ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
Hi Beoworlders,
I hope that you are all keeping well. I have had a pair of Beolab 5s on my wishlist for many years now, to replace the much loved Penta 3s in my study. However, I have always been put off by the rumours of reliability issues, including shortages of spare parts and the risk of needing to replace the speaker chassis after a certain period of use.
Could I please ask for any input from members who use Beolab 5s, or who are involved in repairing them?
Are the earlier models more risky, or can any age of Beolab 5 potentially have issues? Is it purely dependent on age, bad luck, or a history of misuse?
Thanks in advance!
Kind regards, Steve.
Steve.
www.soundsheavenly.com
Founder of Sounds Heavenly Cables and Brand Ambassador for Bang & Olufsen
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Hi, I bought a brand new pair in May 2015. In august 2018 one speaker stopped working and the warranty did not cover this. I have to change the chassi in a 3-year old speaker at the cost of 1.800 Euro. After this I could not trust these speakers and bought instead a pair of Beolab 50.
Best Regards
Martin
NEW! Beovision Eclipse 65 2nd generation (G1) with floorstand (from STB Brackets), Beolab 50 front, Beolab 3 rear, 2 x Beoplay A6 linkrooms, 2xBeoremote one BT, Beosound 9000 Mark III (sw 3.4), Beosound 5 (for DLNA only), Philips Hue (all lights in the home), Oppo UDP-203, Apple TV 4K (2021 model). Beoremote HALO, 3xBeoplay Charging pad, Beoplay M5
Martin: Hi, I bought a brand new pair in May 2015. In august 2018 one speaker stopped working and the warranty did not cover this. I have to change the chassi in a 3-year old speaker at the cost of 1.800 Euro. After this I could not trust these speakers and bought instead a pair of Beolab 50. Best Regards Martin
Incredible that a company that sells premium speakers to a very high price, does not care about a customers very expensive speaker that dies after 3 years.
I know warranty is 2 years, but since this is "known" issue, I would say they should give the customer credit on something like this. I could understand they deny after 6-10 years, but a speaker at that price, should last more than 3 years.
/Weebyx
Weebyx: Martin: Hi, I bought a brand new pair in May 2015. In august 2018 one speaker stopped working and the warranty did not cover this. I have to change the chassi in a 3-year old speaker at the cost of 1.800 Euro. After this I could not trust these speakers and bought instead a pair of Beolab 50. Best Regards Martin Incredible that a company that sells premium speakers to a very high price, does not care about a customers very expensive speaker that dies after 3 years. I know warranty is 2 years, but since this is "known" issue, I would say they should give the customer credit on something like this. I could understand they deny after 6-10 years, but a speaker at that price, should last more than 3 years. /Weebyx
Completely agree. I am astonished actually. Thanks for this thread Steve as I too was going to make a BL5 purchase at some point down the road. Its frustrating because I still want to as the design is breathtaking to me. Hmm, why do B&O always make it so difficult for customers? Nothing is ever straightforward with this company. Lab 50s too much money. I just wouldn't spend c£20k on a pair of speakers.
B&O products are V1-32, BS2, H95, E8 and an Essence remote.11-46 now replaced with Sony A90J 65”, Sony HT-A9, Sony UBP-X800M2 and Sony SRS-NS7.
as a rule of thumb 5's last anywhere between 10 and 15 years before they need something to be repaired, usually the chassis as the bass tends to shake the capacitors loose etc. Once repaired they last the same amount of time again.
the Mk1's don't have a huge stack of chassis's left but the mk2's are fine for replacement parts. Obviously there are some lemons and a lot depends on how it was used and at which volumes as the bass is the real killer of electronic parts. Mostly if you take a possible chassis fix into account while buying, or using it as a bargaining ploy, and the price is still acceptable then you'll be fine.
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Old: Beosound 9000 mk3, Beolab 3's, Beovision Eclipse, Beolab 1's, Beolab 2, Beovision 10-46, Overture 2300, beolab 8000's, Beolab 4000's, Beovision avant 32" etc. etc.
