New products in the next 6-12 months

@elephant:

No hard feelings - AT ALL

MM

Apparently thanks to the new H265 codec we will be able to enjoy 4k video @ a very low 20 mb/sec speed ! I was staggered when I read about it , but looks like it;s coming sooner than we think...

:-

"What this really enables, though, is for an actual path for 4K video to be delivered to people's TVs and tablets. So, now that we know it can be done for about 10Mbps, delivering 4K to someone's TV in their home shouldn't be that difficult. It can be done over IPTV or even over traditional cable, if the cable provider is capable. The real truth is that 10Mbps 4K video playback is a huge deal and paves the way for content providers to begin preparing their content for H.265 delivery and streaming to people's homes so that 4K TVs actually have content to play back. Not to mention, a Blu-Ray disc can actually fit a 4K movie on it no problem, which means that physical media isn't quite dead yet. However, 10Mbps 4K does mean that you can fit 4K movies in to a relatively small file size than what a RAW 4K video file would deliver into the terabytes."

 

What worries me about the introduction of 4k through these early years is that we end up being, to an extent, conned by the first generations of sets. Right now the sets on the market claiming 4k only actually meet the resolution criteria. In reality 4k will be also heavily about other factors that improve picture quality - but as yet there is no established standard. HDMI2 sockets have, for example, been proposed as the required connection - but no TV has this yet.

Have a read of this link...

http://m.techradar.com/news/television/bbc-and-sky-will-break-bread-to-outline-merits-of-the-ultra-hd-future-1170669

Oh god , more hdmi worries.

Reminds me of the early days of scart , I had a sony profeel ages ago that was for some bizarre reason totally incompatible with anything that output a scart signal , that was supposedly future proof too.. lol

Maybe the future is something like the Apple / Intel Thunderbolt port ??

Flappo:

Maybe the future is something like the Apple / Intel Thunderbolt port ??

or USB 3.1

oh wait ... the article says Thunderbolt is then going to double to 20Gbps this year

it looks like WISA can easily be setup to drive 8 mono speakers in eight different rooms, or drive stereo into 4 rooms, so indeed a very interesting technology on the rainbow :-)

What if WiSA-compliant transmitters were built into DJ mixers and musical keyboards?

By Paul Konikowski, CTS-D, LEED Green Associate

The Wireless Speaker and Audio (WiSA™) Association and its Members are quickly becoming the new wireless standard for high-definition digital surround sound audio. The technology is designed to be incorporated into transmitting devices such as HDTVs, Blu-ray disc players, gaming consoles, set-top boxes, AVRs, and of course, speakers. Members of the WiSA Association include Sharp, Klipsch, Martin Logan, Polk Audio, Pioneer, Paradigm, Definitive Technology, Meiloon, Nyne, Gibson, Dali, Onkyo, Gibson, Summit Semiconductor, Silicon Image, Amber Technologies, Hansong, GGEC. Together, these manufacturers have agreed to use the same WiSA certification test specification and interoperability standard, which allows users to mix and match their favorite audio and video brands when they see the WiSA logo. For more information, please visit www.wisaassociation.org

Thus far, the WiSA-enabled products and prototypes have targeted consumers and residential applications. But just recently, Summit Semiconductor, a WiSA advisory board member company, started delivering RF modules for professional wireless audio applications. This got me thinking about live events and concerts…weddings… DJs…. which lead me to wonder… what if WiSA-compliant transmitters were built into DJ mixers and keyboards?

The standard WiSA-compliant transmitter sends 8 channels of uncompressed, 24-bit digital audio to 8 self-powered speakers. Usually, that equals a 7.1 surround sound mix, or some smaller portion thereof. But, there is nothing in the specification that says a compliant transmitter has to transmit surround sound audio. It could also transmit mono audio to 8 speakers, or stereo audio (left and right), sending the left or right channel to four pairs of speakers. As long as the receivers (normally in the powered speakers) fall within the minimum transmission range (30 feet) of the WiSA Compliance Test Specification (CTS), then the system is guaranteed to work. Longer distances are possible, if the signal was boosted, but the specification is certified to a minimum of 30 feet.

