ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qPnLkrZUv4
Speaking of image calibration with the Eclipse, if i was getting one i would definitely look to get someone to calibrate the TV for me
The YT video above gives some insight of the dizzying array of options on LG displays! I wouldn't have a clue how to do it myself, as there are far too many concepts and options for my small brain. And speaking personally, assuming reasonable cost, i'd want to get the best picture settings for my specific circumstances (type of content, room conditions). Not sure whether the B&O installers have the knowledge to do this, but i may be wrong.
Anyway, the above video is nerdy and not for everyone, but interesting all the same (the Eclipse should have 3 of the HDR formats out of the box).
For example, picture settings cannot be copied from one input to another (! i know!) - so with respect to the above, if you play around and find settings you like, you have to go through and re-set the settings for different HDMI inputs.
Anyway, the guy in the video is very much your definition of a geek, and i say that with all due respect. His videos have certainly helped me understand a bit more about language of newer TV's (small brain remember) - and the shortish video above does give a feel for the UI on the Eclipse.
Over and out (by the way, HDTVTest did a fantastic shoot out on YouTube between the Sony A1, LG C7, Panasonic OLED, Samsung QLED) - i'll post a summary if anyone is interested, but anyway thought the above was interesting with respect to the Eclipse and owning one.
I sold my bv 7-55 long time ago as wanted an avant but did mot get it in the end as missing internals. So now may get the eclips as ticks the boxes.
Sandyb: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qPnLkrZUv4 Speaking of image calibration with the Eclipse, if i was getting one i would definitely look to get someone to calibrate the TV for me
Picture calibration certainly is not for everyone - especially not, when it comes to the new options of modern tvsets.
I can't imagine, that mister B&O installer is prepared for this (maybe you can find one or two of the more nerdy species amongst them).
That is definitely a thing for professional calibrators.
And maybe this also speaks about the reason for B&O to stay out of this game and leave it to LG to bring the tv into the boat.
It will not be easier in the future and would require a lot of specialiced manpower in Struer.
However, most reviews of the LG-tv's states that they are pretty good out of the box.
The improvement, that can be made a maybe (?) only visible to these professional guys, who have eyes for such things.
If you want to dig a bit deeper into this, this might be a good resource (beware - duration over 1 hour!)
https://twit.tv/shows/home-theater-geeks/episodes/358?autostart=false
By the way - my dealer per default had his BV Eclipses running a 'normal' tvstation from the cable provider, that most people in Denmark use at home.
(The picture from that source looked pretty good in my view).
But of course he showed the more brilliant content, when costumers wanted a demonstration of the tv including the sound ;-)
MM
There is a tv - and there is a BV
Yes out of the box looks very good.
Aussie Michael:I do like the centre channel but also the left and the right and for the rears too I didn't mind the Sony sound on the acoustic surface. A B&O it certainly ain't in the speaker department. If less than a certain percentage of people buy speakers with the TV - they certainly come back to buy more speakers after. I did. That's how i ended up with the BL19, and 2 BL18 (as rears) after. The question i also pose to myself is "why would i even upgrade/update to the Eclipse from the Avant" which i also suspect many people do. It will be good to see how much the options are on the stb bracket solution.
I didn't mind the Sony sound on the acoustic surface. A B&O it certainly ain't in the speaker department.
If less than a certain percentage of people buy speakers with the TV - they certainly come back to buy more speakers after. I did. That's how i ended up with the BL19, and 2 BL18 (as rears) after.
The question i also pose to myself is "why would i even upgrade/update to the Eclipse from the Avant" which i also suspect many people do.
It will be good to see how much the options are on the stb bracket solution.
From my experience with the Eclipse sales yesterday - the buyers are Avant 55 upgrading to Eclipse 65, upgrading from Avant 55 to Eclipse 55 and one existing Avant 75, furnishing another room with Eclipse 55. Two more about to upgrade Avant 55 to Eclipse 65. Two 11-55 going for Eclipse 65. One 7-40 moving to Eclipse 65. So quite a mix. I will have an Avant 55 (old generation - the reliable one) on motor floor stand with two years warranty remaining available for £5500 if anyone interested?