Hi,
When I talked to the "repair-man" who repaired my old Beolab 5 which needed a chassi swap, he said that a Beolab 5 Chassi will last about 6-8 years. That is his experience. He has replaced about 30-40 chassis of Beolab 5 the last 10 years in south of Sweden. Yes, my Lab5:s went wrong after about 3 years which is a very short time. But I dont think that 10-15 years is the normal lifetime for a Lab 5 chassi.
I think also that even If you buy a pair of Beolab 5 used today and they work well 5-8 years ahead, the question then still is there: Does B&O still in 5-8 years have any exchange chassi for beolab 5? If not, the speakers is worth zero money.
/Martin
Some years ago I came across a technical article (that I can no longer find) claiming that the original BL5 microphone calibration had a notional life of about 200 uses, but that owners often liked to demonstrate the calibration to visitors to the extent that the mechanisms often suffered premature failure. Apparently B&O thought that calibration would only ever take place a handful of times.
I have no idea whether this article was based on fact.
Graham
BeoVision Haermony 65"...BeoLab 28 Anthracite....BeoLab 17 as REAR....BV10-32....BC6-26....Beosound 9000....Beosound 1 New York edt....Beogram 4002....Beoplay Emerge....Beoplay M5....Beoplay M3....Beoremote Halo....BeoRemote One BT....Beo6....Beo4....Beo4 Cinema....BeoLink 7000....Serene....H95 Black LTD....H9i Rimowa....6 x H6....Form 1....U70...
vikinger: Some years ago I came across a technical article (that I can no longer find) claiming that the original BL5 microphone calibration had a notional life of about 200 uses, but that owners often liked to demonstrate the calibration to visitors to the extent that the mechanisms often suffered premature failure. Apparently B&O thought that calibration would only ever take place a handful of times. I have no idea whether this article was based on fact. Graham
mine are from 2003; i bought them second hand 10 years ago; they then were in excellent condition.
never had one problem with them and for the last 10 years i used them every other day on average.
i did not count the number of times I ran the calibration but it is still working.
i do have some doubts BO have limited the number of calibrations (why would you) but will not do an experiment to get final prove :-)
I owned a pair of BeoLab 90s for approximately 12 years.
During that time, each speaker needed its chassis replacing twice.
One of them was on the way out again when I got rid of them.
politician: I owned a pair of BeoLab 90s for approximately 12 years. During that time, each speaker needed its chassis replacing twice. One of them was on the way out again when I got rid of them.
Do you mean the BeoLab 5s? !!! You've done well if you've had the 90s for 12 years!
When your BL5 needs to be repaired, a swap of chassis is always done when it comes to the electronics. You can't order separate parts from the chassis.
That has a downside and upside, The costs can be significant, but then you are pretty confident that all the electronics are ready to go for the next years. I think it's relative, when you bought them new for the retail price then the costs for those are easier to handle then when you bought them second life and have to pay for the same amount of costs.
I think there is a connection between reliability and ICE power based amplifiers from the first and early days it was released.
Until now I've fixed at least a dozen BL5's on component level and am familiar with the fact that once a BL5 becomes defective, the damage can be on different parts of the chassis. So, a chassis swap is the safest and quickest way the fix a BL5.
About the microphone failure, the microphone is belt driven and measurements are stored in a memory. These can fail, but fixed.
Beobuddy:When your BL5 needs to be repaired, a swap of chassis is always done when it comes to the electronics. You can't order separate parts from the chassis. That has a downside and upside, The costs can be significant, but then you are pretty confident that all the electronics are ready to go for the next years. I think it's relative, when you bought them new for the retail price then the costs for those are easier to handle then when you bought them second life and have to pay for the same amount of costs. I think there is a connection between reliability and ICE power based amplifiers from the first and early days it was released. Until now I've fixed at least a dozen BL5's on component level and am familiar with the fact that once a BL5 becomes defective, the damage can be on different parts of the chassis. So, a chassis swap is the safest and quickest way the fix a BL5. About the microphone failure, the microphone is belt driven and measurements are stored in a memory. These can fail, but fixed.
BV Harmony 65 / Eclipse 55 / BL 50 / 19 / 18 / BS 2 all brass
BV Horizon 48 / V1 40 / BL 17 / Beoplay S3 all black
V1 / BL 3 / BS Essence MKII / Beoplay A3 all white
BS Moment / BS 3000 / BS 3200 / BL 400 all silver
Headphones / bluetooth speakers / BLC NL-ML / BLGateway
I know…B&O virus has grown on me !