Let’s look at our typical DJ setup at a wedding or club. The DJ plugs all of his or her music sources (CD players, laptop, iPhone, or if you are really lucky: actual record turntables) into their DJ mixer, where they mix the various music sources and adjust the equalization settings, filtering out or boosting different frequency bands to give a live performance aspect (“performance” definitely a stretch of the word for some DJs who usually just push play on their laptop, but I digress). So anyway, this DJ mixer mixes all of the sources into a main mono or stereo mix for the dance floor. There are also auxiliary outputs on the DJ mixer for headphones and recording; oftentimes if the DJ is famous, their set is made into a CD or MP3 track and released on the internet.

Most DJ mixers also have at least one wired microphone input so various people can make announcements, tell the crowd to put their hands up, and generally makes their voices heard over the music. Oftentimes, wireless microphones are used, especially at weddings, where lots of speeches are made. Other times, a keyboardist may be hired to play for the cocktail hour, and a microphone may be needed for announcements. Although the music may be very different, the audio signal flow diagram for both scenarios (DJ or Keyboardist) is very similar, and can be simplified into something like this:

Now, if the sound system depicted in the above diagram was instead a WiSA enabled system, the audio signal path is essentially the same, except the amps and speaker wires are replaced with powered speakers and a digital wireless link:

This wireless link to the speakers gives great flexibility to the event planner. In the past, if the client wanted to have the speakers setup around the pool, the DJ also needed to be out by the pool. But now, the DJ can be on the balcony, or even the rooftop. You can have one or two speakers for the DJ and the rest you can place wherever you like.

For the keyboardist playing during a cocktail hour between a wedding and the dinner reception, you could setup two wireless speakers in the lobby, one speaker on the patio, one speaker in the foyer, and another wireless speaker in the bridal party suite, so they don’t miss anything.

Boat parties would be incredibly easier with wireless speakers, as would flash mobs, fundraisers, and fashion shows, where inevitably, someone always ask you to move your speakers at the very last minute. Well with WiSA, you can easily move your speakers and reconfigure the system instantly, adjusting volume levels and delays to each speaker on the fly.

In summary, the WiSA Association definitely sees a market for wireless speakers at weddings and other parties, transmitting uncompressed, interference free HD audio that is easy to set up and easy to use. Although speaker wires may seem simple on paper, its much more difficult at a formal event, where you often have to tape the wires to avoid trip hazards. Most event spaces have power outlets on every wall. Just make sure you bring a few nice extension cords, some gaff tape, and those “triple taps”, that turn one AC outlet into three.

If you have any questions, please feel free to email me, Paul Konikowski at pkoniko@wisaassociation.org

You should also download the whitepaper from the wisaassociation.org website:

Missing something?

MM

Yea I am missing the output for the projector as I see that as an important thing in a complete solution, where is it?

Looks like BeoSystem 4 to me !

Peter

gyssePeter is right - it is a picture (of the connections) of the BSys4, that will be launched next week.

And emilos - welcome to BeoWorld - has already seen it.

I am missing that too - but it definitely has projector support.

So it is probably just a part of the connection panel.

Greetings Millemissen

Lets hope that there is a DVB-HD slot on the frontside

PG

Well, there is HDMI out for projectors. Or am I missing something?

PapaJustify, I think that the HDMI out is for the mainscreen, ie BV12-65.

 

Peter

I was really hoping that the Beosystem 4 had a digital out for use with the Beolab 5 (at least for one set of speakers). I don't see that on the connection panel. The signal is actually digital internally and then converted to analog. Why not provide that digital signal to feed your top of the line speaker?