It will be interesting to know if the eclipse suffers from audio sync delay. I currently have a Sony LCD and Yamaha YSP2700 soundbar, whilst it does sound good it’s nowhere near the quality of B&O. The issue I find with my setup and from what I read on other audio forums is that there is usually always some form of delay between the audio & video. This can be helped by audio/video sync delay correction settings on both the TV & soundbar however I do believe that it will never be 100% due to the two independent systems.
With the eclipse we have the exact same setup, audio processing by B&O and video by LG, in the past this was never an issue as everything was handled by the BeoVision and just worked without the need to modify any settings.
I have been a long-time admirer of B&O and was disappointed when I read they are no longer concentrating on video, does this mean that all future BeoVision will follow the same as the eclipse? To lose vision clear and all the other enhancements B&O use in previous BeoVision is a huge loss as I believe it’s exactly this what sets them apart from the rest and is a big reason why their customers are prepared to pay more.
Beolab 50, Beolab 8000 x 2, Beolab 4000 x 2, BeoSound Core, BeoSound 9000, BeoSound Century, BeoLit 15, BeoPlay A1, BeoPlay P2, BeoPlay H9 3rd Gen, BeoPlay H6, EarSet 3i, BeoVision Eclipse Gen 2 55", BeoPlay V1-40, BeoCom 6000 and so much else :)
SHEFFIELD:From my experience with the Eclipse sales yesterday - the buyers are Avant 55 upgrading to Eclipse 65, upgrading from Avant 55 to Eclipse 55 and one existing Avant 75, furnishing another room with Eclipse 55. Two more about to upgrade Avant 55 to Eclipse 65. Two 11-55 going for Eclipse 65. One 7-40 moving to Eclipse 65. So quite a mix. I will have an Avant 55 (old generation - the reliable one) on motor floor stand with two years warranty remaining available for £5500 if anyone interested?
BeoNut since '75
Sandyb:Over and out (by the way, HDTVTest did a fantastic shoot out on YouTube between the Sony A1, LG C7, Panasonic OLED, Samsung QLED) - i'll post a summary if anyone is interested, but anyway thought the above was interesting with respect to the Eclipse and owning one.
Aussie Michael:B&O is all about the multi room with a big TV like this. YOu want to be able to use it as a source for the speakers. If it was a casual TV.... i even think the Horizon isn't stand alone. It's multi room?
Michael:One thing is for sure. If eclipse is a success I think we've seen the last of B&O user interface and have to settle on average clumsy ugly interfaces from now on. For me, that's a very bad thing.
BeoVision Haermony 65"...BeoLab 28 Anthracite....BeoLab 17 as REAR....BV10-32....BC6-26....Beosound 9000....Beosound 1 New York edt....Beogram 4002....Beoplay Emerge....Beoplay M5....Beoplay M3....Beoremote Halo....BeoRemote One BT....Beo6....Beo4....Beo4 Cinema....BeoLink 7000....Serene....H95 Black LTD....H9i Rimowa....6 x H6....Form 1....U70...
mr_anders_son:Michael....are you watching the Menu more then wathcing movies etc?? BeoVision 14-55 oak...BeoLab 8002 as FRONT....BeoLab 4000 as REAR....BL19 SUB copper 90's edt....BV5 2xHDMI....BV7-32 MK3....BC6-26....Beosound 9000....BeoRemote One BT....Beo6....Beo4....Beo4 Cinema....BeoLink 7000....Serene....H8....H6 90´s Rose Gold edt....Form 1....U70...A2 Black Copper Special Edt
Michael:I use the interface every day and it matters very very much to me. Of course the material shown is one hint but with that thinking why even have a nicely designed hardware if only the content matters? For me design and logic matters in both hardware and software. Both in logic, elegance and esthetics.
mr_anders_son:I agree with you 100% but this is the future for B&O! So it just to get used to it! BeoVision 14-55 oak...BeoLab 8002 as FRONT....BeoLab 4000 as REAR....BL19 SUB copper 90's edt....BV5 2xHDMI....BV7-32 MK3....BC6-26....Beosound 9000....BeoRemote One BT....Beo6....Beo4....Beo4 Cinema....BeoLink 7000....Serene....H8....H6 90´s Rose Gold edt....Form 1....U70...A2 Black Copper Special Edt
Michael:I won't. I'd rather go another way then. User interface is very important to me.
mr_anders_son:Yes I understand that! But I have hard to understand that the interface is more importent then picture quality, sound, multiroom and design of the TV-set etc.... BeoVision 14-55 oak...BeoLab 8002 as FRONT....BeoLab 4000 as REAR....BL19 SUB copper 90's edt....BV5 2xHDMI....BV7-32 MK3....BC6-26....Beosound 9000....BeoRemote One BT....Beo6....Beo4....Beo4 Cinema....BeoLink 7000....Serene....H8....H6 90´s Rose Gold edt....Form 1....U70...A2 Black Copper Special Edt
Sandyb: For example, picture settings cannot be copied from one input to another (! i know!) - so with respect to the above, if you play around and find settings you like, you have to go through and re-set the settings for different HDMI inputs.