The Beonic Man:Do you mean the BeoLab 5s? !!! You've done well if you've had the 90s for 12 years!
I did, yes. Typing error! BeoLab 90s and 50s are what I have now.
Definitely glad you posted this Steve, I have just deleted a bargain of BL5's from my basket. Incidentally how does the chassis fail?
There is nothing more nothing less issue regarding reliability than any other speaker with a lot of electronic embedded. Don't forget that it is the first B&O speaker to have so much digital stuff built in. Reliability is of course depending of the stability of the electric network, like for all electronic devices, like with a computer for example. I am pretty sure that BL50 and BL90 will have exactly the same "reliability" issue in comparaison to more simple speakers like a BL1 or BL8000, or of course a Penta, even more than the BL5 probably with the amount of embedded software which is not really a B&O strength...
When I bought mine from the dealer, he told me that most of the failure he noticed with these speakers was due to either the electric stability (which can be easily improved), or the intensive use of them at a very high volume like if it was matter to sound a night club 24x7...
Hi everyone,
Many thanks for your responses, I really appreciate this. I must admit that I was quite shocked at the reported failure rate of these speakers, I had previously assumed that just a small proportion were affected, mainly the earlier models.
If anyone out there has had Beolab 5s for years and used them daily without an issue, please can you let us know? I am sure there must be more of these speakers out there that have behaved well.......
Thanks again, Steve.
Steve at Sounds Heavenly: Hi everyone, Many thanks for your responses, I really appreciate this. I must admit that I was quite shocked at the reported failure rate of these speakers, I had previously assumed that just a small proportion were affected, mainly the earlier models. If anyone out there has had Beolab 5s for years and used them daily without an issue, please can you let us know? I am sure there must be more of these speakers out there that have behaved well....... Thanks again, Steve.
In fact, very glad I bought them. The sound is amazing and even though I don't use them all that frequently, they look amazing when turned off as well.
Bought an ex-showroom pair from 2012 or so (cant recall exactly).
I would buy bl5again today if I had to start over.
Haubjes: Steve at Sounds Heavenly: Hi everyone, Many thanks for your responses, I really appreciate this. I must admit that I was quite shocked at the reported failure rate of these speakers, I had previously assumed that just a small proportion were affected, mainly the earlier models. If anyone out there has had Beolab 5s for years and used them daily without an issue, please can you let us know? I am sure there must be more of these speakers out there that have behaved well....... Thanks again, Steve. Have had mine for a couple of years now (even ordered some cables from you back then), no problems whatsoever. They didnt skip a beat. In fact, very glad I bought them. The sound is amazing and even though I don't use them all that frequently, they look amazing when turned off as well. Bought an ex-showroom pair from 2012 or so (cant recall exactly). I would buy bl5again today if I had to start over.
Same here. Bought a Final Edition pair in 2017. But I am working from home (though I have 25% travelling), so they are used almost everyday, all the day long.
I never had any issue with any B&O speaker in fact, however I got quite some with Beovisions after only 1 or 2 years (Beovision 10-46: its AC3module died, Beovision 10-32 panel dead). I also got the doors of the Beocenter 2 faulty after a few years.
Forget about the rumors and the bad experiences over Internet, and go for it ! Life is short ;-)
CB:Hi SteveI sold mine one year after the end of the warranty, because I did not trust either the speakers or the dealer.Do not buy them if you are in this situation. You will not have peace of mind. It will spoil your pleasure...
mr_anders_son:I have just bought a pair of MK2 for 5000€.All electronics have there issues.So I am not worried.
Probably just me, but I look at this like I would a pre-owned auto purchase.
Why are they selling? History and Records, please.
What could go wrong, how likely is it (anecdotal evidence is sketchy), and how much will that cost? It is happens to one, should I repair them both? Will your expectations outlive the parts supply chain? Can I accept all that should it happen?
What can I do to protect them? Hook them up to surge protector so spikes are minimised (known to break down circuits over time). Don't run them at "11". Buy where you have some purchase protection. Buy from a friend.
There is a reason resale pricing on luxury motors falls off the cliff and fancy jewelry does not, and electronics are more like cars than cars are.