Also, I am really hoping they employed a sufficient muting circuit for the powerlink outputs so that the Beosystem 4 can be used with non-B&O speakers. I have a theater room that has speakers built into the walls and thus have to use a separate power amplifier to power those speakers (because B&O doesn't offer standalone amplifiers with a sufficient amount of power for such applications). When I tried to use the Beoystem 3 (at least the one I tried), it would produce a loud sound whenever sources were switched. It was annoying to the point that I had to get rid of the Beosystem 3 and use another device. Hopefully I'll be able to use the Beosystem 4. Incidentally, the Beosystem 1 did not have this issue.

gysse2004:

PapaJustify, I think that the HDMI out is for the mainscreen, ie BV12-65.

I see, the BS3 has two HDMI-out. That is indeed curious. You can still connect a projector on it, instead of a screen, no dual-screen setups though. Shame!

Does anybody know when the BS4 is coming out? Can't be too far away with it popping up in the retailer system.

Maybe they will tell customers to buy a HDMI 1x2 splitter... But I cannot see a "projector control" output either...

PapaJustify:

Does anybody know when the BS4 is coming out? Can't be too far away with it popping up in the retailer system.

According to the rumor the new B&O BeoVision 12 will be unveiled on August 14th, 2013. Including the BeoSystem 4. Prices from 13,995 euro.

Not for me, but good to see a nice constant pace to the update of current gear and deliver of the new

Beophile:

I was really hoping that the Beosystem 4 had a digital out for use with the Beolab 5 (at least for one set of speakers). I don't see that on the connection panel. The signal is actually digital internally and then converted to analog. Why not provide that digital signal to feed your top of the line speaker?

Also, I am really hoping they employed a sufficient muting circuit for the powerlink outputs so that the Beosystem 4 can be used with non-B&O speakers. I have a theater room that has speakers built into the walls and thus have to use a separate power amplifier to power those speakers (because B&O doesn't offer standalone amplifiers with a sufficient amount of power for such applications). When I tried to use the Beoystem 3 (at least the one I tried), it would produce a loud sound whenever sources were switched. It was annoying to the point that I had to get rid of the Beosystem 3 and use another device. Hopefully I'll be able to use the Beosystem 4. Incidentally, the Beosystem 1 did not have this issue.

I believe this issue is resolved as long as you use the fully wired 8 core powerlink cables. We recently completed a small cinema room where a BSys3 was connected via PowerLink to two ML/MCL convertors that were powering some Tannoy passive speakers front and rear and it worked great - no noises, and sounded very pleasing!

mbee:

Maybe they will tell customers to buy a HDMI 1x2 splitter... But I cannot see a "projector control" output either...

diisign.com

The projector control on BSys3 was called IR 1+2. I believe there is a similar socket on the BSys4. Bottom line is there will be dual screen support soon after launch, and yes it will be via a recommended HDMI splitter using some on board PUC control I believe.

MM

Sorry - picture will not upload. Will have to wait --- good night!

MartinW:

mbee:

Maybe they will tell customers to buy a HDMI 1x2 splitter... But I cannot see a "projector control" output either...

diisign.com

The projector control on BSys3 was called IR 1+2. I believe there is a similar socket on the BSys4. Bottom line is there will be dual screen support soon after launch, and yes it will be via a recommended HDMI splitter using some on board PUC control I believe.

MM

MartinW:

Beophile:

 

I was really hoping that the Beosystem 4 had a digital out for use with the Beolab 5 (at least for one set of speakers). I don't see that on the connection panel. The signal is actually digital internally and then converted to analog. Why not provide that digital signal to feed your top of the line speaker?

 

Also, I am really hoping they employed a sufficient muting circuit for the powerlink outputs so that the Beosystem 4 can be used with non-B&O speakers. I have a theater room that has speakers built into the walls and thus have to use a separate power amplifier to power those speakers (because B&O doesn't offer standalone amplifiers with a sufficient amount of power for such applications). When I tried to use the Beoystem 3 (at least the one I tried), it would produce a loud sound whenever sources were switched. It was annoying to the point that I had to get rid of the Beosystem 3 and use another device. Hopefully I'll be able to use the Beosystem 4. Incidentally, the Beosystem 1 did not have this issue.

