two boards, and finally link them using the optical cable.
The tradeoff here is obviously that the setup is not as neat than if the boards were inside of the speakers.
In both cases, the software setup tool will allow you to choose which one of the speakers is the left and which is the right. When playing music, you should stream to the "master" speaker, and the "slave" speaker will receive it automatically over the optical link.
The Cona actually makes this really interesting to me, particularly in the case of the second method I described. If you’re willing to modify your Cona, you could actually place both boards inside the subwoofer and run the 6-core cables from there to the CX100s, and use the two remaining outputs on the boards for the subwoofer (even bypassing the original crossover), just as you thought. Probably in this case you would use one of the 60W outputs for the Cona and move one of the CX100 woofers to a 30W output. Think of this like a BeoLab 14 with beefier satellites
Adding the Cona to the mix like this means that we need to create a special DSP program for the setup, but if you decide to go forward with this, I’d be glad to help you out with it.
As you can probably see, there are many possibilities to get to the end result
thank you for your quick reply.
Concerning the link between right and left channel, I am thinking of a few other possibilities:
1) the first consists in lifting the optical module from the board, and placing it in a convenient position on the rear cover of the speaker, or even outside. Obviously providing sealing of the cabinet.
2) the second consists in converting the optical spdif signal to a coaxial spdif signal (there are cheap devices on the market to do this) on the master side. The spdif signal will be converted from coaxial to optical on the slave side. Placing a sealed coaxial connector (such as a BNC) on the rear cover should not be so hard.
3) the third option consists in giving up with the optical interface. The optical module would be removed from the board. It should then be possible to adapt signal level picked up from the board to a standard spdif level.
Concerning the use of a cona subwoofer:
1) Using a 30W amplifier for one driver and a 60W amplifier for the other will cause an inbalance. Can this be corrected by means of a proper programming of the DSP?
2) As far as I know, the cona has a two-voice coil driver. Will each voice coil be driven by a distinct (left or right) spare 60W amplifier?
3) In a first step I will upgrade the CX100s only. In a second step I will proceed further with the cona, and in that case I will certainly ask you for help!
I would be glad to receive your comments.
Thanks again.
Hi Thomas,
Thanks for the info.
Is it also possible to connect to cx50 to one DSP and amp?
E.g. by connecting the second cx50 with a cable to the first.
Even better would if the other speaker is not connected it would play mono and if they are two connected it would play stereo. Is that possible?
Kind regards,
Ton