If calibration is done on the LG side, let's not forget that the Soundcenter is HDMI 2 for the panel.
So no matter which devices you have connected to the sound bar (in my case it would be Mac Mini, a Canal+ STB and an Nvidia Shield with PUC cables), they will be all considered as the same source for the TV. That's if I understood correctly how the Eclipse works. If that's the case you can only have one set of calibration settings...
Marcello:If calibration is done on the LG side, let's not forget that the Soundcenter is HDMI 2 for the panel.So no matter which devices you have connected to the sound bar (in my case it would be Mac Mini, a Canal+ STB and an Nvidia Shield with PUC cables), they will be all considered as the same source for the TV. That's if I understood correctly how the Eclipse works. If that's the case you can only have one set of calibration settings...
KMA
B&O product history since 1991: Ridiculously long to list in a signature.
I just tried to read the above post - all sounds a bit complex and un-B&O-like
Guy:I just tried to read the above post - all sounds a bit complex and un-B&O-like
KMA:Also, all the HDMI ports 1, 3 and 4 of the LG TV can have their own calibration, but I am not sure how the sound is routed, when something is connected to those inputs instead of the HDMI A - D ports of the SoundCenter.
Sure, that's what I expected. Except that in order to have PUC control you need to plug them to the bar in the A-D input, not to the TV HDMI ports.
KMA: People who use LG TVs with external AVRs, where all HDMI sources are connected directly to the AVR, which is then connected to LG's HDMI2 (with ARC), need to use this method of selecting picture presets, too. Essentially, SoundCenter is the AVR in the Eclipse. I perfectly understand the method and the reasons behind it. But I think we can agree that selecting a picture mode manually for each source is a step back from having the TV recalling the settings that were stored for each source. Also, since I doubt the picture mode is controlled by CEC, I doubt we will be able to change the picture mode via the LIST button easily (it will probably still work for sound modes since this is changed in the SoundCenter). I will see the TV in person on Tuesday or Wednesday and try for myself though. So far, it's just reasoned assumptions on my side.
People who use LG TVs with external AVRs, where all HDMI sources are connected directly to the AVR, which is then connected to LG's HDMI2 (with ARC), need to use this method of selecting picture presets, too. Essentially, SoundCenter is the AVR in the Eclipse.
Marcello:Sure, that's what I expected. Except that in order to have PUC control you need to plug them to the bar in the A-D input, not to the TV HDMI ports. I perfectly understand the method and the reasons behind it. But I think we can agree that selecting a picture mode manually for each source is a step back from having the TV recalling the settings that were stored for each source. Also, since I doubt the picture mode is controlled by CEC, I doubt we will be able to change the picture mode via the LIST button easily (it will probably still work for sound modes since this is changed in the SoundCenter). I will see the TV in person on Tuesday or Wednesday and try for myself though. So far, it's just reasoned assumptions on my side.
Well from my own perspective having seen the Eclipse in recent days I now know that my next TV will be the first generation Avant so Sheffield, watch this space as you may be getting a phone call sometime soon!
I didn't like the Eclipse. I knew immediately that it wasn't the TV from me so in many ways this is positive as it cements the way going forward with nothing else to consider. No complaints with OLED/HDR of course; I really wanted that in my next TV. But, I have decided to compromise and go back to LCD, much as I really don't like the technology. We are all different in what we look for in a product. My reasoning is quite simple, it's always about design and B&O magic that top my list, with picture quality a close second.
The Avant is older is older both technologically and in age, but it can be mounted on a beautiful motorised table stand with further magical moments when as the speakers move into view with the curtains opening up to reveal the picture. The opening/closing ceremony of the olympics if you will, using B&O magic terminology. Those experiences alone are what bring a smile to my face every time I switch on and off the TV and that's why I buy B&O. Further, the product is B&O through and through (mostly) with a B&O interface and menu system.