 

 

I believe this issue is resolved as long as you use the fully wired 8 core powerlink cables. We recently completed a small cinema room where a BSys3 was connected via PowerLink to two ML/MCL convertors that were powering some Tannoy passive speakers front and rear and it worked great - no noises, and sounded very pleasing!

But that's PowerLink to an ML/MCL convertor.  I was talking about  PowerLink to an RCA adapter to another brand's amplifier.  The ML/MCL convertor (or amplifier used in the passive kit) is fine for little speakers but is simply underpowered for large home theater installations.

 

MartinW:

mbee:

 

Maybe they will tell customers to buy a HDMI 1x2 splitter... But I cannot see a "projector control" output either...

 

diisign.com

 

 

The projector control on BSys3 was called IR 1+2. I believe there is a similar socket on the BSys4. Bottom line is there will be dual screen support soon after launch, and yes it will be via a recommended HDMI splitter using some on board PUC control I believe.

Please tell me this is a joke. The Beosystem 4 isn't even out yet and already they are adding external devices to add features the system is lacking. This is not promising. And if that is all they are doing, why does is take several months to add the IR codes for an HDMI switch.

Beophile:

Please tell me this is a joke. The Beosystem 4 isn't even out yet and already they are adding external devices to add features the system is lacking. This is not promising. And if that is all they are doing, why does is take several months to add the IR codes for an HDMI switch.

This looks like a joke : they are able to create a very large switch for inputs and for output, they don't know how to make 2 mirrored HDMI outputs? Having to add a second box and its power supply from the beginning looks like a huge design flaw.

I hope it's not the case and the projector HDMI is hidden somewhere on the device, because having to connect an Atlona switch or equivalent with PUC control looks like what I've done with my BV8, which is not advertised as projector output capable...

it reminds me the launch of the BS5 Encore, when B&O clearly wrote that it was compatible whith Airplay*

*by connecting an airport express to the Aux input!!!

Hi mbee,

and if it is so - why not???

I don't see why we should pay for a built in feature, that many people won't use anyway!

If you need a projector, just add the switch (and pay for it) - what is the fuss about that?

I have seen lots of BSys3's with an unused second monItor out connection. People payed for something they never used.

Greetings Millemissen

I can see your side MM, but I just don't agree in 2013 a system like that should at least have 2 HDMI outputs, many today have three it is just not good enough if the case is that it only have 1 output...

1. I think that the majority of Bs3/4 buyers have or will have a video projector. But I can be wrong.

2. We are speaking of a double HDMI output, which cost less than 10€ to add to the final product. Saying that people don't want to pay for this is like saying that people don't want to pay for the headphone out of their Beosound. Cheap, invisible, and can be used sometimes...

Following this thread I can see both sides of the argument but connection wise I do agree it should have an output for for the projector still can't see any toslink connections if pioneer can produce an av amp with twin hdmi output being able to view hd picture in two rooms at the same time have airplay and can be controlled by either remote apple device or android for £550 then they need to look at this. Yes the b & I should be better but to not have some connections that have been out for may years does seen some what short sighted.

Hi mbee - hi kai,

I don't know the reasons for the choises made in Struer - and I don't even know if it is there - but not shown in the picture I provided.

MartinW gave the info about the 'switch to be used' - maybe he knows more by now?

I just tried to understand if it might be possible...

I wouldn't miss it - and for the majority of what I have seen in Denmark (this also goes for the BV7 later versions) only a few use this feature. 

Please note that if they are going the 'switch way', it would be a solution that could be used with the BV11 as well - it would only be a matter of software updating. Would be a nice option for BV11 owners!

Just take a look at the connection panel of the BV11.