But you can't beat the ride.
oli: There is nothing more nothing less issue regarding reliability than any other speaker with a lot of electronic embedded. Don't forget that it is the first B&O speaker to have so much digital stuff built in. Reliability is of course depending of the stability of the electric network, like for all electronic devices, like with a computer for example. I am pretty sure that BL50 and BL90 will have exactly the same "reliability" issue in comparaison to more simple speakers like a BL1 or BL8000, or of course a Penta, even more than the BL5 probably with the amount of embedded software which is not really a B&O strength... When I bought mine from the dealer, he told me that most of the failure he noticed with these speakers was due to either the electric stability (which can be easily improved), or the intensive use of them at a very high volume like if it was matter to sound a night club 24x7...
I do not agree with this.
First the software is rock solid stable and never fails. It's a standalone device (or max with another BL5 for communication).
I do not agree the comparison with BL8000 and Penta, which hardly fail either. (I know BL8000 with foam issues..). If it fails it will be due to common known reasons which occur in lots of other devices.
Thing is that designs of the past has changed, specially the power supply's in a lot of devices. Think of all the small regulators that come with your phone, settopbox, you name it. These converters are relative new when you compare that with the old traditional power regulators that consists of only a transformer, rectifier and voltage regulator. These older regulators weren't so efficient and are by now replaced with smart switching regulators which are more efficient and smaller than the older version.
That principle of switching technology has been more and more used. The things is that these PSU's fail more than traditional regulators due to leaking capacitors (which are more stressed than in traditional power supply's) and combination of higher demands and physically smaller components.
Now has the switching technology also made it's introduction in ICE power amplifiers, where it's design is clever, small and efficient. But with regarding to the amount of power it can produce the change that it can fail lies higher than average, I think. The combination of degration of the components, level of stress they are subjected to. The reliability of these ICE power amplifiers are and will design wise improve.
A friend of mine has a set of BL5's and demoed a track of the band "Infected Mushrooms" (not my cup of thee), and I thought I saw the BL5's really moving along the floor. So, they can produce such enormous amount of music, my hearing hardly can beare.
My advise, buy them when you can and enjoy them. But don't sell your Penta's. You might regret that eventually. And when the BL5 ever might fail, even the mk1 chassis can be fixed with the newer mk3 version. No problem.
poodleboy:Probably just me, but I look at this like I would a pre-owned auto purchase. Why are they selling? History and Records, please. What could go wrong, how likely is it (anecdotal evidence is sketchy), and how much will that cost? It is happens to one, should I repair them both? Will your expectations outlive the parts supply chain? Can I accept all that should it happen? What can I do to protect them? Hook them up to surge protector so spikes are minimised (known to break down circuits over time). Don't run them at "11". Buy where you have some purchase protection. Buy from a friend. There is a reason resale pricing on luxury motors falls off the cliff and fancy jewelry does not, and electronics are more like cars than cars are. But you can't beat the ride.
Beovision 7-55 MK1 red, Beolab 10 red. Beolab 50, all black. Beolab 17 broken ice. Beolab transmitter. Apple tv4 and apple express 2.
BeoLab 9's tend to eat tweeters, but in fairness that's a lot cheaper than replacing a chassis on a BeoLab 5.
As for as BeoLab 9's sounding 97% as good as BeoLab 5's. I'm afraid I will have to respectfully disagree. I'd say BeoLab 9 are about 40% as good as BeoLab 5's.
I still think Lab 5's are amazing speakers. Yes, they can go wrong - but I've not found them to be too bad over the years.
Lee
Esax: poodleboy: Probably just me, but I look at this like I would a pre-owned auto purchase. Why are they selling? History and Records, please. What could go wrong, how likely is it (anecdotal evidence is sketchy), and how much will that cost? It is happens to one, should I repair them both? Will your expectations outlive the parts supply chain? Can I accept all that should it happen? What can I do to protect them? Hook them up to surge protector so spikes are minimised (known to break down circuits over time). Don't run them at "11". Buy where you have some purchase protection. Buy from a friend. There is a reason resale pricing on luxury motors falls off the cliff and fancy jewelry does not, and electronics are more like cars than cars are. But you can't beat the ride. I’m sure they are more reliable than cars. And cars you service all the time.
