ARCHIVED FORUM -- March 2012 to February 2022READ ONLY FORUM
This is the second Archived Forum which was active between 1st March 2012 and 23rd February 2022
beolion: Video: BV11 and BV7-55. BV11 does look very good, have a great picture and sound and very nice features.BV7-55 is for me THE B&O product, it is much more than a TV, for me it defines the design of B&O. Speakers: BL5 and BL3 BL5 is what we want, but dont have the money. BL3 is design wise very special and does sound really good. I do have the BL3 and BL9, and to the BL9 I must say that it is amazing how much power such relative small speakers have. It is very difficult to make iconic speaker like the BL8000's and include the ALT technology. BL8000 is an design icon, but I do not really like the sound that much.
Video: BV11 and BV7-55.
BV11 does look very good, have a great picture and sound and very nice features.BV7-55 is for me THE B&O product, it is much more than a TV, for me it defines the design of B&O.
Speakers: BL5 and BL3
BL5 is what we want, but dont have the money. BL3 is design wise very special and does sound really good. I do have the BL3 and BL9, and to the BL9 I must say that it is amazing how much power such relative small speakers have. It is very difficult to make iconic speaker like the BL8000's and include the ALT technology. BL8000 is an design icon, but I do not really like the sound that much.
Me too. But please do look up on both BMR (http://cotswoldsoundsystems.com) used in Naim and the LAT bass technology now temporary put on hold by Tymphany till the market is ready (http://www.d-s-t.com.au/LAT/) and you will realize that the technologies are there for a loudspeaker with a form similar to the lab8000s to far exceed the performance of The Lab9s - way more ideal and seamless polar response from the lowest mids to the top from a single driver basically a better and far cheaper alternative to the ALT lens coupled with lightning speed powerful bass reproduction .
In fact B&O can charge me double the amount of the Lab9s with a form similar to the Lab8000s if they have those technologies well implemented and included together with their top of the line third generation Ice Amps of course. Trust me the third generation amps are technologically way more superior and better sounding than its predecessors. The high distortions that used to be present in the high frequencies are more than halved and it is now available fully balanced but if they can debut an even higher calibre Icepower module similar to that or surpasses that of the Hypex Ncore or finally deliver a state of the art direct digital amplifier topology like they proposed more than a decade ago then we say B&O is at the forefront of Audio technologies that WORK.
Be the first and the best!
I am crossing my fingers on that. I can finally say goodbye to loudspeakers that take up more real estate than necessary. Most affluent people stay in prime districts that are in excess of tens of thousands per SQF so....
Is someone going to do something about this troll, and his obvious copy/pasting of marketing material without any critical thoughts of his own?
Electrified: Is someone going to do something about this ............
Is someone going to do something about this ............
Reminder.....
The original post asks you to choose one product.
There is no need for endless friction concerning anything else.
Graham
Edit
Why dont you keep on topic WonderfulE, or start a separate thread? This thread should be a straight forward product list with reasons for choice.
Electrified: Is someone going to do something about this troll, and his obvious copy/pasting of marketing material without any critical thoughts of his own?
Please don't dismiss my thoughts without even looking into at them. B&O and several other manufacturer's latest subwoofers are based on push push technology for a reason. LAT might be in limbo but its technological advantages have already be well noted and a part of its topology has already been in widespread use.
And I know of several people in audio who are busy on perfecting on BMR already. How's flat dispersion off axis from 100hz up to 25khz at 100 degrees and beyond without the need for acoustic lenses or extra drivers not revolutionary? Explain to me.
I infer that you might not like me and might not be interested in friendly intellectual exchanges but...
vikinger: Reminder..... The original post asks you to choose one product. There is no need for endless friction concerning anything else. Graham
Fine, but I still wonder.
Hmm, I wonder what Tue would mention :-)
BEST is a relative word, BEST selling in quantities, revenue, earnings or BEST design (subjective) or BEST performance (kind of subjective).
I think it is difficult to mention just one single product. If I should, then it would be the BV7-55 for the iconic design (not like any other TV's), superb picture and sound quality.