I am quite sure that they in Struer know what a Pioneer and co device can do - but I am also sure that they have one or more reasons not to do it the same way.

Would be nice - though - to learn a bit more about those reasons!

Greetings Millemissen

 

Hi Millemissen,

you're right about the fact that BV7/4/12 owners have usually just bought a TV and not many of them use the projector out.

What I was saying was that a lot of BS3 "alone" buyers were using it. Remember the launch of the BS3 : the ability to have a projector screen in an other wall than the TV and to "turn" the sound around the Beolabs accordingly was something stunning, a nice feature for a lot of people that doesn't want a separate movie room but want a design living room with a hidden cinema inside ;-)

Even if you're not using it, it's impressive and gives a good feel about the product. A real marketing feature ;-)

That's really a strange decision. It's really like removing the headphone jack out of a Beosound to me, no impact on price (as the software development and connections are still there to pilot the switch), and it creates a small "cables+power supply" mess at the back of the Beosystem/Beovision...

Maybe this move is like the one B&O did with the Playmaker MKII : removing FLAC support, because "everybody plays MP3"...

MM When you say the BV11 that it could work on that, will it then also work on V1 because then it have my interest :D

I am not saying that it will work - or when.

But have the look at the connection panel - there are several RJ45-inputs 'for future use'.

I must admit tat the HDMI out is missing (might be hidden).

You can't find the 'for future use' connections on the V1 - so don't have any hope there.

Maybe I am just dreaming - we will see.

MM

BV11 and V1 have no HDMI out ports, so I wouldn't expect support for multiple displays for these two in the future.

I don't know if I agree with the a lot of "alone" buyers are using it. As a person who has sold BS3 since it's launch I have to say a fraction of a fraction of people I know use the 2 display setup.... at least in my markets. I do agree that it should have been marketed more as I'm sure if people really knew the full potential of such a setup they would surely use it more. A shame at the end of the day. 

While I agree that having such a feature is an added benefit, there is more involved behind scenes to have a 2 display support beyond the simply add a socket for $10. Much more. And sure the spec's may look that much better when totally integrated, but the price will have to go up with the addition of integrating the feature. It may be real cool for a select few, the fact of the matter is the usage isn't there I'm sure to justify it. I'm not sure that 95% should suffer an increase in cost when only 5% use it. 

I have found the stand alone buyers are usually integrating non-B&o equipment because of other product preference, lack of perceived value in the whole B&O setup (i.e. I'm not paying xxxxx for that screen, when I have the new Kuro etc.), integration of legacy of B&O equipment all ready owned, or are doing it in smaller steps due to budget/price. In the very beginning it was for the PUC control as Crestron etc., were pricey back then and few companies were controlling B&O and non-B&O at the same time, obviously that has changed dramatically over the years.

Exciting times ahead either way with the launch of the product!!

 

Oh, I'm pretty certain that the drop in FLAC support was not a B&O decision, but a decision of the chip manufacture they source from. 

 

 

PapaJustify:

BV11 and V1 have no HDMI out ports, so I wouldn't expect support for multiple displays for these two in the future.

Hi PapaJustify,

did you read my post just above yours - obvisiously not.

MM

Beophile:

But that's PowerLink to an ML/MCL convertor. I was talking about PowerLink to an RCA adapter to another brand's amplifier. The ML/MCL convertor (or amplifier used in the passive kit) is fine for little speakers but is simply underpowered for large home theater installations .

Oh right, i didn't know there were any issues with PL to RCA?

Yes I do agree with you on the timescales. Not sure why i couldn't be splitter-ready at launch. At first I was concerned about the lack of a built in second HDMI port - until I saw the retail price - at which point I thought fair enough. Probably 0.01% of BSys4 owners will need a second output so I do now agree that it would be wrong to make the other 99.99% of people pay for hardware they don't need when a splitter wouldn't be a big deal in the scheme of things. And it is an amazing price - they have worked wonders there!

What is the UK price for Beosys4 on its own?