The Eclipse didn't excite me at all, not even a little bit. I thought the speaker was actually too big width wise, not just length wise. I don't understand its placement with the redundant (as I see it) glass part underneath it. I also think the B&O text on that piece of glass is too big and not subtle enough. I don't want a Netflix or Amazon button on a B&O remote and neither do I want LG logos or menus on a B&O TV. Personally, I think it's a poor effort from B&O and question how well it will sell. It's pleasing to read dealers selling a few already and I hope it does prove to be a success for B&O and dealers alike but it's definitely not for me. The speaker is the only part of the product I can see as, or label as, B&O.
B&O products are V1-32, BS2, H95, E8 and an Essence remote.11-46 now replaced with Sony A90J 65”, Sony HT-A9, Sony UBP-X800M2 and Sony SRS-NS7.
KMA: Please let us know how you feel about the experience. There is a bit of learning with this new type of B&O/LG television. They come with added options and layers for operation.
Please let us know how you feel about the experience. There is a bit of learning with this new type of B&O/LG television. They come with added options and layers for operation.
I'm extremely familiar with the world of AVR and that's one of the reasons why I got a BV11-46 and later an 11-55. The next one should replace the BV10 as I would like to use a matrix (the Beo4 is not suitable so I could not do it easily I was told). So, I will start my experience with the Eclipse with inevitable prejudices I'm afraid. That said, I'm not in a hurry to purchase, it might be wise for me to wait for a more integrated set, if that will ever happen.
Anyway I'm taking my Mac to the dealer to read the EDID information. I hope they fixed the bug which left the BS4-based sets without Dolby Digital+ (required by Netflix and Amazon).
On top of that, does anybody know if the SoundCenter now supports DTS-HD? I could not find it mentioned on the specs.
LR2015: I've been watching this thread with interest as I was tempted by the Eclipse. We bought a new BV11-46 just over 2 years ago and whilst it's a fantastic tv I do regret not going for the 55" model - hence thought I'd wait for the next tv B&O produce. How much am I missing out on by not having Ultra HD on the BV11? Main watching sources are Netflix and occasionally downloading (renting) films on Itunes.
I've been watching this thread with interest as I was tempted by the Eclipse. We bought a new BV11-46 just over 2 years ago and whilst it's a fantastic tv I do regret not going for the 55" model - hence thought I'd wait for the next tv B&O produce.
How much am I missing out on by not having Ultra HD on the BV11? Main watching sources are Netflix and occasionally downloading (renting) films on Itunes.
I'm in a similar situation. I bought a BV11-40 just over two years ago and wish I'd gone for the 46". B&O have made things difficult by not producing a 46" version of the BV14. An Avant will probably be my next choice (it looks smaller than the 55" BV-14 IMO) when I decide I need 4K.
Speaking of which, to stream 4K you need fibre if you don't have it already. And iTunes doesn't have any 4K content yet, though I hear that is likely to change later this month when the next iteration of the Apple TV comes out.
4K doesn't require fiber, it takes 25 Mbps, even here in backwoods country where I lice I easily get over 60 Mbps.
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
So the HDTV Test shoot out can be summarised as follows :
Methodology was to compare 5 TVs across a few aspects, using a Sony professional broadcast monitor as a reference or benchmark.
The 5 TVs were the : Sony A1, LG B7, Panasonic EZ1002, Sony ZD9, and Samsung QLED (so 3 OLEDs, 2 LED/LCDs)
Awards given how the TVs performed in the individual aspect tests (see below, i've listed the first + second places only), they chose to define 3 winners as follows :
- Best Home Theatre TV - Panasonic EZ1002 (2nd place Sony A1) (importance given to Contrast Performance, Uniformity, Colour Accuracy)
- Best Living Room TV - Sony A1 (2nd place Panasonic) (Motion, Video Processing, Bright Room performance)
- Best Gaming TV - LG B7
- Best HDR TV - LG B7
The individual test scores are below - i listed them, because it's interesting how many tests were won by the Panasonic and Sony. There were a few articles online reporting on the shoot out, noting how well Panasonic did. In addition to the 4 awards above, HDTV Test also did an overall award where all the test scores below were simply added up, and Panasonic marginally beat the LG B7. There is some nuance here - that overall result for LG is flattered by its gaming performance, where it won that aspect test by a very clear margin. If you gave gaming a lower weight, Panasonic and Sony would have been 1 and 2.