But I could imagine that BV7-55 do not generate that much earnings for B&O.
wonderfulelectric: beolion: Video: BV11 and BV7-55. BV11 does look very good, have a great picture and sound and very nice features.BV7-55 is for me THE B&O product, it is much more than a TV, for me it defines the design of B&O. Speakers: BL5 and BL3 BL5 is what we want, but dont have the money. BL3 is design wise very special and does sound really good. I do have the BL3 and BL9, and to the BL9 I must say that it is amazing how much power such relative small speakers have. It is very difficult to make iconic speaker like the BL8000's and include the ALT technology. BL8000 is an design icon, but I do not really like the sound that much. Me too. But please do look up on both BMR (http://cotswoldsoundsystems.com) used in Naim and the LAT bass technology now temporary put on hold by Tymphany till the market is ready (http://www.d-s-t.com.au/LAT/) and you will realize that the technologies are there for a loudspeaker with a form similar to the lab8000s to far exceed the performance of The Lab9s - way more ideal and seamless polar response from the lowest mids to the top from a single driver basically a better and far cheaper alternative to the ALT lens coupled with lightning speed powerful bass reproduction . In fact B&O can charge me double the amount of the Lab9s with a form similar to the Lab8000s if they have those technologies well implemented and included together with their top of the line third generation Ice Amps of course. Trust me the third generation amps are technologically way more superior and better sounding than its predecessors. The high distortions that used to be present in the high frequencies are more than halved and it is now available fully balanced but if they can debut an even higher calibre Icepower module similar to that or surpasses that of the Hypex Ncore or finally deliver a state of the art direct digital amplifier topology like they proposed more than a decade ago then we say B&O is at the forefront of Audio technologies that WORK. Be the first and the best! I am crossing my fingers on that. I can finally say goodbye to loudspeakers that take up more real estate than necessary. Most affluent people stay in prime districts that are in excess of tens of thousands per SQF so....
I'm not sure how this relates to the OP? Again it is a rant about what you think of B&O and their speakers. I don't mind you expressing your opinions, but it gets annoying when you keep hijacking threads. Please start a new thread on the topic you wish to discuss...
Can we stay on topic?
x:________________________
The Beolit 12.
I know I will get shot down in flames for this, but having just moved house and only unpacked one rooms B&O equipment, the rest will have to wait till I build an extension and do some work on the house.
Having the Beolit 12 I am able to have music in which ever room and the sound is better than any other little speakers I have tried. It suits my purpose at the moment wonderfully and come the summer it will be used again in the garden and down on the beach.
Toby
Jonathan: wonderfulelectric: beolion: Video: BV11 and BV7-55. BV11 does look very good, have a great picture and sound and very nice features.BV7-55 is for me THE B&O product, it is much more than a TV, for me it defines the design of B&O. Speakers: BL5 and BL3 BL5 is what we want, but dont have the money. BL3 is design wise very special and does sound really good. I do have the BL3 and BL9, and to the BL9 I must say that it is amazing how much power such relative small speakers have. It is very difficult to make iconic speaker like the BL8000's and include the ALT technology. BL8000 is an design icon, but I do not really like the sound that much. Me too. But please do look up on both BMR (http://cotswoldsoundsystems.com) used in Naim and the LAT bass technology now temporary put on hold by Tymphany till the market is ready (http://www.d-s-t.com.au/LAT/) and you will realize that the technologies are there for a loudspeaker with a form similar to the lab8000s to far exceed the performance of The Lab9s - way more ideal and seamless polar response from the lowest mids to the top from a single driver basically a better and far cheaper alternative to the ALT lens coupled with lightning speed powerful bass reproduction . In fact B&O can charge me double the amount of the Lab9s with a form similar to the Lab8000s if they have those technologies well implemented and included together with their top of the line third generation Ice Amps of course. Trust me the third generation amps are technologically way more superior and better sounding than its predecessors. The high distortions that used to be present in the high frequencies are more than halved and it is now available fully balanced but if they can debut an even higher calibre Icepower module similar to that or surpasses that of the Hypex Ncore or finally deliver a state of the art direct digital amplifier topology like they proposed more than a decade ago then we say B&O is at the forefront of Audio technologies that WORK. Be the first and the best! I am crossing my fingers on that. I can finally say goodbye to loudspeakers that take up more real estate than necessary. Most affluent people stay in prime districts that are in excess of tens of thousands per SQF so.... I'm not sure how this relates to the OP? Again it is a rant about what you think of B&O and their speakers. I don't mind you expressing your opinions, but it gets annoying when you keep hijacking threads. Please start a new thread on the topic you wish to discuss... Can we stay on topic?