poodleboy: Probably just me, but I look at this like I would a pre-owned auto purchase. Why are they selling? History and Records, please. What could go wrong, how likely is it (anecdotal evidence is sketchy), and how much will that cost? It is happens to one, should I repair them both? Will your expectations outlive the parts supply chain? Can I accept all that should it happen? What can I do to protect them? Hook them up to surge protector so spikes are minimised (known to break down circuits over time). Don't run them at "11". Buy where you have some purchase protection. Buy from a friend. There is a reason resale pricing on luxury motors falls off the cliff and fancy jewelry does not, and electronics are more like cars than cars are. But you can't beat the ride.
I’m sure they are more reliable than cars. And cars you service all the time.
Exactly! Why, last time my check engine light came on, they said no problem. They just removed and replaced the engine, transmission, and all suspension bits with a new chassis, and voila! I was on the road again!
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
9 LEE:BeoLab 9's tend to eat tweeters, but in fairness that's a lot cheaper than replacing a chassis on a BeoLab 5. As for as BeoLab 9's sounding 97% as good as BeoLab 5's. I'm afraid I will have to respectfully disagree. I'd say BeoLab 9 are about 40% as good as BeoLab 5's. I still think Lab 5's are amazing speakers. Yes, they can go wrong - but I've not found them to be too bad over the years. Lee
I have a pair of Beolab 5 final editions, and have been using them daily for TV and music for the last 4 to 5 years.
They have been faultless connected to my Beosound Moment, and are still wonderful sounding. I highly recommend you consider buying a used pair! I used to have an audiophile setup with a bad case of upgraditis, but with the current beolab 5 setup, I’ve finally kept the same setup for more than 3 years and am just appreciating and enjoying the music.
p.s.: I’ve also bought cables from Steve :)
Beolab 5 Final Edition, Beosound Moment
vikinger: Some years ago I came across a technical article (that I can no longer find) claiming that the original BL5 microphone calibration had a notional life of about 200 uses, but that owners often liked to demonstrate the calibration to visitors to the extent that the mechanisms often suffered premature failure. Apparently B&O thought that calibration would only ever take place a handful of times.
Worst thing I ever did: calibrate the BL5. They were never the same again! When they first shipped they sounded fantastic, but as my (large) apartment has wooden flooring and sash windows, decided to calibrate after 2 months. It was almost as if someone removed the bass overnight. Incredible difference.
BL5s sound amazing when they aren't calibrated, but not sure I'd recommend them. I kept mine for 6 months, someone came along and offered a decent price and I had no hesitation selling them on. Great decision.
The idea of owning BL5 is more fantastical than actually using them. And unless you have a HUGE space and no neighbours, what's the point? I had enough complaints from my BL2.
Steve, my experience with B&O hardware that they produced for a long period is that they would fix the problem without advertising the fix. In my case, both my original BL6000 and BL8000 suffered from woofer surround failure within 4-5 years. I then ended up with newer versions of the same speakers and they have worked well for 10 years and I use them every single day at all volumes. They are better made. I am assuming that if the chassis failure was common in the first gen BL5, it is likely B&O fixed them to be more reliable.
In addition to the Beolabs above, I even went from a 1st gen H9 headphone to the current gen 3. There is no comparison, the 3rd gen is way better in every way.
If I were you, I’d buy a newer BL5 in a heart beat from a reliable source. My 2 cents worth 🙂
B&O in my life 😊:
Mikipidia:You could always do the cup trick when calibrating them
You can also just reset the calibration to factory default and not use it... But the leds will blink all the time.
Or as I said in another thread, you can (actually, you should !) just add an external DSP for room correction (like there is in BL50 and BL90) and enjoy the best sound you can get from these absolutely amazing Beolab 5:
https://archivedforum2.beoworld.org/forums/p/41838/305548.aspx#305548
oli:You can also just reset the calibration to factory default and not use it... But the leds will blink all the time.Or as I said in another thread, you can (actually, you should !) just add an external DSP for room correction (like there is in BL50 and BL90) and enjoy the best sound you can get from these absolutely amazing Beolab 5: https://archivedforum2.beoworld.org/forums/p/41838/305548.aspx#305548