Anyway, i said i'd post a summary, and there it is - feel free to completely ignore of course, or read into it what you will. Personally, while i'm sold on OLED, i'd say from seeing a few of their test and side by side videos, not all OLED TV's are created equal, once you look how the different manufacturers handle the aspects below.
Have B&O chosen / does the Eclipse have the very best image results - probably not quite.
Does it matter - probably not, though opinions will of course vary, everyone has different sensitivities, nothing wrong with that of course.
Anyway, off to bed.
SandyB.
Aspects tested
There were 8 aspects tested - i've shown which TV won each aspect, and the detail for the individual tests within each aspect.
Contrast performance - winner Panasonic
- Black level 1. Panasonic 2. Sony A1
- Shadow detail 1. Sony A1 2. Panasonic
- Bright detail 1. Panasonic 2. Sony A1
Colour Accuracy : 1. Panasonic 2. LG B7
Motion - winner Sony A1
- Clarity (smearing) 1. Panasonic 2. Sony A1
- Smoothness (panning) 1 Sony A1 2. LG B7
Uniformity - winner Pansonic
- dark uniformity 1. Panasonic 2. Lg B7
- light uniformity 1. Panasonic 2. Sony A1
Video Processing - winner Sony A1
- Upscaling 1. Sony A1 2. Panasonic
- Gradation 1. Sony A1 2. Sony ZD9
- Compressed Sources handling 1. Sony A1 2. Sony ZD9
Gaming - winner LG B7
- Input Lag 1. LG B7 2. Samsung Q9
- Picture Quality 1. Panasonic 2. LG B7
Bright room - winner Samsung Q7
- Light output 1. LG B7 2. Samsung Q9
- Anti reflection 1. Samsung 2. Sony A1
HDR Performance
- Dark scenes 1. Panasonic 2. LG B7
- 1000 Nit scenes 1. LG B7 2. Panasonic
- 4000 Nit scenes 1. LG B7 2. Sony ZD9
I wonder if the cynic in me thinks that the reason that B&O didn't release HDR in the Avant and the 14 was so that they dont have to keep the current platform alive and push everyone to the Eclipse?
Because if there was HDR, would most people have still chosen an Eclipse?
Or still go to the Eclipse because it has OLED and superior sound?
Just a thought
andy_js: An Avant will probably be my next choice (it looks smaller than the 55" BV-14 IMO) when I decide I need 4K.
An Avant will probably be my next choice (it looks smaller than the 55" BV-14 IMO) when I decide I need 4K.
Don't expect the Avant to stay on the market for long. B&O told us that it eventually will be replaced by the Eclipse.
I assume that the 55" and 65" Avant leave first, whereas the 85" Avant propably will stay on the market longer awaiting a larger LG OLED (77") in the C7/D7-range.
/Lars
Editor in Chief, recordere.dkDanish online magazine for consumer electronics
Aussie Michael: I wonder if the cynic in me thinks that the reason that B&O didn't release HDR in the Avant and the 14 was so that they dont have to keep the current platform alive and push everyone to the Eclipse? Because if there was HDR, would most people have still chosen an Eclipse? Or still go to the Eclipse because it has OLED and superior sound? Just a thought
No!
All the HDR-stuff wasn't by far mature at that moment.
Do consider, that it takes a lot of time from the concept of a BV before it can be released to the market.
And there will be more - the BV Eclipse/OLED-tv's is certainly not the endresult of human search for improving, developing picture technology.
(Whether we need these 'improvements' or not, is another question).
Aussie Michael: I wonder if the cynic in me thinks that the reason that B&O didn't release HDR in the Avant and the 14 was so that they dont have to keep the current platform alive and push everyone to the Eclipse?
Do you *really* believe your average B&O customer even a) understands HDR and b) would pay thousands of pounds to upgrade to obtain HDR?