Are you the Forum moderator or the thread police or something. That's hilarious. Next what are you going to tell me to do?
I was simply informing the like-minded B&O follower that the technology is there for the Lab8000s to outperform the Lab9s. I like the Lab8000s too so... Excuse me. And were you the one who started the topic? Yeah.... I don't so.. Plus it wasn't remotely that all off topic. And was I ranting? What's the definition of a rant? Jeeze lighten up Jonathan.
And Jonathan the forum police I was imply trying to sneak in some constructive advice on what the Beolab 8000 replacement should be so hopefully B&O might take notice that people are willing to pay more for the Lab8000s if the performance is better. In my previous post of this thread was I ranting about the Lab8000s?
badgersurf: The Beolit 12. I know I will get shot down in flames for this, but having just moved house and only unpacked one rooms B&O equipment, the rest will have to wait till I build an extension and do some work on the house. Having the Beolit 12 I am able to have music in which ever room and the sound is better than any other little speakers I have tried. It suits my purpose at the moment wonderfully and come the summer it will be used again in the garden and down on the beach. Toby
The BeoLit12 is a unique product for sure. I like how the design is reminiscent of a picnic basket. It's very cheerfully designed. Not remotely pretentious at all.
And I will like to add that the Earset is one of the best product from B&O simply because of it's iconic design and widespread use. However, like I said before it is now way past its prime and should be retired. Hook earphones need not be that heavy anymore.
@wonderfulelectric I've been told that a column loudspeaker never can have high end specifications.
I hear you there, having just moved into a new house and not even having set up my Beo gear yet, can't until I get the living room roof leaks fixed and repainted. I an using my iPod in an old, but decent sounding, Klipsch dock. I have gear to Beolink most of the house but I'm stuck in limbo until I get the main system up.
Jeff
I'm afraid I'm recovering from the BeoVirus.
Before I utter my opinion to the best product I comment on your best piece of B&O equipment. You found your best piece because it is the best for your individual demand. In this way the BeoLIt 12 even beats a pair of BeoLab 5 ...
My choice: Speaker: BeoLab 9 (Beolab 5 would be more than I can appreciate in my little living room), but up to now I've got a combo of BeoVox Penta an BeoLab 4000 in a surround setup.
TV: BV 12 65" for its looks
Telephone: BeoCom 5 for its speakerphone (but the telephone keyboard should get an improvement)
Maybe some other commentators in this thread should consider that there are individual ways of appreciation of the same matter ...
(In German: Wat dem eenen sin Uhl is dem andern sin Nachtigall)
Unfortunately not.
Beosound Stage, Beovision 8-40, Beolit 20, Beosound Explore.
koning: @wonderfulelectric I've been told that a column loudspeaker never can have high end specifications.
Oh no! Officially?
You are some kind of insider aren't you? I shall not probe further least you lose your job.
No insider and i don't lose my job.
I was only curious about your answer because your the expert!
BS9000, BC6, BC2, BL3, BL11, BL3500, BL2000, BeoTime, Beo EarSet2 3i, Beo, BEO DropStop, BEO Bottle Opener, BeoCom5 including Table Stand, ATV
Christmas Prize Draw 1st Winner 2010 - THANKS A LOT!!!
Struer Trip 2012 - THANKS A LOT!!!
Beste Grüße / Best regards
Schlaumeier
Setup Livingroom: BeoVision 10-40 and 10-32, BeoLab 6000 front, BeoLab 4000 rear, BeoLab 11, Ouverture, Apple TV 2 & 4, Airport Express, 6 x LC2.
Other Rooms: 3 x BeoSound 8, BeoVision 8-26, MX 4002, 2 x Keyring, 2 x Beolit 15, A1, Airport Express, 4 x Beo4, 2 x Beocom 5
self edited
iPoditiv: Telephone: BeoCom 5 for its speakerphone (but the telephone keyboard should get an improvement) Maybe some other commentators in this thread should consider that there are individual ways of appreciation of the same matter ...
I'm guessing or assuming you only use the BeoCom 5 for the occasional call? We use them in our office and have had four models so far (two replacements) and each one loses the connection to the base, despite the base being only metres away, often resets mid call, with the caller hearing screeching noises and this can happen reasonably frequently. B&O have never solved the problem(s).
Sure, they look amazing, but if you use them frequently like we do, they are incredibly poorly implemented. We get those phone crashes/screeches at least once a week and twice when we've been on important international conference calls!
Yes I agree they look great and could be be regarded as B&O's best phones....if only they worked properly and consistently. I have BeoCom 2's at home and they never experience these issues.
Moxxey have you send beocare an email about this BIG problem.
koning: No insider and i don't lose my job. I was only curious about your answer because your the expert!
Oh Jee... Thanks!
I however foresee a complete replacement of the Lab5s, 9s and 3s with more sculptural full metal pieces. The designs are already dated by current standards and I don't mean technologically. The black and aluminum industrial aesthetics? Outdone by B&W already. BTW I was all for their designs upon their releases but they are not very up to par with their price tag IMHO by today's standards. I guess full aluminum is the way to go but do shake off the 90s sleek aesthetic and go edgy instead. I would have gotten the Beolab12-3 if not for the fact that they are meant for up against the wall only and the 2 inch upper bass midrange is obviously style over substance and only done for the sake of blending with the ALT lenses perfectly.
And I mention yet again that if B&O don't jump on the BMR bandwagon asap. The lenses will just appear superfluous and gimmicky in a very short time.
As for the bass sections sure B&O can continue with using the push push bass configuration in the latest subwoofer range that was LAT inspired in the first place or just go for the real thing instead. Maybe the whole audio industry has boycotted against it and that is why Tymphany has put LAT in hibernation? But I am sure B&O is fully capable of bringing it back from limbo. Why settle for more expensive and less performing alternatives instead when you can go for the real deal.
OMG.... This will be the perfect launching platform for B&O to debut their Icepower equivalent of Hypex Ncore modules. Fully refined LAT + BMR plus no compromise Icepower in sculptural lightweight aluminum. That will be an all assault approach for you. All in one loudspeakers are the future no use in investing head units anymore. Nerds are the people who command the most income nowadays and it is chic to be kinda nerdy now so why not make a range of no-compromise style loudspeakers for them? In this new technological advanced age, the general public are so used to scrutinizing the internals of an electronic so I guess the best form of marketing is in fact delivering more for more?
And replace the Earset already! It is long overdue for a successor! I want B&O to offer be $500- $1000 phones that I have been buying from Shure, Sennheiser and AKG. Introduce a whole range of earphones! I have went through 3-4 pairs of earsets from the year it was introduced to 2003 so that says something about it's usability. The earsets are iconic designs that are now way over their prime. I think Apple stores don't carry them anymore for a reason. LOL I still remember spotting the earsets in so many Sci-fi movies.
wonderfulelectric:I however foresee a complete replacement of the Lab5s, 9s and 3s with more sculptural full metal pieces.
Thanks for your prophecy, but no thanks. And certainly no thanks for the so called BMR drivers. Buy them and your permanently updated external DAC’s, external amps and external whatsoever elsewhere and get happy. What you obviously want is a renaissance of the late seventies and early eighties with speakers like the Technics SB-10 or the Sony APM-8, everything external, tons of cables, endless snake oil technologies. Things like plasma or electrostatic speakers come and go, B&O stays. B&O is not about so called state-of-the-art technology, it’s a concept, a philosophy. If you don’t want it, don’t buy it. I’m so tired of the absolute innovation obsession, we already had those ridiculous technology chases decades ago, all the companies participating vanished one after another with very few exceptions like Accuphase and Burmester perhaps. But have you ever spoken with owners of their products? Most definitely not from this world or even human, must have bat ears and Carlos Slim Helu bank accounts. B&O was different then and will be different in the future – it’s obviously not a company for you, no BMR drivers, no external DAC’s etc. but simple, functional, integrated and compatible to a modern interior design with furniture from companies like Artemide, B&B, Flos, Knoll, USM, Vitra etc.