If you live your life based on having the latest standards to "cope" with watching a television programme, I'd have a word with myself, frankly. Why, as humans, do we naturally think we've 'missed out' by not having the latest standard? Step back and think that through - a few years ago that never happened. Now we live on a tech wheel of fear.
moxxey:Do you *really* believe your average B&O customer even a) understands HDR and b) would pay thousands of pounds to upgrade to obtain HDR? If you live your life based on having the latest standards to "cope" with watching a television programme, I'd have a word with myself, frankly. Why, as humans, do we naturally think we've 'missed out' by not having the latest standard? Step back and think that through - a few years ago that never happened. Now we live on a tech wheel of fear.
Jeff:4K doesn't require fiber, it takes 25 Mbps, even here in backwoods country where I lice I easily get over 60 Mbps. Jeff Beovirus victim, it's gotten to be too much to list!
Hi, I like the Eclipse when its on a stand but dont like the formfactor for wallmounting. What I am hoping for next is something like the wallpaperthin W series tv but with the B&O soundcenter insted of the LG soundbar.
Aussie Michael: Jeff: 4K doesn't require fiber, it takes 25 Mbps, even here in backwoods country where I lice I easily get over 60 Mbps. Jeff Beovirus victim, it's gotten to be too much to list! I didn't realise that actually. I have learned something today :-)
Jeff: 4K doesn't require fiber, it takes 25 Mbps, even here in backwoods country where I lice I easily get over 60 Mbps. Jeff Beovirus victim, it's gotten to be too much to list!
Beovirus victim, it's gotten to be too much to list!
I didn't realise that actually. I have learned something today :-)
I though I remembered it was not that bad, but I had to go look it up myself! Still, lot of places where internet speeds would pose a problem. I used to have 20 Mbps as the limit here a couple of years ago, but almost two years ago they went to 60 Mbps for no increase in price. I knew a guy in Florida where I used to live that did have fiber, his speeds were amazing, but in reality being jealous is just over bragging rights I think. Most websites don't load faster for me now than they used to, seems a lot of the bottlenecks are upstream, mainly at the servers that host a lot of the side items and ads. Even with adblocker, which helps, sites are slower than they should be.
moxxey: Do you *really* believe your average B&O customer even a) understands HDR and b) would pay thousands of pounds to upgrade to obtain HDR? If you live your life based on having the latest standards to "cope" with watching a television programme, I'd have a word with myself, frankly. Why, as humans, do we naturally think we've 'missed out' by not having the latest standard? Step back and think that through - a few years ago that never happened. Now we live on a tech wheel of fear.
well stated.
4 beolab 5, beolab 9, beolab 10, beolab 5000, beolab 8000 mk2, beolab 6002, beolab 3500, beovision 7 55 mk2, 2 beovision 11 46 mk4, beotime, beosound ouverture, beosound essence, beoplay A8, beomaster 900 RG de luxe and the collection continues...
I have noticed that a number of people, including on Beoworld, have talked about how their TV isn't like looking out the window, how hopefully HDR and 4 or 8K, whatever, will supposedly make that more like looking out the window, etc. This is not only reminding me that limitations of the technology and recording techniques will mean live music will never, in all likelihood, sound like recorded music, or vice versa rather, but that for many years now the standard that TVs and video has been judged by is not fidelity to looking out a window, but rather fidelity to film, movies projected from decent large film has been the standard. Granted, today, theaters seldom are that good, as due to digital projectors taking the place of film, but the goal has previously always been stated as fidelity to good film. Hence things like 3:2 pulldown on displays, to give 24 rather than 30 frames per second, to mimic film, were implemented.
Just an observation. I find my plasma does the best job of approximating film of any display I've seen, including brief exposure (non optimum to be sure) to OLED.
I have just received a dealer brochure for the Eclipse (and BL50s). Interestingly, and to correct one of my previous observations, the TV does appear to have a motorised wall hinge option, with the hinge hidden at the end of the sound bar so that the whole TV seems to float away from the wall.
Presumably this has become possible due to the very low weight of the screen compared to, for example, the BV11, where a huge hinge is needed the same height of the TV, with multiple anchors into the wall.
Graham
vikinger: I have just received a dealer brochure for the Eclipse (and BL50s). Interestingly, and to correct one of my previous observations, the TV does appear to have a motorised wall hinge option, with the hinge hidden at the end of the sound bar so that the whole TV seems to float away from the wall. Presumably this has become possible due to the very low weight of the screen compared to, for example, the BV11, where a huge hinge is needed the same height of the TV, with multiple anchors into the wall. Graham
Yes, you can see it on video here: https://vimeo.com/231691728