The designs are already dated by current standards and I don't mean technologically. The black and aluminum industrial aesthetics? Outdone by B&W already. BTW I was all for their designs upon their releases but they are not very up to par with their price tag IMHO by today's standards. I guess full aluminum is the way to go but do shake off the 90s sleek aesthetic and go edgy instead. I would have gotten the Beolab12-3 if not for the fact that they are meant for up against the wall only and the 2 inch upper bass midrange is obviously style over substance and only done for the sake of blending with the ALT lenses perfectly.
Outdone by who? Bowers & Wilkins? Are we talking about the "Made in China" iPod accessories company which did/does perversions like the Nautilus? Who besides Poseidon himself would like to have such things in his house?
No problem for me and certainly even less for B&O.
B&O neither are doing such kind of products nor will they ever do. Just take a look at their history, they never sold any snake oil.
Nerds never do invest any money in anything expensive or even useful. Have you ever visited a nerd? Their apartments look like those of children refusing to grow up, places full of cheap technology trash, gadgets, gimmicks. You cannot be serious about what you say.
So your argument is that only things can be good that are sold by the Apple Store? Life must be easy for you.
Oh, I thought we were ignoring him
MartinW:Maclife - thank you for saying everything I have wanted to say but couldn't be arsed to! Praise you!!!
+1
and this goes for the others that have taken their time to be a counterpart to all the nonsense taking up too much space on the forum lately.
I could have written something directly by myself, but would probably be too harsh since English is not my first language
PS. it should be okay to discuss other peoples opinion in a thread like this (it is a discussion forum), but then quite short and on topic i.e. the opinion in concern
Electrified: Oh, I thought we were ignoring him
sorry, I will follow your example from now on
and on topic: Beo4!
I'm trying to do as much as possible to not use any other remote at home, it is brilliant, and while new universal remotes tend to use touch displays, the Beo4 can be controlled in the dark (or in daylight without watching where you put your thumb)
I can't say it's the BEST that B&O offer but I do love my V1-40. It suits the apartment and I am leveraging almost every bit of functionality it offers.
I think maclife summarizes what I find best about B&O, high performance, musical and listenable, i.e. no listener fatigue, beautiful, timeless designs that are well integrated and easy to use. Too much high end audio requires you to be an acolyte, cleaning the altar and polishing the chalices instead of having the technology service you, you service it. There are people who value this obviously, I think the reason these types play the constant tweak game is for the most part the lack of turntables and records removed a ritual that made them feel like they were participating in the process, whereas a B&O owner just wants good music when they want it with minimal fuss. I used to be the former, now after maturing a little I find I'm definitely the latter.
moxxey: Sure, they look amazing, but if you use them frequently like we do, they are incredibly poorly implemented. We get those phone crashes/screeches at least once a week and twice when we've been on important international conference calls! Yes I agree they look great and could be be regarded as B&O's best phones....if only they worked properly and consistently. I have BeoCom 2's at home and they never experience these issues.
I suffered the screeching breakdown only in the first months two or three times. The last screech happened in 2010 ...
With the best hopes for your insulted ears' future
I would say BL3, small with a big sound, affordable and will work for a long time.
koning: Moxxey have you send beocare an email about this BIG problem.
The fact my dealer replaced the phones twice, answers everything. No point emailing Beocare. I go via my dealer. It's up to them to solve the problem (or not).
The latest Software for a couple of months is still 2.4, i don't think they gonna fix this.
jkhamler: I can't say it's the BEST that B&O offer but I do love my V1-40. It suits the apartment and I am leveraging almost every bit of functionality it offers.
I agree. Also very happy with my V1-40.
maclife: As for the bass sections sure B&O can continue with using the push push bass configuration in the latest subwoofer range that was LAT inspired in the first place or just go for the real thing instead. Maybe the whole audio industry has boycotted against it and that is why Tymphany has put LAT in hibernation? But I am sure B&O is fully capable of bringing it back from limbo. Why settle for more expensive and less performing alternatives instead when you can go for the real deal. B&O neither are doing such kind of products nor will they ever do. Just take a look at their history, they never sold any snake oil.
LOL. Why are the latest B&O subwoofers in push push configuration then? The LAT subwoofer basically predates most push push subwoofer topologies out there. It was invented way back in 2003. LAT is way more compact in form and practical than all of the imitations out there. Did you bother to read up before dishing out such harsh comments?
I didn't mention about external amps or dac. I did mention about plugin modules however.
Notice that the connection jacks of the Beolab 12 series have already been updated with the RJ45 and so have the outputs of the Playmaker? It doesn't take a genius to know that there will be an overhaul coming.
You must be a die hard fan of the B&O status quo. Because B&O used to make separates.
And I did mention somewhere that I think B&O products should be even more integrated than ever right? Like eliminating the head units altogether. That's where the Hifi market is heading and plenty of audiophiles in the audiogon forums are really excited about this too.
When I was mentioning about B&W I was mentioning about their Air range. Fabric covers with aluminum finishes? Designed aesthetically to an even higher standard than some of the speakers in the old ALT lens range no? I remember learning that a very renowned designer designed the range. I was frankly astonished by the level of detail. I didn't know B&W had it in them. As for being made in China I have no idea. I have not bought a single B&W product as of now. I heard my sister's Zeppellin and I frankly hated the sound.
As for my urge for B&O to offer luxury headphones is so that I can buy high performance headphones from B&O instead of hunting from some other brands. I am putting in advice. Have you tried the Klipsch X10s? Incredible light, well-built, out of this world performance from a earbud that small. I believe in form following function so if the form meaning the heavy hook design of the earset not being able to compete in acoustically and ergonomically to something much smaller and lighter then I will say it is time for a replacement. You do know that design awards are judged on use,function and performance right?
And thus the ALT lenses must go sooner rather than later because the design will very quickly serve as a hindrance to good design. Meaning if the BMR drivers take over the market like a storm which is rather inevitable, the lenses will no longer be exclusive in terms of being able to disperse sound widely because BMR can do that in a way compact form the upper bass all the way up to the highest high, and I must add that the BMR technology is still in its infancy. Pus B&O isn't exactly the pioneer in the use of acoustic lenses so why hold on to them? Elipson just held a special auction on its vintage range of spherical loudspeakers that are loaded with acoustic lenses.
I did mention in my previous post that B&O should not phase out the Lab8000s or 6000s but instead revise them to true reference iconic speakers instead like Flos lamps or Cassina furniture. Maybe you didn't read my posts. And you like Knoll really? I thought they are a little too meant for commercial spaces looking.
I think there might have been some miscommunication. Maybe I did not put my ideas across well enough.
The BMR predates a design seen since at least the 1960's...priceless!
Jeff: The BMR predates a design seen since at least the 1960's...priceless!
I know right?! It is finally being perfected! it works a little like the extremely costly Manger driver except much smoother in frequency response and way wider in dispersion. Might be slower in impulse as compared to the Manger though not sure.
But isn't ultimate performance what we are aiming for here and not when the technology is invented? Besides what can really be invented in a world that is unknowingly old?
What I am trying to get is that once BMR is popularized it will immediately undermine the case for expensive ALT lenses. And that will not be good marketing at all.... Better for B&O to discontinue and move on before that happens. Unless B&O can come up with a better solution that is. I heard a bird telling me that a new flat full range driver with wide dispersion is about to be launched as we speak. Clue: Anthony Gallo.
Flat drivers = Almost flat phase throughout operating range.
MartinW:Can somebody please for f*£&'s sake just add a line of code to this forum that automatically deletes posts that contain the terms LAT and BMR? I am so sick of every single topic ending up talking about technologies that only WE is even vaguely interested in...PLEASE!!!!
Sorry to go off topic....
Beoworld was starting to get good again, now we're going back to hijacked threads and people getting angry again. It ruins Beoworld for everyone.